(DS9) Sons and Daughters

[StrangeDevice]

In-Universe: I agree with Ron Moore on the idea that families on starships was an experiment (remember, the Enterprise wasn't the only ship with them) that was started in the antebellum years that proceeded Wolf 359. The Klingons, for all intents and purposes, had been "tamed" (for the most part), the Romulans had withdrawn inward, and I make the presumption that the war with the Cardassians (which wasn't mentioned until TNG's fourth season) was in a state of détente (or at least a tense stalemate) by the time of "Encounter at Farpoint." It wasn't until the first Borg attack on Earth and eventually the conflict with the Dominion that Starfleet and the Federation finally got it through their thick skulls to remove children and non-Starfleet relatives off of starships.

Since the Federation and Starfleet both seem to put a heavy emphasis on humanitarian efforts (or whatever the word would be in the twenty-fourth century), it might've been a PR move suggested by former army brats who wanted to see whether or not a sense of familial stability could be integrated into the service. The way it's treated throughout that first season seems like it's a fairly recent idea too. It mustn't have lasted particularly long, maybe just over half a decade at most before they decided there were better (or at least, safer) ways of doing it.

[FaxModem1]

This episode always fell short for me in that long term in doesn't mean much for Worf or Alexander given the latter never shows up again after 6x07, and it feeling like its just something for Worf to do in the DS9 occupation arc. Every time I watch Sons and Daughters I find myself wishing the secondary plot was involving the likes of maybe Sisko and Rom forming unlikely connections to Nog and Jake respectively as all four struggle with the possibility of not seeing their loved ones again. Not terribly dramatic, but would have made for a fun character piece at least.

If Alexander became more of a recurring character, the show would probably have benefited from it. Like Torres, we have a perspective that is critical of Klingon culture, while still being a part of it. This is something the franchise needed, as more often than not, they showed Klingon culture as something all Klingons are meant to follow. Seeing someone who says, "Okay, screw it, this is NOT for me." would have been refreshing. Also seeing more of Worf called out for the way he treated Alexander would have been interesting.

It would have also been an interesting dynamic to see how he interacted with Nog or Jake, as he would be the third son on the show to not follow his father's path.

[Madner Kami]

Torres isn't a good character to comment on Klingon Culture, precisely because she has no part in it, both in terms of personal ties and of where the show was playing.

[Meushell]

Worf's relationship with his son just got annoying. From TNG on, the writers didn't know what to do with poor Alexander. I wish DS9 had just brought in Alexander in another way. Have Worf mention him from time to time beforehand to indicate a relationship. Due to Alexander's rapid aging, he would have been old enough to be going to a school of his choice. He wanted to be a diplomat or some sort of peace maker, didn't he? He comes to DS9 after graduating, then leaves again to help resolve some off screen conflict between planets X and Y.

[bronnt]

Worf's relationship with his son just got annoying. From TNG on, the writers didn't know what to do with poor Alexander. I wish DS9 had just brought in Alexander in another way. Have Worf mention him from time to time beforehand to indicate a relationship. Due to Alexander's rapid aging, he would have been old enough to be going to a school of his choice. He wanted to be a diplomat or some sort of peace maker, didn't he? He comes to DS9 after graduating, then leaves again to help resolve some off screen conflict between planets X and Y.

........

[FaxModem1]

Torres isn't a good character to comment on Klingon Culture, precisely because she has no part in it, both in terms of personal ties and of where the show was playing.

Yes she is, as her mother was Klingon, and forced her to go through a lot of Klingon religious studies. This and Torres's guilt about thinking she caused her father to leave made quite a rift between them.

[bronnt]

Thread resurrected from the ashes.

I really dislike several elements of this, at least as they depict Worf. What I see happening here is that the flaws of the writers are being shoved onto the character. The writers were really uninterested in Alexander, which is why they never mentioned him when Worf showed up on DS9.

Somehow, their lack of interest in him suddenly translated into Worf's lack of interest in him. If you watch TNG, Worf supports the hell out of Alexander's choice to straddle the line between being human and being Klingon. While he doesn't always understand his son, he's often very supportive of him in the few appearances young Alexander makes. Then this episode shows up and there's a huge retcon where Worf pretends his son doesn't even exist and never mentions him to anyone. I honestly feel like it does a huge disservice to Worf, who understands humans very well since he grew up with them. Suddenly, the writers are pretending like Alexander has to pretend to be a Klingon in order to get his father to even talk to him, which is a departure from what we've seen on screen.

[FaxModem1]

Thread resurrected from the ashes.

I really dislike several elements of this, at least as they depict Worf. What I see happening here is that the flaws of the writers are being shoved onto the character. The writers were really uninterested in Alexander, which is why they never mentioned him when Worf showed up on DS9.

Somehow, their lack of interest in him suddenly translated into Worf's lack of interest in him. If you watch TNG, Worf supports the hell out of Alexander's choice to straddle the line between being human and being Klingon. While he doesn't always understand his son, he's often very supportive of him in the few appearances young Alexander makes. Then this episode shows up and there's a huge retcon where Worf pretends his son doesn't even exist and never mentions him to anyone. I honestly feel like it does a huge disservice to Worf, who understands humans very well since he grew up with them. Suddenly, the writers are pretending like Alexander has to pretend to be a Klingon in order to get his father to even talk to him, which is a departure from what we've seen on screen.

Yeah, hence the episode siding with Worf in this relationship for some reason. It's as if the writers didn't realize that a huge part of their audience might be nerds who didn't get along with their fathers for very similar reasons, and the moral they're supposed to take from this is that, "You don't measure up, and it's your fault, not your dad's."

[Sir Will]

Never did get the kids thing anyway, because sure you want your family close. But rushing them into confrontations with the Klingons, Romulans, Cardassians and Borg plus numerous others or flying into random space stuff like Nagilum really isn't a job you want when you're supposed to be defending/fixing the ship while also worrying about little Jimmy trapped on the decompressing Deck 12 or whatever.

I think the whole Galaxy-class project was a big publicity stunt of the pre-359, "we're not a military", "we don't sneak around" etc Federation and the bring the kids along, ship is like a mall aesthetic, etc was part of it. And it was a publicity stunt that failed (between the wakeup of 359, loss of the Odessy with all hands, loss of the Enterprise, etc), hence why newer ships such as the Sovereign-class and Defiant-class were more militaristic (and probably why Excellcior-class ships were still being used in mass numbers well into the Dominion War).

All hands on board but I thought they offloaded non-essential personnel before going into the gamma quadrant.

[Artabax]

Orville episode Krill

Evil aliens bring children on their Starships.
Human Heroes have a cunning plan to kill the evil Aliens, but they haven't the Heart to kill the childern. Evil Aliens can never understand why Human Heroes do NOT kill children.

Children in Spaceships in SAFE parts of Space is logical Captain.
Children in dangerous parts of Space is for the Greater Good.