Brexit Rambles

[Karha of Honor]

I guess you would be fine with a second election called after your side won because they did not deliver promises 16 months after it happened?

What was it really? If the entrenched elites don't deliver they will pay long term...

They failed to convince the people...

You do realize, that the "entrenched elites" are the ones who enticed the people to vote for the BrExit in the first place? That there are literally only two, maybe three fringe parties (SNP, LibDems and maybe the Greens) who are against a BrExit at the moment? You commit the collosal mistake of letting your distrust, if not hatred of big government (I have to assume that this is your beef with the EU) getting into your way of objectively looking at the referendum.

The simple fact of the matter is, that roughly half of the population voted to remain in the EU and roughly half of the population voted to leave and while the former group's goals align, regardless on if they want a reform in the EU or want the EU to stay as is (in either case, they need to stay in the EU to achieve their goal), the later's group has a huge disparity on what they actually want, because the goals of a No Deal BrExit and a Deal BrExit are incompatible, even diametrally opposed and this is what causes this endless deadlock in the end. If the BrExit-camp fails to deliver a BrExit, then it's because the BrExit-camp is a disunited mess that can't agree on what those 52% of BrExit-voters actually wanted in the first place.
You gleefully cheer that the elites are failing, while failing to realize yourself, that the elites are the ones who advocate for what you seem the regard as the best solution and that the current happenings in the british parliament completely fail to reflect the choice of the people in the first place, because where is the representation of the 48%, who voted to stay? If the current parliament would reflect "the will of the people" in the matter of BrExit, then the SNP, LibDems and maybe the Greens would have a combined MP-% of 48%, instead of the barely 7,4% they currently have. I am absolutely flabbergasted how you of all people can not see this sham for what it is, because you are argueing in favour of what you allegedly hate.

tHE ENTRENCHED ELITES WERE FORCED TO ADOPT AN OUTSIDER position for elctoral reasons...

They did not start that fire.

[Madner Kami]

Motivated by a caller on a british radio show, I actually started to wonder something I probably should've investigated earlier and I found the perfect article:

Who actually trades solely under WTO rules?

by James Hardy in October 2017.

The likelihood of the UK crashing out of the EU seems to be increasing with every step of the negotiation.

For those of us that believe in the merits of the EU, this would be a disaster, but the counter point used by some opponents of the EU[1] is that, even if we leave with no deal, we can fall back onto the tariffs agreed under the World Trade Organisation

Recently, the pro-brexit group Leave.EU shared an image sharing a claim made by Richard Tice. “WTO rules are what most great countries trade under. If it’s good enough for Australia, America and Canada, it’s good enough for the UK”

When I saw this, I was a little skeptical. I know that America and Canada are both in a Free Trade Area with Mexico, and Canada’s Free-Trade agreement with the EU has only just come into effect. I wasn’t too sure about Australia, but I looked it up. Turns out they have free-trade agreements with China, South Korea, the USA, New Zealand and others. Couldn’t Mr Tice have come up with a better example?

[...]

It is an intersting read and I don't want to take the chance away from you, to follow his short scavanger hunt and so I'll not spoil the answer, unless you want it spoiled, in which case, just mark the text inside the quote-box below:

The next step would have been to order these by GDP, but that turned out to be unnecessary, as there is only one country in the world that trades only under WTO rules. That country:

MAURITANIA

For those of you not familiar with Mauritania, it’s GDP is $4,714million (0.2% of the UK’s), 50% of its exports consist of Iron Ore, and between 1% and 17% of the population still live in slavery.

It appears that this is the country that Leave.UK wish to emulate. I am afraid that this is not a vision for Britain’s future that I can share.

The article goes a bit further and tops even that bit of knowledge. And no, I am not saying that the UK is at the same level as the final winners of the article. I just found it funny and interesting, to dismantle that seemingly popular "arguement".

[clearspira]

Motivated by a caller on a british radio show, I actually started to wonder something I probably should've investigated earlier and I found the perfect article:

Who actually trades solely under WTO rules?

by James Hardy in October 2017.

The likelihood of the UK crashing out of the EU seems to be increasing with every step of the negotiation.

For those of us that believe in the merits of the EU, this would be a disaster, but the counter point used by some opponents of the EU[1] is that, even if we leave with no deal, we can fall back onto the tariffs agreed under the World Trade Organisation

Recently, the pro-brexit group Leave.EU shared an image sharing a claim made by Richard Tice. “WTO rules are what most great countries trade under. If it’s good enough for Australia, America and Canada, it’s good enough for the UK”

When I saw this, I was a little skeptical. I know that America and Canada are both in a Free Trade Area with Mexico, and Canada’s Free-Trade agreement with the EU has only just come into effect. I wasn’t too sure about Australia, but I looked it up. Turns out they have free-trade agreements with China, South Korea, the USA, New Zealand and others. Couldn’t Mr Tice have come up with a better example?

[...]

It is an intersting read and I don't want to take the chance away from you, to follow his short scavanger hunt and so I'll not spoil the answer, unless you want it spoiled, in which case, just mark the text inside the quote-box below:

The next step would have been to order these by GDP, but that turned out to be unnecessary, as there is only one country in the world that trades only under WTO rules. That country:

MAURITANIA

For those of you not familiar with Mauritania, it’s GDP is $4,714million (0.2% of the UK’s), 50% of its exports consist of Iron Ore, and between 1% and 17% of the population still live in slavery.

It appears that this is the country that Leave.UK wish to emulate. I am afraid that this is not a vision for Britain’s future that I can share.

The article goes a bit further and tops even that bit of knowledge. And no, I am not saying that the UK is at the same level as the final winners of the article. I just found it funny and interesting, to dismantle that seemingly popular "arguement".

I am starting to realise what moderate feminists must feel like every time they see a radfem talk about cutting a guys' balls off.
Yeah, I know, random. But that is what being a leaver is kind of like now. You get lumped in with all of these crazies that want to leave without a deal or who complain about foreigners. For what its worth, what I am against is the idea that an outside government has direct power over my own. I feel like I've lost a f-ing war or something. That is why I will continue to vote for Brexit, and if there is a second ref and I lose, why I will vote for Ferage when he stands in 2022.

[Madner Kami]

Yeah, I know, random. But that is what being a leaver is kind of like now. You get lumped in with all of these crazies that want to leave without a deal or who complain about foreigners.

If that comforts you, let me reassure you that even though I do not agree on your conclusion, I do not regard you as an ̶i̶̶n̶̶s̶̶a̶̶n̶̶e̶̶ ̶̶p̶̶e̶̶r̶̶s̶̶o̶̶n̶ No Dealer. If I gave you that feeling, I am genuinely sorry and I only intended to make fun of the No Dealers, partially in order so that we can both laugh about them.

I perfectly understand your position though. I think I found myself in a similar position, when Germany's center-left social democratic party (SPD) took a hart turn to the right under Schröder and his cronies and managed to overtake our center-right christian democratic party (CDU) on the right hand side. I suddenly had noone to vote for anymore. Can't vote conservative, can't vote for our left party anymore (for reasons I feel self-explanatory) and the Green party has a really unpleasent stench of neoliberalism paired with extreme elements of second wave feminism. And this continues to this day, which only leaves me to either vote for fringe parties that are never going to get into our parliament or our satire party "Die Partei" ("The Party"). If I say, I am left, I get lumped in with neocommunists and ultra socialist elements or the extreme elements of second wave feminism and SJWing. If I describe myself as a social-democrat, I am regarded as a closet neoliberalist.

P.S.: I feel this conversation between James O'Brian and his caller is very well reflecting on what I feel about reasonable BrExiters: James O'Brien vs Theresa May's biggest Brexit mistakes. About a minute in, they use the figure of picking up and throwing a stone at a window and O'Brian notes that he understands and agrees why people who support a BrExit picked up the rock, but that they are throwing it at the wrong window. It's a great metaphor and I completely agree with it.

[Madner Kami]

Brexit: Boris Johnson ordered to appear in court over £350m claim

The Tory leadership candidate has been accused of misconduct in public office after making the claim during the 2016 EU referendum campaign.

It is a private prosecution launched by campaigner Marcus Ball, who crowdfunded £200,000 for the case.

A source close to Mr Johnson called the case a "politically motivated attempt to reverse Brexit".

His lawyers argued it was "a stunt".

[...]

The timing appears suspect, as Johnson was named as a possible successor to May about two weeks ago, so I did some minor digging into this case and it actually appears legit at first glance. Marcus Ball registered his website on July 19th of 2016, so it appears his claim that he has been on this case since 2016 seems correct (the referendum was on June 23rd, 2016). The crowdfunding for the current court-case began in September 2018, long before May's resignation was on the table (well, this particular table that is).

So... Yeah. Boris Johnson has to answer for lying while being an elected official.

[Fuzzy Necromancer]

Motivated by a caller on a british radio show, I actually started to wonder something I probably should've investigated earlier and I found the perfect article:

Who actually trades solely under WTO rules?

by James Hardy in October 2017.

The likelihood of the UK crashing out of the EU seems to be increasing with every step of the negotiation.

For those of us that believe in the merits of the EU, this would be a disaster, but the counter point used by some opponents of the EU[1] is that, even if we leave with no deal, we can fall back onto the tariffs agreed under the World Trade Organisation

Recently, the pro-brexit group Leave.EU shared an image sharing a claim made by Richard Tice. “WTO rules are what most great countries trade under. If it’s good enough for Australia, America and Canada, it’s good enough for the UK”

When I saw this, I was a little skeptical. I know that America and Canada are both in a Free Trade Area with Mexico, and Canada’s Free-Trade agreement with the EU has only just come into effect. I wasn’t too sure about Australia, but I looked it up. Turns out they have free-trade agreements with China, South Korea, the USA, New Zealand and others. Couldn’t Mr Tice have come up with a better example?

[...]

It is an intersting read and I don't want to take the chance away from you, to follow his short scavanger hunt and so I'll not spoil the answer, unless you want it spoiled, in which case, just mark the text inside the quote-box below:

The next step would have been to order these by GDP, but that turned out to be unnecessary, as there is only one country in the world that trades only under WTO rules. That country:

MAURITANIA

For those of you not familiar with Mauritania, it’s GDP is $4,714million (0.2% of the UK’s), 50% of its exports consist of Iron Ore, and between 1% and 17% of the population still live in slavery.

It appears that this is the country that Leave.UK wish to emulate. I am afraid that this is not a vision for Britain’s future that I can share.

The article goes a bit further and tops even that bit of knowledge. And no, I am not saying that the UK is at the same level as the final winners of the article. I just found it funny and interesting, to dismantle that seemingly popular "arguement".

I am starting to realise what moderate feminists must feel like every time they see a radfem talk about cutting a guys' balls off.
Yeah, I know, random. But that is what being a leaver is kind of like now. You get lumped in with all of these crazies that want to leave without a deal or who complain about foreigners.

Lie down with dogs, and you'll wake up with fleas.

[clearspira]

Lie down with dogs, and you'll wake up with fleas.

Or you'll wake up with your best friend cuddling you.
Funny how perspective changes things innit?

[Fuzzy Necromancer]

Point to clearspira

[Madner Kami]

Trump likens Irish border to wall between US and Mexico

Donald Trump has started his visit to Ireland by comparing its post-Brexit border with Northern Ireland to the US border with Mexico, along which he wants to build a permanent wall.

Trump, sitting next to a visibly uncomfortable taoiseach, Leo Varadkar, waded into the Brexit debate minutes after Air Force One touched down at Shannon airport on Wednesday afternoon.

“I think it will all work out very well, and also for you with your wall, your border,” he said at a joint press conference. “I mean, we have a border situation in the United States, and you have one over here. But I hear it’s going to work out very well here.”

[...]

Yup, that's exactly what the Brits and the Irish want to have and hear, the border between Ireland and the UK being likened to the mexican-american border. Walled, I suppose also mined, armed guards at the few crossing points and some barbed wire toppings to make the picture complete. This guy... Just...

[LittleRaven]

Walled, I suppose also mined, armed guards at the few crossing points and some barbed wire toppings to make the picture complete. This guy... Just...

Uh....that's not what the US-Mexico border is like. At all.

There are certainly no land mines. (seriously...LAND MINES?!? ) Only a tiny, TINY portion of the border is walled...and those bits are almost entirely within major metropolitan areas. Those are also the bits with crossing points and armed guards, but we're not talking Berlin Wall stuff here. Tens of thousands of people cross San Ysidro in both directions every day, and that's just one border crossing out of hundreds.

But the vast, VAST majority of the border is just nothing or fencing of various quality. I mean, the border is almost 2000 miles long - most of it across barely occupied desert. That's one of the big reasons why the idea of a wall is so ridiculous. There's just way, WAY too much border across way, WAY too much nothing.