Trump VS. Athletes

[Fuzzy Necromancer]

Certainly it appears that the level of aid being received is inadequate. Trump got a lot of criticism for the delay in waiving certain shipping regulations to allow more aid to reach Puerto Rico at less cost (said regulations were waived for the hurricanes that hit the US mainland, and were eventually waived for Puerto Rico as well, but only after several days' delay and public outcry, IIRC).

That, and Trump's whole response comes off as insulting and callous, as usual. On the one hand, he does self-aggrandizing photo ops tossing paper towels and dedicates a fucking gold trophy to hurricane victims. On the other, he takes the opportunity to insult Puerto Rico, attacking it over the island's financial problems, and goes after a local official for daring to criticize his response. In short, he's not acting Presidential: he's acting, as usual, like Donald Trump- a thin-skinned ego maniac who thinks its all about him, even when Americans are suffering and dying.

if Trump would magically turn into a good person how would he be treated? I assume the press would treat him like Ron Paul was treated at beginning of his 2008 run. Some journalist need to swich jobs for the sanity of the USA. You guys are not really giving him incentives to be a good person.

I would argue the reverse. They are desperate for a chance to portray him, if not as a good person, then at least as a competent president. That's why he gets lots of credit in the press for being "presidential" whenever he does something that almost approaches the lowest bar of taken-for-granted behavior you would expect from the leader of this nation. Meanwhile, Obama got slandered and haranged for things like wearing a tan suit or saluting while a cup of coffee was in his hand.

[Robovski]

I harang him for Obamacare made it worse for the working poor, bombing loads more people with drones, and generally his sit back and do nothing leadership for his last year, amongst other things. Obama wasn't a good president and deserved a lot of the shit thrown at him that had nothing to do with race. While I was happy to vote for him originally as a good stump speaker from my home state he rapidly became more of the same old bad old. They way politics plays out today I can understand that feeling people get of wanting to watch it all burn since I see no way of this getting better anytime soon. Dividing the poor on racial lines will only work for so long IMO, and when that stops working there will be a moment. A dire moment of consequence and then anything can happen, but probably violence. Lots of violence.

That's another issue with our culture - there is a lot of tension just waiting to express itself.

[The Romulan Republic]

It is not, primarily, the Left, though, that has divided the poor on racial lines. Its the far Right, the Alt. Right, Trump's base. They tell the poor: "No, its not our fault for serving big business, its those damn dirty immigrants and foreigners taking your jobs."

While the big job killer in the background that no one in power wants to talk about is not foreigners/brown people (who have as much a right to live as anyone)- its automation.

And yeah, a lot of people just want to see it burn. But maybe they should stop and reconsider weather the Joker is a good political role-model.

[Karha of Honor]

It is not, primarily, the Left, though, that has divided the poor on racial lines. Its the far Right, the Alt. Right, Trump's base. They tell the poor: "No, its not our fault for serving big business, its those damn dirty immigrants and foreigners taking your jobs."

While the big job killer in the background that no one in power wants to talk about is not foreigners/brown people (who have as much a right to live as anyone)- its automation.

And yeah, a lot of people just want to see it burn. But maybe they should stop and reconsider weather the Joker is a good political role-model.

if ther will be massive automation wouldn't more immigrants increase the chaos and misery when the shit hits the fans and people will get really desperate about the situation?

[The Romulan Republic]

It is not, primarily, the Left, though, that has divided the poor on racial lines. Its the far Right, the Alt. Right, Trump's base. They tell the poor: "No, its not our fault for serving big business, its those damn dirty immigrants and foreigners taking your jobs."

While the big job killer in the background that no one in power wants to talk about is not foreigners/brown people (who have as much a right to live as anyone)- its automation.

And yeah, a lot of people just want to see it burn. But maybe they should stop and reconsider weather the Joker is a good political role-model.

if ther will be massive automation wouldn't more immigrants increase the chaos and misery when the shit hits the fans and people will get really desperate about the situation?

No. The idea that immigrants=chaos automatically is textbook xenophobia, the belief that something is dangerous or disruptive simply because it is foreign. Leaving aside the hilarious irony that everyone living in America is either an immigrant or a descendent of immigrants. Well, I guess you could say that people who are entirely of First Nations heritage are not, but even then, humans originated in Africa, so...

My point is that it doesn't matter weather immigrants are coming in or not, or weather we're outsourcing or not- most of the traditional working class jobs (and some of the white collar jobs too) are likely going bye-bye, because as long as the tech. exists to automate, and businesses are permitted to put profit for their CEOs and boards of directors over all else, then their will be a strong incentive to automate.

I do think that their will be chaos and misery due to immigrants being scapegoated for the loss of jobs by those who have a vested interest in making sure that the real problem (that the jobs simply aren't there) doesn't get addressed. And your response (to immediately find a way to blame immigrants, even when I factually point out that banning immigrants won't make the problem go away) shows how potent a weapon that is. It won't work forever, of course, but it will "work" for a while, perhaps- at the cost of the civil rights and lives of a great many innocent people.

This, more than anything else, is why I support basic income- because barring a collapse of modern technological civilization, it is very likely going to be a choice between that, a fascist/Neo-Nazi government, or a communist government and the abolition of private business in the fairly near future, because the old model of "you have to earn a living, and if you don't its you're fault for being poor, so don't expect any handouts" isn't going to work when there are no jobs to be had.

Edit: I think, in short, that we have to start looking for economic alternatives outside of the traditional assumptions of either Left or Right. Because while its possible that the future effects of automation are being overstated... we're already seeing a lot of jobs being lost for this reason, we're already seeing a reduction in democracy and civil liberties as minorities are scapegoated, and we have every reason to believe that its going to get worse. And if it does happen to the extent that some may predict... then we're probably looking at the biggest economic paradigm shift since the Industrial Revolution, if not the invention of agriculture.

[Fuzzy Necromancer]

I harang him for Obamacare made it worse for the working poor, bombing loads more people with drones, and generally his sit back and do nothing leadership for his last year, amongst other things. Obama wasn't a good president and deserved a lot of the shit thrown at him that had nothing to do with race. While I was happy to vote for him originally as a good stump speaker from my home state he rapidly became more of the same old bad old. They way politics plays out today I can understand that feeling people get of wanting to watch it all burn since I see no way of this getting better anytime soon. Dividing the poor on racial lines will only work for so long IMO, and when that stops working there will be a moment. A dire moment of consequence and then anything can happen, but probably violence. Lots of violence.

That's another issue with our culture - there is a lot of tension just waiting to express itself.

My point is not what you, personally, harange Obama for. It's about the things that become issues in the media at large. It's a demonstration of the hypocrisy. The point is that, rather than any of the legitimate grievances, Obama was taken to task for being "unpresidential" in the most mundane and petty ways, whereas now we have a leader so unpresidential that foreign dignitaries feign a lack of English fluency to avoid talking with him, and yet many mainstream news sources are bending over backwards to point out when he meets the lowest of low bars for "Presidential" behavior.

[The Romulan Republic]

Partly, I think that's just denial. People still can't quite come to terms with just how big a disaster the current "President' is.

Some of it is race, as well. The default image of a President of the US for most people is an old white man, so a lot of people, even if they are not openly racist, will have a harder time seeing a black man as Presidential, and judge him more critically.

[Admiral X]

I think it's just a lot easier for some people to believe that. It's simple and doesn't require any thought or consideration toward political opponents. The stupid petty stuff is honestly just a distraction and I'm surprised to see people play into it, other than that it seems to let them ignore the more important stuff. I mean, how many people said something along the lines of being happy the Obama Administration could end without any scandals in spite of stuff like Fast and Furious, the expansion of the War on Terror, the Snowden whistle-blowing and his response to that, the Benghazi attack and how he and Clinton tried to play it off as a response to a YouTube video when they knew differently all along, stuff like that, you know? But people seem focus more on shit like making him look silly in pictures and the like, and now it's happening again with Trump.

[The Romulan Republic]

I'm not sure what you're referring to? Are you referring to people people believing that the President isn't really that bad because its easier (in which case, I object to the comparison of Obama and Trump as another example of the mindless "both sides are the same" fallacy)?

And you know, we don't have to try to make Trump look silly. Also, "silly" isn't the word I would use. More like "horrifying".

Also... seriously? You're going to come in here and push the Benghazi conspiracy nonsense?

That lie did its job, or at any rate the purpose behind it was accomplished- Clinton isn't President.

You can let it go now.

[Admiral X]

I'm referring to people just assuming racism on the part of their political opponents, or in this case on the part of the moderates who generally vote back and forth and this time voted for Trump where last time they voted for Obama. It's easier to just dismiss them as racist because then you don't have to listen to anything they actually have to say, or anything of actual substance that is going on.

I'm not pushing "conspiracy nonsense," so I find it kind of interesting that you somehow got that when I simply listed Benghazi as one of several examples of scandals that the Obama administration had in spite the claims he left office without any. It's also pretty sad/pathetic that ideologues ignore stuff like that in favor of stupid things with no substance to try to score some kind of cheap "gotcha" points.