First of all, I never said I was an American. The peace movement may have had elements of arguments of an unjust war, but the primary drive was almost certainly the casualties. A country throwing in the towel when not militarily defeated is pretty much the definition of a country exhausting.clearspira wrote: ↑Sat Jul 20, 2019 5:44 pm America ''got tired'' which is why you lost Vietnam?
No word for the massive political pressure then? That wasn't fatigue, that was the nationwide realisation that you were the bad guys.
A couple things about the insurgencies that stick out in the American consciousness, versus what the hypothetical insurgency in America.LittleRaven wrote: ↑Sat Jul 20, 2019 6:26 pm In the extremely unlikely event that enough Americans ever get motivated enough to start shooting at their fellow citizens, the same problem applies, except it's much, MUCH worse, because everytime the regime blows something up, they are damaging their own economy and society. Leaving Iraq a wasteland doesn't really do much to our GDP. Leveling Florida costs us something like a trillion dollars a year. And remember, the insurgents don't have to win. All they have to do is degrade the efficiency of our society by, say, 20%....and it all falls apart. Civilization is a remarkably delicate thing.
In Vietnam, besides having to deal with the Vietcong, the Americans had to deal with the invading North Vietnamese army. Both enemies were supplied and operating out of bases in politically inconvenient countries to attack (Laos, Cambodia, North Vietnam). American could have won (militarily at least) in three years, but this would probably have caused World War 3.
In Afghanistan, long term insurgency and civil war has contributed largely to the large scale collapse of the overall society. Pakistan provides a safe space that is politically inconvenient to invade. Iraq may very well end up in the same place as Afghanistan in five years.
Now, in terms of insurgencies around the world the only ones that stick out in my mind as a success were the Reds in China (which was primarily influenced by the Japanese invading), the July 26th Movement (where the Batista's regime collapsed under US sanctions), and the Soviets (where society more or less collapsed and the Soviets simply outlasted all other opponents). Tons of insurgencies all over the world have at best, not succeeded. The Tamil Tigers, Northeast Indian separatists, FARC, Shining Path, Moros Rebels, have failed to achieve their goals or even cause their host state to fail. Insurgency, in general, insurgency is a losing game unless the state has already failed, extensive foreign support is provided, or they have safe areas to strike from.
