The game is definitely looking great. Also looks like they shoved that guy's face front of view just to let everyone know that this isn't going to be Andromeda
More interested to see if there's a good story behind this one though. So far we have what looks like a mish-mash setting of Attack on Titan, Destiny and the mechs from Titanfall 2 with a middle-eastern vibe for the city. Hopefully we can get a bit of Drew Karpyshyn on top of that.
In regards to a post-mortem on Andromeda, a youtuber I came across called YongYea put some great content together on everything that went wrong.
I had hopes for Andromeda, but started to get worried when pretty much the core team that developed the last few games were all gone and now it's..basically a shell of what could be. It was rushed and mismanaged so badly, you wonder how this could of happened. So many things went wrong with this
"Adapt, Overcome & Improvise"
"There's a fine line between not listening and not caring...I like to think I walk that line everyday of my life."
excalibur wrote:I had hopes for Andromeda, but started to get worried when pretty much the core team that developed the last few games were all gone and now it's..basically a shell of what could be. It was rushed and mismanaged so badly, you wonder how this could of happened. So many things went wrong with this
What do you think it could be and how do you think the story and setting compare to the original trilogy?
"I am to liquor what the Crocodile Hunter is to Alligators." - Afroman
My hardware is 10 years old at this point, so I doubt I'll be playing Andromeda any time soon. I finally got around to ME3 last week, though, and have been trying to think of how to summarize my mixed feelings on the matter. It's kind of cliche to say, "Not as bad as the internet outrage, but nevertheless disappointing compared to ME2", but the reason it's cliche is because it's kind of the truth.
It helps that I only bought the game three years after it came out, so I already had the 'Citadel' DLC installed with the game; I can totally understand the fan rage that the emotional core of an epic trilogy was a DLC (released months after the initial game) instead of part of the main game. With Citadel, it's the final charge into glory with your true companions. Without Citadel, ME3 is basically a plot-driven, paint by numbers find-the-phlebotinum action movie. I actually found myself resenting the slow-mo dream sequences with the annoyingly cute kid. You don't form an emotional bond with someone you meet for 30 seconds at the beginning of the game, and making it a kid you watch die is basically a cheap, calculated ploy to tug at the heart. If the catalyst needed a form we recognize, why settle on the unnamed kid instead of Ash/Kaidan, Anderson, Thane, or someone (anybody) else the audience might actually care about?
The thing is... even in the vanilla game, Bioware managed to get so many things right, that it made their flubs even more obvious. For example, all of the Wrex banters in Tchuchanka were perfect. Liara's sequence about the time capsules struck just the right balance. Mordin once again stole every scene he's in, and his death was moving enough that I forgave the plot-induced nature of it (the shroud is blowing up just enough to kill Mordin, but not blowing up so much that it is unable to distribute the cure across the entire planet)?
Likewise, the fall of Thessia was emotionally moving, but brought up another plot point that deserved more attention: if the Asari had access to that Prothean VI all this time, and Benezia of all people knew about it, isn't pretty much everything that happens since ME1 their fault? They knew (or should have known) far more than Shepherd ever did, and yet it never occurred to them that hey, maybe we should at least take the omnicidal eldritch abominations seriously even if we don't reveal how much we know? I can justify early skepticism in ME1, but after Sovereign just wrecked the hell out of the Citadel and nearly destroyed your fleet's flagship?
ME2's biggest weakness (relative to the series) was the stripped down RPG mechanics, and ME3 improved on that significantly. ME2's biggest strength, though, was the character development and emotional connection to the story; you felt invested in everything, and the closing sequence is one of the best endgames I've ever experienced. ME2's endgame was about maximizing the strengths of your squad and deploying your available resources as best you could; your team mattered, and your decisions mattered. ME3's endgame was about scoring enough points (war assets) to get the "good" ending, and then going on an extended, linear battle sequence before entering an extended cutscene that pretty much ignores all your friends or the consequences of the decisions you made across the X hours you invested in the franchise).
ETA: more specifically, I didn't like the paragon/renegade dichotomy in ME2 (where you have to be consistently one or the other in order to convince people in dialogue), and love the reputation system in ME3. That might be the biggest improvement in the series, even moreso than the combat mechanics. Also, the 'Shepherd stuck in the cockpit' bug in ME3 was one of the single most annoying and immersion-breaking bugs I've ever experienced, even though it was really easy to work around. Or maybe because it was so easy to work around, it annoyed me even more that it never got patched.
I've been enjoying Andromeda so far. Only get to play it twice a week since my Mom's the one with the PS4, and she, my step-dad, and brother live with it so naturally they get first dibs.
Granted, I started playing it after most of the animation patches had come out, but still.
My only real complaints so far are, 1: I don't like how (at least in your first interaction) you can't tell Suvi you don't believe in God without being a dick about it, and 2: it seems like ever since the last patch suddenly plant collection has stopped working. I get the vibrating control when my scanner is right on top of them, but I see and can collect nothing. I know it's a small thing in the grand scheme of the game and I doubt the plot will break because I can't get all the Andromeda plant samples, but still. It is annoying as fuck that I can't clear them off my mini-maps like I can with "Hitting rocks for science" and other types of side-quests.
Rocketboy1313 wrote:Everyone seems to be hung up on the ending. How about the 99% of the franchise that came before it? Cause I liked the writing as far as dialogue, world building, and imagery.
The ending is just the final "fuck you" that tells the fans how little respect the writing leads actually have for you. The reason it sucks is that it doesn't flow organically from everything you've done up to that point. That matters so freaking little because your'e just going to get there and then be given 3 choices, and they're the exact same three choices no matter what. What NEEDED to happen was that there was no choice at the end because you've already made all your choices. You've been interacting with this galaxy for a long time and you've been building up to that moment, so you don't need a final chance to press a button for a different ending.
Ultimately, it would be frustrating for people wanting to play out all the endings if it required full replays of 60 hours for slight variations. But it would also be satisfying to know that what you were doing ultimately built up to it. And built up to it in a natural way, following the thematic elements of the universe (which include things like cosmopolitanism, self-determination, and morally difficult questions).
Ultimately the failure actually does start with ME2 in terms of the writing. I think back to Mass Effect and the choice of the Rachni Queen. You've got in your power an incredible moral dilemmma-do you murder a potentially innocent being and commit a small genocide, or do you risk releasing a threat to galactic civilization? It's right out of "I Borg" on TNG. But right at the START of Mass Effect 2 you see this thrown in the wayside when Miranda flat out murders Wilson right in front of you. There's no, "Can we risk just tying this guy up and taking him with us to question later?" The extent that the writing explored it simply said, "Miranda is right and of course she didn't make a mistake and kill the wrong guy," and you weren't allowed to hold this against her anytime later in the plot. No exploration of any moral implications at all.
The other thing that happened in Mass Effect 2 is that the rails were so much more visible. In Mass Effect you routinely reported in to the council, but you were free to just turn the damn communication off at any point if you were tired of listening their crap. You were FORCED to listen to the freaking Illusive Man and answering every time he called, even though they gave you the "choice" of deciding you weren't really working for him. You just went everywhere he told you to go, did what he told you to do, and answered the phone every time he called. It was the start of the downfall of the series' writing.
Arkle wrote:I've been enjoying Andromeda so far. Only get to play it twice a week since my Mom's the one with the PS4, and she, my step-dad, and brother live with it so naturally they get first dibs.
Granted, I started playing it after most of the animation patches had come out, but still.
My only real complaints so far are, 1: I don't like how (at least in your first interaction) you can't tell Suvi you don't believe in God without being a dick about it, and 2: it seems like ever since the last patch suddenly plant collection has stopped working. I get the vibrating control when my scanner is right on top of them, but I see and can collect nothing. I know it's a small thing in the grand scheme of the game and I doubt the plot will break because I can't get all the Andromeda plant samples, but still. It is annoying as fuck that I can't clear them off my mini-maps like I can with "Hitting rocks for science" and other types of side-quests.
Andromeda is ultimately a fun experience for me personally though I won't call it the best in the series. Admittedly I enjoyed some of the Loyalty missions alot and I really took to being more of an explorer than a soldier.
Independent George wrote:Likewise, the fall of Thessia was emotionally moving, but brought up another plot point that deserved more attention: if the Asari had access to that Prothean VI all this time, and Benezia of all people knew about it, isn't pretty much everything that happens since ME1 their fault? They knew (or should have known) far more than Shepherd ever did, and yet it never occurred to them that hey, maybe we should at least take the omnicidal eldritch abominations seriously even if we don't reveal how much we know?
It's been a while (and I played ME3 a couple of times then spent a couple of years online roleplaying, so I suspect I've internalised a lot of headcanon without realising it) but I thought the Athame beacon only 'activated' and deployed its VI (was it Vendetta? Something starting with a V) because it 'sensed' the Cypher in Shep's brain (or Javik, if you took him along, I always did for that mission) - certainly it did something odd, since presumably normally it didn't blow its statue apart every time somebody poked it (if it did, the statue would have velcro at the seams to make it easier to put back, surely). So while Shep got the opportunity to ask direct questions and get straight answers from Vanessa, prior to that point the asari had been data-mining the raw code of the thing without even having a Rosetta stone to help them - given substantial effort, they got enough fragments of basic Prothean science to steer their own R&D towards the same path, thereby taking some of the error out of 'trial and error' and outpacing their contemporaries, but it was never so coherent that they could boot it up and click on reapersohgodweredoomed.txt
Independent George wrote:I actually found myself resenting the slow-mo dream sequences with the annoyingly cute kid.
Oh my god yes. Not just the stock emotional manipulation of it (although the use of the kid was so obnoxious that I was already getting snarky at him during dream one - "Seriously kid, don't try to guilt trip me for not saving you, if you'd had the brainpower to do what Shepard The Omni-Saviour told you to do and follow me, you'd be safe on Normandy and wearing a DLC hoodie right now!") but having to sit through a generic dream sequence so I could be told Shepard's emotional state. I mean... I'm the player, if I want to Shep be upset at not being able to save everyone, I'll pick the "I had to leave so many people behind..." option next time she's having a heart-to-heart with Liara. Really got frustrated at that.
MissKittyFantastico wrote:Oh my god yes. Not just the stock emotional manipulation of it (although the use of the kid was so obnoxious that I was already getting snarky at him during dream one - "Seriously kid, don't try to guilt trip me for not saving you, if you'd had the brainpower to do what Shepard The Omni-Saviour told you to do and follow me, you'd be safe on Normandy and wearing a DLC hoodie right now!") but having to sit through a generic dream sequence so I could be told Shepard's emotional state. I mean... I'm the player, if I want to Shep be upset at not being able to save everyone, I'll pick the "I had to leave so many people behind..." option next time she's having a heart-to-heart with Liara. Really got frustrated at that.
Honestly, that's the main problem in the series. In the first game, you really do feel like you own the character of Shephard. It's much easier to get into his/her shoes then than in the followups. The series starts gradually taking the character away from you, especially in the third game, which is when the series failed.
bronnt wrote:
Ultimately the failure actually does start with ME2 in terms of the writing. I think back to Mass Effect and the choice of the Rachni Queen. You've got in your power an incredible moral dilemmma-do you murder a potentially innocent being and commit a small genocide, or do you risk releasing a threat to galactic civilization? It's right out of "I Borg" on TNG. But right at the START of Mass Effect 2 you see this thrown in the wayside when Miranda flat out murders Wilson right in front of you. There's no, "Can we risk just tying this guy up and taking him with us to question later?" The extent that the writing explored it simply said, "Miranda is right and of course she didn't make a mistake and kill the wrong guy," and you weren't allowed to hold this against her anytime later in the plot. No exploration of any moral implications at all.
I rather agree. Really it seems to me that ME2 was essentially a soft reboot, made to fit whatever vision someone in the creation process had for it, and that vision seemed to be "let's show the dark seedy underbelly of the ME universe." Between Omega being the new hub, the snubbing of the Citadel, and the weird way the writing kept making excuses for the evil shit Cerberus did in the first game (they were all rogue cells apparently), that just seems to be the case to me. Also the writers seemed to have a very skewed idea of what moral ambiguity is. Plus, we can already see in ME2 how little some of the choices in ME1 mattered, and that continued into ME3 in that it never really effected the story, not even the sub-plots, beyond some changes in window dressing.
