The Russian Invasion of Ukraine

[Frustration]

We have a winner!

[CharlesPhipps]

I mean, it is fairly basic actually:

Progressives believe in changing the government to move forward (or what they perceive as such)

Conservatives believe that change is either wrong or should be carefully or slowly implemented.

[BridgeConsoleMasher]

Yes it's rather grounded in formulation and not just a matter of coalition sentimentality.

[Fuzzy Necromancer]

Really? When? Because the worst I've seen of it is use as an empty buzzword.

Historical research. It was used all the time to describe the forcing of aboriginal people off their land, the kidnapping of their children, and the attempts to obliterate their cultures and languages. It was also used to describe the confiscation of land by governments to further projects by the ultra-rich, and such events as the Annexation of Hawaii and the Spanish-American war.

Really, the examples I can think of are too numerous to mention. But pretty much everything about that last two hundred years that we now think of as abhorrent, has been described as "progress" and/or "progressive" at the time.

One of the problems with modern "progressive" people is that they believe - no, they *feel* - that whatever stances they happen to agree with at the present moment are objective realities that only monsters fail to acknowledge as unquestionable truths. They both ignore their own changing certainties and the almost inevitable changing of consensus with time.

George Orwell didn't invent the mindset, but he did describe it very accurately.

I'm talking about the word "progressive", not "progress". Progress is a very elastic word, while Progressive has a much more specific and political definition. What atrocities have you seen the word "progressive" used to justify?

[TGLS]

What atrocities have you seen the word "progressive" used to justify?

Nasty things TR and Wilson have done?

[Fuzzy Necromancer]

I don't know who you're referring to.

[TGLS]

I don't know who you're referring to.

Teddy Roosevelt (who advanced an imperial foreign agenda while advancing a progressive domestic agenda) and Woodrow Wilson (who advanced a progressive domestic agenda, attempted to advance a progressive foreign agenda at Versailles, but also imposed segregation federally). That's the best I can do for "progressives behaving badly".

I suppose there's also the progressives who supported eugenics in the early 20th century.

[hammerofglass]

The discussion is kind of limited by progressives not having had any actual power in the US or UK since the Carter administration.

[ProfessorDetective]

The discussion is kind of limited by progressives not having had any actual power in the US or UK since the Carter administration.

Unless you count gay/bi folks getting marriages and discrimination protections.

[phantom000]

Putin is bringing in his own volunteers to help Russian forces in Ukraine, sounds almost like a super villain. His regular mooks can't defeat the heroes so he is bringing in some outside help.

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/pu ... 022-03-11/