Syrian Refugees in the USA

[Antiboyscout]

Do efforts at legalizing discrimination against formerly protected classes in the name of Religious Freedom count? Or the Transgender military ban attempts? Or bans on immigrants/refugees from Muslim-dominated countries?

"protected class" a form of institutional privilege designed to compensate for supposed social discrimination. Do you even understand how dangerous it is to have the government force business owners to serve all and never say no? Will this forced service be reciprocated. If I visit my local organic vegan lesbian progressive bakery and ask for a gun shaped cake to celebrate the 25 anniversary of the NRA will they be forced to serve me?

[CharlesPhipps]

The short version on my end is that in all the places the Syrian Refugees have arrived, they haven't had massive terrorist attacks.

The terrorists have been recruited from people already living there (i.e. France) and the situation there is a lot more complicated even with the fact the terrorists are mostly lone actors or small (i.e. like people who shoot up American schools).

America would benefit from a bunch of Syrians because the Middle East is going to be a major part of our foreign policy in the future and having people of that heritage will help when we have to deal with them.

[Antiboyscout]

The short version on my end is that in all the places the Syrian Refugees have arrived, they haven't had massive terrorist attacks.

The terrorists have been recruited from people already living there (i.e. France) and the situation there is a lot more complicated even with the fact the terrorists are mostly lone actors or small (i.e. like people who shoot up American schools).

America would benefit from a bunch of Syrians because the Middle East is going to be a major part of our foreign policy in the future and having people of that heritage will help when we have to deal with them.

No, they've just had massive uptick in sex and violent crimes.

The middle east won't be a major part of our foreign policy. We just need to learn to abandon Europe and accept the fact Russia will take over.

[CharlesPhipps]

The short version on my end is that in all the places the Syrian Refugees have arrived, they haven't had massive terrorist attacks.

The terrorists have been recruited from people already living there (i.e. France) and the situation there is a lot more complicated even with the fact the terrorists are mostly lone actors or small (i.e. like people who shoot up American schools).

America would benefit from a bunch of Syrians because the Middle East is going to be a major part of our foreign policy in the future and having people of that heritage will help when we have to deal with them.

No, they've just had massive uptick in sex and violent crimes.

The middle east won't be a major part of our foreign policy. We just need to learn to abandon Europe and accept the fact Russia will take over.

Yes, that also is a shitty idea.

[Antiboyscout]

The short version on my end is that in all the places the Syrian Refugees have arrived, they haven't had massive terrorist attacks.

The terrorists have been recruited from people already living there (i.e. France) and the situation there is a lot more complicated even with the fact the terrorists are mostly lone actors or small (i.e. like people who shoot up American schools).

America would benefit from a bunch of Syrians because the Middle East is going to be a major part of our foreign policy in the future and having people of that heritage will help when we have to deal with them.

No, they've just had massive uptick in sex and violent crimes.

The middle east won't be a major part of our foreign policy. We just need to learn to abandon Europe and accept the fact Russia will take over.

Yes, that also is a shitty idea.

We need a bit more Realpolitik

Bismark:
"Still I would not shrink, from the war; I would advise it, were anyone able to prove to me the necessity for it, or to point out a worthy end which could be attained by it and in no other way. Why do great States wage war nowadays? The only sound principle of action for a great State is political egoism and not Romanticism, and it is unworthy of a great State to fight for any matter which does not concern its own interests. Shew us, gentlemen, an object worthy of war and you have my vote. It is easy for a statesman in his office or his chamber to blow the trumpet with the breath of popularity and all the time to sit warming himself by his fireside, while he leaves it to the rifleman, who lies bleeding on the snow, whether his system attains victory and glory. Nothing is easier; but woe to the statesman who at such a time does not look about for a reason for the war which will be valid when the war is over. I am convinced you will see the questions which now occupy us in a different light a year hence, when you look back upon them through a long perspective of battle-fields and conflagrations, misery and wretchedness. Will you then have the courage to go to the peasant by the ashes of his cottage, to the cripple, to the childless father, and say: 'You have suffered much, but rejoice with us, the Union is saved."

[TGLS]

Three things:
1) America has interests everywhere at this point.
2) America can't abandon Europe without losing all credibility. If Russia started interfering in Estonia and America did nothing, America would lose nearly all their credibility and most allies would begin to Finlandize.
3) Bismarck said that immediately after surrendering instead of fighting a costly war they would lose anyway. 16 years later, Germany fought went to war over the same thing and won.

[Antiboyscout]

Three things:
1) America has interests everywhere at this point.
2) America can't abandon Europe without losing all credibility. If Russia started interfering in Estonia and America did nothing, America would lose nearly all their credibility and most allies would begin to Finlandize.
3) Bismarck said that immediately after surrendering instead of fighting a costly war they would lose anyway. 16 years later, Germany fought went to war over the same thing and won.

1. We don't have interests everywhere Europe has interests in the Mid. East because of Oil imports. Thanks to Fracking and Canada we are almost oil independent.

2. What's wrong with Finlandizing? The EU already wants a united army and to become the US's rival. They can deal with their own defense. Let Germany be "leader of the free world"

2. Big difference in Uniting Germany Under Prussia as apposed to With Austria.

[Robovski]

I'm on board with not being global policeman and having to support bases and troops around the world, at least as far as Europe considering we are staring down the tank barrels of the Warsaw pact anymore. We can change that position should Warsaw II become an issue again. Europe can pay more for their own defenses in or out of NATO.

Japan, South Korea, that's a different matter.

[CharlesPhipps]

Today I had this rather odd point:

Colleague: "Trump defeated ISIS, he knows what he's doing in Syria?"

Me: "Wait, didn't Iraq defeat ISIS? Isn't Trump's whole thing he's not fighting wars abroad?"

Colleague: "Huh?"

The guy seemed genuinely stunned Iraq was in a terrifying bloody street to street Stalingrad-esque struggle with them.

[Darth Wedgius]

Mind you, the separation of church and state is something that exists because of the PROTECTION of religious Americans rather than to stop them. People forget that the reason the separation of church and state exists is because the United States was created by varying groups of contradictory but equally driven religious people. Which, ironically, means that the Islamic people who come to the United States might be seeking the opportunity to practice their faith without fear of persecution for their beliefs as can happen in many other countries.

By which I mean that they'd be leaving countries where due to the fact they are not the right kind of Muslim is a reason to have them murdered.

I also am of the mind that there's a certain level of leaving the house when it's on fire is not really that good of a king. The Iraq War had numerous disasters attached to it due to mismanagement, corruption, cronyism, mass embezzlement, the dissolution of the Iraqi army (which Patton refused to do with the Nazis of all people because of fear of what having them released might do), and the question of whether we should even have been there. However, allowing ISIS and Assad to "fight it out" with Russia and the Rebels strikes me as a somewhat questionable strategy. Certainly ISIS has successfully mounted numerous terrorist attacks on us since then despite a minimalist presence and disrupted large portions of the Middle East and Africa.

Plus the whole genocide thing.

Someone else's problems today is tomorrow yours.

We are going in circles on refugees intentions. On that part, I rest.

Russia may find ISIS a rough sort of enemy, and ISIS may find Russia an equally difficult enemy. I'm honestly more concerned about ISIS than Russia. Russia seems determined to be in opposition to us, but doesn't seem to consider our deaths to be a holy calling. In any case, I'm happy for them to expend their blood and treasure on each other.

The genocide thing, frankly, I can live with. We're not the world's policemen, and I think most problems in the Middle East are caused by people in the Middle East, even with the botched mess Europe made splitting up the Ottoman Empire after WW 1. And sometimes someone else's problems today are solved by somebody else without us having to lift a finger.