American Muslims Pretty Darn Tolerant of Homosexuality

[Darth Wedgius]

Yeah, surprising thing about people, they don't conform to stereotypes.

But of course that doesn't fit in a sound bite, so scum like Geert Wilders keep using naked racism like "Their culture isn't as progressive as ours, therefore they're all cartoonishly medieval scum!" or whatever other hysterical xenophobia that buffoon likes to trot out. Hopefully that'll change soon, though.

You have a tendency to resort to straw men pretty early on.

I've found that, like Trump, Wilders is impossible to strawman because whatever I say to parody him he'll say something even crazier soon.

If this is parody and not really meant to be taken seriously, never mind,

I don't have time to search actual Geert Wilders quotes, but I think I paraphrased his rhetoric pretty well there.

He's a big fan of cultural imperialism and cultural determinism, much like Trump and the "protagonist" of Star Trek: Discovershit (no, I have neither forgiven nor forgotten that time that MIchael Burnham said that the Klingons "only understand violence" as if she were some alt-right crazy person ranting about "the Muslims" and advocating for nuking Iran on the Internet).

So it is meant to be taken seriously, but you acknowledge that you might be in error? That's fair enough, I think.

[Worffan101]

Yeah, surprising thing about people, they don't conform to stereotypes.

But of course that doesn't fit in a sound bite, so scum like Geert Wilders keep using naked racism like "Their culture isn't as progressive as ours, therefore they're all cartoonishly medieval scum!" or whatever other hysterical xenophobia that buffoon likes to trot out. Hopefully that'll change soon, though.

You have a tendency to resort to straw men pretty early on.

I've found that, like Trump, Wilders is impossible to strawman because whatever I say to parody him he'll say something even crazier soon.

If this is parody and not really meant to be taken seriously, never mind,

I don't have time to search actual Geert Wilders quotes, but I think I paraphrased his rhetoric pretty well there.

He's a big fan of cultural imperialism and cultural determinism, much like Trump and the "protagonist" of Star Trek: Discovershit (no, I have neither forgiven nor forgotten that time that MIchael Burnham said that the Klingons "only understand violence" as if she were some alt-right crazy person ranting about "the Muslims" and advocating for nuking Iran on the Internet).

So it is meant to be taken seriously, but you acknowledge that you might be in error? That's fair enough, I think.

Nah, it's called paraphrasing. Which is to say, I take things that I've heard and seen Wilders say, and distill them down to their core meaning.

It's no different from taking Mao Zedong's ideology and distilling it down to "Obey your leader with fanatical devotion and kill anybody who doubts that this is the best idea!"

[Darth Wedgius]

Yeah, surprising thing about people, they don't conform to stereotypes.

But of course that doesn't fit in a sound bite, so scum like Geert Wilders keep using naked racism like "Their culture isn't as progressive as ours, therefore they're all cartoonishly medieval scum!" or whatever other hysterical xenophobia that buffoon likes to trot out. Hopefully that'll change soon, though.

You have a tendency to resort to straw men pretty early on.

I've found that, like Trump, Wilders is impossible to strawman because whatever I say to parody him he'll say something even crazier soon.

If this is parody and not really meant to be taken seriously, never mind,

I don't have time to search actual Geert Wilders quotes, but I think I paraphrased his rhetoric pretty well there.

He's a big fan of cultural imperialism and cultural determinism, much like Trump and the "protagonist" of Star Trek: Discovershit (no, I have neither forgiven nor forgotten that time that MIchael Burnham said that the Klingons "only understand violence" as if she were some alt-right crazy person ranting about "the Muslims" and advocating for nuking Iran on the Internet).

So it is meant to be taken seriously, but you acknowledge that you might be in error? That's fair enough, I think.

Nah, it's called paraphrasing. Which is to say, I take things that I've heard and seen Wilders say, and distill them down to their core meaning.

It's no different from taking Mao Zedong's ideology and distilling it down to "Obey your leader with fanatical devotion and kill anybody who doubts that this is the best idea!"

Do you have evidence as to what their core meaning is? Or would that be an assumption on your part?

[TGLS]

Do you have evidence as to what their core meaning is? Or would that be an assumption on your part?

Here's one:

Yet there is a danger even greater danger than terrorist attacks, the scenario of America as the last man standing. The lights may go out in Europe faster than you can imagine. An Islamic Europe means a Europe without freedom and democracy, an economic wasteland, an intellectual nightmare, and a loss of military might for America – as its allies will turn into enemies, enemies with atomic bombs. With an Islamic Europe, it would be up to America alone to preserve the heritage of Rome, Athens and Jerusalem.

Here's another:

Let no one fool you about Islam being a religion. Sure, it has a god, and a here-after, and 72 virgins. But in its essence Islam is a political ideology. It is a system that lays down detailed rules for society and the life of every person. Islam wants to dictate every aspect of life. Islam means "submission". Islam is not compatible with freedom and democracy, because what it strives for is sharia. If you want to compare Islam to anything, compare it to communism or national-socialism, these are all totalitarian ideologies.

Here's another:

Islam uses the notion of taqiyya, where Muslims, consciously or unconsciously, hide their true opinion as they are not in the majority. If I ask a Muslim in the street what he thinks about homosexuality, he will either remain silent or give a politically correct answer. As the number of Muslims increases, even when they are not violent, the ideology of Islam will become more prominent and society will change.

Here's another:

Islam is the Trojan Horse in Europe. If we do not stop Islamification now, Eurabia and Netherabia will just be a matter of time. One century ago, there were approximately 50 Muslims in the Netherlands. Today, there are about 1 million Muslims in this country. Where will it end? We are heading for the end of European and Dutch civilisation as we know it.

Does it match?

[Admiral X]

I guess the indigenous Europeans don't deserve to preserve their culture or homeland.

That is exactly the attitude of the regressive left, because colonialism, even when it's countries like Hungry or Poland who never got into that. At the same time, they also tell themselves that white people have no culture, because denialism and historical revisionism are okay as long as they're the ones doing it.

[Worffan101]

I guess the indigenous Europeans don't deserve to preserve their culture or homeland.

That is exactly the attitude of the regressive left, because colonialism, even when it's countries like Hungry or Poland who never got into that. At the same time, they also tell themselves that white people have no culture, because denialism and historical revisionism are okay as long as they're the ones doing it.

The hilarious thing is that, as bullshit as the horseshoe theory is (since it's so vague and gimmicky that it can be applied to lionize ANY ideology), RCP-type nut jobs and Luddite hippies happen to come to the same conclusions as fascists.

(though, technically, white people do not have a single unified culture, just as black people don't. Racial 'groups' are as useful as grouping animals by how many toes they have. Also, "regressive" left is kinda a misnomer for New Age types; "misaimed" or "drunk on artisinal coffee and self-loathing" works better)

RCP-type nut? "Old Ways are good! White people are evil for destroying (intentionally or otherwise) the cultures and ways of life of nonwhite people!" Alt-right fascist pig? "Old Ways are good! Modern society is evil for making it no longer OK to wear a sheet and lynch anybody who doesn't look like me!" Luddite hippie: "Modern society sucks! Returning to a more primitive way of life will make society better!" Fascist scum: "Modern society sucks! Returning to a more primitive, 'masculine' way of life will make us strong!"

The main difference is, the fascist hates everybody else and the New Age hippie or Avakian cultist hates themself. (well, the fascist does too, but manifests it externally as hatred of the other)

Though, the simple fact is that the right to "defend culture and homeland" ends where other people's right to live peacefully where they like begins. Bhutan tried this bullshit some time ago with ethnic Nepalese, since the ethnic Nepalese didn't like the 1984-level nonsense Bhutan was pulling (I mean, Bhutan was forcing people to practice the state religion and to wear the officially-mandated costume, not even North Korea is that crazy!) and the Bhutanese government ethnically cleansed them in response. Which is pretty stupid, because "preserving Bhutanese cultural majority" was entirely unnecessary--look at the USA! We've literally NEVER had a cultural majority of any type, even before there WAS a United States of America, we have at least four if not more major white cultural groups east of the Mississippi alone (plus at least two black cultural groups, some of which overlap with some white groups, multiple different communities of Latin-American extraction, branches of Asian cultural groups, numerous Native American nations...), and you can add at least two probably 3 more if you go west of the river plus a shitload of Native American cultures.

And we're the most powerful nation on the planet, and though we've had some racist ethnic cleansing (sorry about that, hundreds of Native American cultures we shat on) and pervasive race issues stick around to today, we've never really had the same hysteria about "defending our culture" consuming the media like Europe does. We have SOME of that absurd nonsense in the far-right end of the political spectrum, but nothing to the mainstream degree you see in Europe.

So...I'd say that you're coincidentally right on some matters, and dead wrong when you imply that 'white people' have a culture. White people don't. White people belong to a few dozen or more different cultures much like every other arbitrary skin-color bullshit classification has a bunch of cultural groups that exist distinctly under that arbitrary umbrella.

[unknownsample]

Yeah, surprising thing about people, they don't conform to stereotypes.

But of course that doesn't fit in a sound bite, so scum like Geert Wilders keep using naked racism like "Their culture isn't as progressive as ours, therefore they're all cartoonishly medieval scum!" or whatever other hysterical xenophobia that buffoon likes to trot out. Hopefully that'll change soon, though.

Hey, Geert Wilders is Dutch. Those articals are Muslims in the US.

Meanwhile in the Netherlands:
"Fury as watchdog says it's OK to send gay people death threats – but only if you're Muslim"
https://www.express.co.uk/news/world/73 ... ats-Muslim

Your relying on the Daily Express as a legitimate news source.

[Darth Wedgius]

Do you have evidence as to what their core meaning is? Or would that be an assumption on your part?

Here's one:

Yet there is a danger even greater danger than terrorist attacks, the scenario of America as the last man standing. The lights may go out in Europe faster than you can imagine. An Islamic Europe means a Europe without freedom and democracy, an economic wasteland, an intellectual nightmare, and a loss of military might for America – as its allies will turn into enemies, enemies with atomic bombs. With an Islamic Europe, it would be up to America alone to preserve the heritage of Rome, Athens and Jerusalem.

Here's another:

Let no one fool you about Islam being a religion. Sure, it has a god, and a here-after, and 72 virgins. But in its essence Islam is a political ideology. It is a system that lays down detailed rules for society and the life of every person. Islam wants to dictate every aspect of life. Islam means "submission". Islam is not compatible with freedom and democracy, because what it strives for is sharia. If you want to compare Islam to anything, compare it to communism or national-socialism, these are all totalitarian ideologies.

Here's another:

Islam uses the notion of taqiyya, where Muslims, consciously or unconsciously, hide their true opinion as they are not in the majority. If I ask a Muslim in the street what he thinks about homosexuality, he will either remain silent or give a politically correct answer. As the number of Muslims increases, even when they are not violent, the ideology of Islam will become more prominent and society will change.

Here's another:

Islam is the Trojan Horse in Europe. If we do not stop Islamification now, Eurabia and Netherabia will just be a matter of time. One century ago, there were approximately 50 Muslims in the Netherlands. Today, there are about 1 million Muslims in this country. Where will it end? We are heading for the end of European and Dutch civilisation as we know it.

Does it match?

It doesn't match with "they're all cartoonishly medieval scum." It is consistent with it, but none of those quotes say anything about all muslims or all middle-eastern muslims.

[Admiral X]

It amuses me that so many of the people who bash on Christians for being Christian will give Islam a pass, even though they are way more hardcore on the issues they bash Christians over.

[Worffan101]

It amuses me that so many of the people who bash on Christians for being Christian will give Islam a pass, even though they are way more hardcore on the issues they bash Christians over.

I see you've never met Billy Graham, the Westboro Baptist Church, or any Russian or American TV preachers. You think ISIS (a group so hardline most Islamic scholars consider them heretics) is crazy? Those guys give them a run for their money.