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There's also a lot of people who support Palestine, and we're loud too. For some Palestine supporters, this could be the difference between being a Biden voter and being a non-voter.

Fuzzy Necromancer wrote: ↑Wed Apr 03, 2024 5:11 pm There's also a lot of people who support Palestine, and we're loud too. For some Palestine supporters, this could be the difference between being a Biden voter and being a non-voter.

With respect to the Palestinian supporters....what's the goal with non-voting? To change Biden's policies or a belief his opponent will be more sympathetic?

CharlesPhipps wrote: ↑Wed Apr 03, 2024 6:12 pm

Fuzzy Necromancer wrote: ↑Wed Apr 03, 2024 5:11 pm There's also a lot of people who support Palestine, and we're loud too. For some Palestine supporters, this could be the difference between being a Biden voter and being a non-voter.

With respect to the Palestinian supporters....what's the goal with non-voting? To change Biden's policies or a belief his opponent will be more sympathetic?

Neither. It's "voting takes effort and both candidates kinda suck. I'm going to do something that doesn't suck."

TGLS wrote: ↑Wed Apr 03, 2024 6:24 pm

CharlesPhipps wrote: ↑Wed Apr 03, 2024 6:12 pm

Fuzzy Necromancer wrote: ↑Wed Apr 03, 2024 5:11 pm There's also a lot of people who support Palestine, and we're loud too. For some Palestine supporters, this could be the difference between being a Biden voter and being a non-voter.

With respect to the Palestinian supporters....what's the goal with non-voting? To change Biden's policies or a belief his opponent will be more sympathetic?

Neither. It's "voting takes effort and both candidates kinda suck. I'm going to do something that doesn't suck."

The shoot self in the foot and confused by why you lost a foot method, a popular one. I been known to do it a few times.

CharlesPhipps wrote: ↑Wed Apr 03, 2024 6:12 pm

Fuzzy Necromancer wrote: ↑Wed Apr 03, 2024 5:11 pm There's also a lot of people who support Palestine, and we're loud too. For some Palestine supporters, this could be the difference between being a Biden voter and being a non-voter.

With respect to the Palestinian supporters....what's the goal with non-voting? To change Biden's policies or a belief his opponent will be more sympathetic?

I don't think it's a goal. I just think some people are unwilling to vote for any candidate who is pro-genocide, which, in a marginally better world, wouldn't be such an issue. But here we are. Endorsing genocide is more than some people can stomach, and while i'm going to vote anyway, I don't feel good about it.

Nobody700 wrote: ↑Wed Apr 03, 2024 3:43 pm
I think you're ignoring what som of us are saying. A lot pf people, and I mean actual people... SUPPORT ISRAEL. Not a large minority. Not the majority... but large enough to make their voices heard. I drove to Chicago a month ago and I saw a dozen billboards supporting Israel, and their is a common voice in my state (Indiana) to FLATTEN GAZA. I BALK at this shit... but it is sadly VERY common, and it's not just red states.

Quite the opposite. I'm listening and finding your argument incomplete.
Which people support genocide. Who do they vote for.
If there is a substantive voting base that supports Israel murdering humanitarian workers among moderates and Democrats, where do they live? Are they a weird enclave in New York, a state that Biden has many other voters to replace them with in? If so, why are we giving them more weight in our consideration than "tens of thousands of Arab Americans in Michigan, a state in which the 2020 presidential margin was ~150,000 and in 2016 was 11,000"?

If you want to talk cold political calculus, actually look at the calculus, don't just see "well there's a lot of very loud people on both sides" and conclude it's an unsolvable problem.

Okay, fine, let me just lay it down.

Trump is going to win. He will. Face it, he will. The guy can't be locked up for shit he did, his supporter base is STRONGER, he has so much damn support and he will win, because everyone opposed to Trump is in a pissing match. Should we admit that Biden has failed in a lot? Yes. But to 'punish Biden' for not curing cancer, or ending racism in America, we shall just get on our knees and let Trump and his crypto cult take over the country. He will, and have whatever power and support to do so, and he will win because everyone is too busy fighting over every damn thing. Does that mean we shouldn't be disgusted at the White House not stopping Israel? Course not, we should. But frankly, unlike many of you are stating, we all know Trump's answer to the situation. FLATTEN GAZA. Than flatten Ukraine, and flatten anyone who his masters in Moscow will demand. America will fucking die, and I'm just waiting, because we all decided to be divided instead of all united in one absolute front. To STOP the rise of a dictator and his party of religious nuts and cultists. Fine, let's argue about how Biden didn't stop Israel. Because I know who'll GLADLY FINISH OFF PALESTINE, and so many people will WORSHIP Trump for it, and than be glad they 'owned the libs'. Because they are in a Trump cult. It's a cult, and I am GOBSMACKED THAT WE ALLOWED THIS TO HAPPEN!

The founding fathers have never predicted that we would elect a dictator to office, and PRAISE HIM AND WORSHIP HIM. Before you say none of you worship Trump, trust me, the cult will make sure to weed that out. I seen the cult DESTROY my state, and they are glad to do it more and more, and we have Mike Braun, a crazed idiot who worships Trump, READY TO WIN THE STATE, and than Texas and Florida and other states worship these ghouls. So yeah, I have no illusion Trump is losing. Because we're in four camps.

1. Vote for him.
2. I hate both sides so won't vote for either (FAR SMALLER THAN 1)
3. I hate Biden so i'll vote for Trump to punish him (Almost as large as 2)
4. I'll vote for Biden to stop a monster who wants to wipe out democracy (larger than 2 and 3, but maybe as big as 1.... and now is made smaller cause of 2 and 3.

So, hope the tens of thousands of guys in Michigan are now ready to help Trump flatten Gaza and kill even more children and civilians so Trump can then wipe out Ukraine and who knows who he'll pick next. Ya know, maybe Iraq, or Afghanistan again, hell CUBA hasn't been invaded in a long while. 2025 looks AMAZING with that project, huh?

He might not win. He might even get locked up, although I admit that's a thin hope.

But fool's hope is all we have, sometimes. I'm going to vote for Biden and keep fighting.

If he does win, though, I'll have to flee this country before they come for me. Guess as the election gets close i should figure out if I can afford to keep any of my books or DVDs.

Fuzzy Necromancer wrote: ↑Wed Apr 03, 2024 9:32 pm He might not win. He might even get locked up, although I admit that's a thin hope.

But fool's hope is all we have, sometimes. I'm going to vote for Biden and keep fighting.

If he does win, though, I'll have to flee this country before they come for me. Guess as the election gets close i should figure out if I can afford to keep any of my books or DVDs.

Look I was very doom posting there and I just want to state... my beef is with none of you guys. It's more... the general... everything. I witnessed this man do nothing but make everything worse between 2016 and 2020, actively FIGHT FOR A PLAGUE TO MURDER PEOPLE... and the fact he was not CURBSTOMPED in the 2020 election and is still in any fighting distance of 2024... this country... what makes tens of millions of people say 'yes, this is what we want. To suffer and be in utter agony... as long as someone I never met is SLIGHTLY worse off than me.' What broke them?

Nobody700 wrote: ↑Wed Apr 03, 2024 9:36 pmWhat broke them?

Their parents, peers and upbringing and, maybe ironically, the same things that are bothering you, except coming from a different angle due to the former.