Trump Lambasting Diverse Congress People

[Darth Wedgius]

Little Raven: nah. I’m arguing that Trump camps are concentration camps even by your “must be Nazi tier” definition. As suggested in the unquoted portion of my post, I consider what the Canadians are doing deeply unethical as well, but I am willing to accept that they don’t rise to the level of Dachau, which apparently is our bar for this conversation.

Darth: your argument hinges on the premise that, as non-citizens, the people in these camps do not deserve full human rights as outlined in the US constitution. When you exclude a group from human rights, you exclude them from humanity.
It’s not a straw man, it’s stating clearly the required beliefs to hold that position. If it seems monstrous, *change your position*

The constitution does not outline human rights. It outlines some rights of U.S. citizens. Court cases have not concluded that illegal immigrants or asylum seekers are given all the rights of U.S. citizens, though the constitution "follows the flag" to some extent.

Also, the right to free travel is abridged for many people in the U.S., some of whom have committed crimes, but they are not considered less than human.

Your logic is based on false premises and proceeds from them through faulty reasoning to arrive at conclusions the downright silliness of which should surprise nobody.

[Yukaphile]

Yeah, sorry, we are NOT mass-murdering unarmed people in droves. I object to people demonizing the unarmed German civilian back then for the simplistic mindset of "they should have tried to stop it!" when any attempts to do so, and it would have been them next. But there is a clear world of difference here, and the two are not the same. I may have problems with the US, but even we haven't sunk THAT far - yet. Also, LittleRaven, I'm pretty sure that kind of thinking CmdrKing is spouting went into the ICE bomber.

[LittleRaven]

Also, LittleRaven, I'm pretty sure that kind of thinking CmdrKing is spouting went into the ICE bomber.

We know it did, because he told us it did. His manifesto makes it perfectly clear that he believed fascism had arrived in America and it needed to be violently resisted. He encouraged his fellow liberals to arm themselves, making 'ghost guns' if necessary, because the time for talk had passed, and only action remained.

And frankly, if you honestly believe that ICE camps are the equivalent of Dachau, then I don't see how you can't believe than Van Spronsen was right.

[Yukaphile]

Honestly, it's just further proof the far-left nutcases are just as bad as the right-wing ones. Give me the center left position any day.

[clearspira]

Except for the fact that Japanese Americans and people trying to illegally enter the country are not the same thing. Good try though.

So you're taking the position "only Americans are human"

Oh, and if you honestly think that either Trump or modern America would allow an actual extermination camp then you should stop sniffing glue frankly.

And wonder why I think anyone who believes ICE and Republicans generally aren't itching to bring on the firing squads are delusional?

But no reasonable person thinks this, because that is completely insane. There is a world of difference between rounding up your own citizens and placing potential immigrants into holding facilities while you process their claims, and only someone who is intentionally trying to distort the narrative would suggest otherwise.

Are the Canadians crowding people at "standing room only 24/7"? Intentionally breaking family units? Actively raiding major cities to send more people to the camps?

Now full disclosure, even standard US prison conditions are very likely human rights violations. But where the Canadian detention centers are those, the current Trump Camps are run like Dachau-style concentration camps, including the part where staff are raging bigots who want reasons to abuse prisoners.

Nope, i'm saying that one was here legally and one wasn't. Ooh, controversial...

And no one is itching to bring on firing squads except in your own head.

[Yukaphile]

We should make it easier for people to come here, with quicker but tougher vetting processes for criminal backgrounds. This is 2019. That stuff could easily be carried out in very short order. I hate bureaucracy...

[Madner Kami]

We should make it easier for people to come here, with quicker but tougher vetting processes for criminal backgrounds. This is 2019. That stuff could easily be carried out in very short order. I hate bureaucracy...

The US doesn't even have a central register for who is a citizen and who is not and you are one of the technologically more advanced countries on this planet. Try figuring out if that passport-lacking guy who says he's 16 and comes from Brazil, really is 16, really comes from Brazil, really never commited a crime and really is named Pedro Madrigal. Good luck.

[Yukaphile]

And of course, people are now so paranoid of government outreach, any attempts to create a central register would be met with suspicion... it doesn't help that those in charge would use it to abuse their power, and to push an agenda that favors their political views. Ugh...

[BridgeConsoleMasher]

I'll vouch for pedro

[CmdrKing]

Reversing order on the post because the reasoning makes more sense laid out this way.

Exactly what part of that reminds you of ICE facilities?!? And frankly, if you honestly believe that ICE is doing THAT to people, why the hell are you arguing on a forum instead of grabbing a rifle and heading to a camp? How can you sit by while a crime like THAT is taking place in your name?

Running in screaming like Rambo doesn't secure a safe escape route. Doesn't get anyone out of the camp. Doesn't prevent the Trump administration from making a dozen more just like it. Doesn't free even a fraction of the prisoners considering the number and distribution of the camps. Doesn't accomplish anything, since you'll actually just be shot.

Those who study history know what these look like. We know the paths they take. And we hope we've learned how to disrupt them without the Only Proven Method to remove fascists from power.

Which is rather a lot harder when half of people pretend a concentration camp isn't a concentration camp.

You can't be serious.

32000 people died at Dachau. And those are only the ones we have documentation on, most historians believe that many more thousands passed in obscurity. Prisoners were forced to labor in order to produce munitions for the Third Reich while Sigmund Rascher conducted sadistic and generally fatal 'medical experiments' on human subjects. Floggings and "pole-hangings" were standard disciplinary techniques. Starvation reigned supreme, and a massive crematorium had to be constructed on site to handle the staggering number of bodies that were generated on a daily basis.

Well, let's glance at a basic wikipedia page and have a think.

"From 1933 to 1938, the prisoners were mainly German nationals detained for political reasons. After the Reichspogromnacht or Kristallnacht, 30,000 male Jewish citizens were deported to concentration camps. More than 10,000 of them were interned in Dachau alone."

"Over 4,000 Soviet prisoners of war were murdered by the Dachau commandant's guard at the SS shooting range located two kilometers from the main camp in the years 1942/1943"

So for the first 5 or so years of the camp's existence, it was mainly political prisoners and "subversives", and full overflow capacity arrived later. While the details are sketchy, we can't really confirm full on mass executions until the midpoint of the war, around 9 years into its existence.

We are currently about 3 years into the Trump administration.

https://twitter.com/nowthisnews/status/1150397786329714688?s=21

The VP inspecting the camps, finding them acceptable. Tick tock.