Dystopian Science Fiction only reinforces the real world Status Quo

[Thebestoftherest]

Okay I am lost, what going on here?

[KuudereKun]

I still say the argument is wrong because it makes a wild unjustifiable claim.

"Utopian fiction only reinforces the status quo by implying things will get better."

I justified my claim several times over.

I mean and I rebutted it to.

It's also funny because it's the same argument in TOMORROWLAND and Jenny fucking Nicholson (not exactly a harsh academic source) tore into it in her review of that movie. She's like, "1984 isn't aspirational. No one is going to read that and go 'wow, that's a really good idea.' It's a warning and gets you to think."

Completely missing the point.

I see no value in cautionary tales about how things could be worse when how things are right now needs to change or everyone on the Planet will die a slow painful and agonizing death.

[Riedquat]

I still say the argument is wrong because it makes a wild unjustifiable claim.

"Utopian fiction only reinforces the status quo by implying things will get better."

I justified my claim several times over.

I mean and I rebutted it to.

It's also funny because it's the same argument in TOMORROWLAND and Jenny fucking Nicholson (not exactly a harsh academic source) tore into it in her review of that movie. She's like, "1984 isn't aspirational. No one is going to read that and go 'wow, that's a really good idea.' It's a warning and gets you to think."

Completely missing the point.

I see no value in cautionary tales about how things could be worse when how things are right now needs to change or everyone on the Planet will die a slow painful and agonizing death.

Nope, not seeing that happening.

[CharlesPhipps]

I see no value in cautionary tales about how things could be worse when how things are right now needs to change or everyone on the Planet will die a slow painful and agonizing death.

The Handmaid's Tale has been a rallying cry for women against Far Right goals and done immeasurable good as an example of what could happen.

But you do you.

[KuudereKun]

I see no value in cautionary tales about how things could be worse when how things are right now needs to change or everyone on the Planet will die a slow painful and agonizing death.

The Handmaid's Tale has been a rallying cry for women against Far Right goals and done immeasurable good as an example of what could happen.

But you do you.

Which is not a good thing given how stupid it's understanding of the Far Right's goals is. No Evangelical Christina Fundamentalist would devise a system where the ones raising kids aren't their Biological mothers.

Intentionally or not it feeds into TERF rhetoric by imagining a world where the women who can't have children are more privileged then the women who can.

[hammerofglass]

I see no value in cautionary tales about how things could be worse when how things are right now needs to change or everyone on the Planet will die a slow painful and agonizing death.

The Handmaid's Tale has been a rallying cry for women against Far Right goals and done immeasurable good as an example of what could happen.

But you do you.

Which is not a good thing given how stupid it's understanding of the Far Right's goals is. No Evangelical Christina Fundamentalist would devise a system where the ones raising kids aren't their Biological mothers.

Intentionally or not it feeds into TERF rhetoric by imagining a world where the women who can't have children are more privileged then the women who can.

It came out in 1985 based on stuff that happened just a few years before. Evangelicals and TERFs respectfully didn't even have those talking points yet.

[KuudereKun]

I see no value in cautionary tales about how things could be worse when how things are right now needs to change or everyone on the Planet will die a slow painful and agonizing death.

The Handmaid's Tale has been a rallying cry for women against Far Right goals and done immeasurable good as an example of what could happen.

But you do you.

Which is not a good thing given how stupid it's understanding of the Far Right's goals is. No Evangelical Christina Fundamentalist would devise a system where the ones raising kids aren't their Biological mothers.

Intentionally or not it feeds into TERF rhetoric by imagining a world where the women who can't have children are more privileged then the women who can.

It came out in 1985 based on stuff that happened just a few years before. Evangelicals and TERFs respectfully didn't even have those talking points yet.

Evangelicals still have talking points that would literally result in that. But their obsession with opposing Abortion and working with Second Wave Feminists to oppose Porn was absolutely a thing in the 80s already.

[KuudereKun]

I've added a section on The Handmaiden's Tale to the original Blog Post

Update August 2024: Strangely a lot of the Pushback I've been getting in certain are people who really want to defend the subversive value of The Handmaiden's Tale. Besides how the basic thesis of this post definitely still applies I have additional problems with that one.

I think it was Sophie From Mars who did a video "debunking" the TERF reading of The Handmaiden's Tale and how the author herself said she doesn't support TERFs. But as an assigned Male at birth Gender Fluid person I still feel personally attacked by a premise where the infertile women are somehow more privileged then the fertile women. Intentional or not there is a natural solidarity with the TERF mindset in that.

The way I see it, if the proposed inciting incident of The Handmaiden's Tale actually happened and actually result in some type of Patriarchal Fascist society, whether it was a Religious Fascism or a Secular Fascism it would result in the infertile women being either experimented or allowed to continue living only as prostitutes if they're attractive enough. Just like what would probably happen to Trans Women and Intersex people.

And even if they did decide to create a system where the infertile women are largely raising the children born by the fertile women. It would still be done in a way that frames them as servants of the biological mothers.

The thing about the Sarah and Hagar situation that this book imagined as the Biblical justification for this whole system is that I happen to know a lot about how Fundamentalist Christians think as one who was once partly in that world. And they always look at that as a cautionary tale of why you shouldn't do something like that. And to me the text of Genesis is clearly presenting it as a cautionary tale but probably not for the reasons these conservatives think it was.

So in essence The Handmaiden's Tale isn't even plausible to me as a cautionary tale, it's just a dystopic fantasy predicated on a misunderstanding of how Patriarchy actually works.

[hammerofglass]

Impregnating your wife's slave because she can't get pregnant is justified in Gilead from Jocob and Rachel forcing Bilhah to have children for them, not Abraham and Sarah doing the same to Hagar. Worked out a lot better for them.

The biggest flaw with the TERF reading in my mind is that all the trans people in Gilead got executed with the rest of the "gender traitors".

[KuudereKun]

Impregnating your wife's slave because she can't get pregnant is justified in Gilead from Jocob and Rachel forcing Bilhah to have children for them, not Abraham and Sarah doing the same to Hagar. Worked out a lot better for them.

The biggest flaw with the TERF reading in my mind is that all the trans people in Gilead got executed with the rest of the "gender traitors".

Rachel and Bilhah is the same scenario but on a smaller scale, it result in Dan the generally least well depicted Tribe.

And I agree about the Gender Traitor thing, I just suspect Infertile Cis Women would get the same treatment even if they'd label it differently.