Star Wars Canon Debate

[Mecha82]

I'd argue that it's because the Legends Canon was the only real lifeline that the fans had to the franchise considering that Lucas took years to release the prequel trilogy and explain the Clone Wars; until that time the only Star Wars media that fans had where the comics, books, and some bad to mediocre TV shows and movies. Thankfully, the Thrawn Trilogy was able to reinvigorate the franchise but, in some ways Thrawn was to good and Lucas basically flooded the market with so much Star Wars media that the canon became almost impenetrable to the average fan.
Heck, I remember obsessively collecting all of the essential guides and going on Wookiepedia binges so I could understand every aspect of the Star Wars universe and have a leg up on my friends whenever we discussed Star Wars. However, when Disney announced that they where making the Sequel trilogy all that knowledge I had gathered became unnecessary and I admit that I felt disappointed but, I was happy that there would be more movies and that new people would be able to streamline the franchise. The problem was that not everyone felt like that, and the hardcore Legends fandom felt betrayed and developed into a bitter subculture within the fandom and we haven't recovered since.

Are you still happy with the new people and some of the old guard acting like idiots on social media?

I'm just happy that Star Wars still exists and for the most part I figure that I'll wait another 15-20 years for the fandom to die down. If anything I'm just tired of the cottage industry that's developed on YouTube to cash in on the Last Jedi "outrage" and the pettiness of some of the old guard's membership. Also, the most extreme elements of the fandom have always had a tendency to act like idiots and it won't stop anytime soon.

Kathleen K went radio silent and they are in retreat on new projects. It is real outrage.

What are the big before TFA examples?

Considering how some entitled and toxic fans have been acting I can't blame Kathleen Kennedy from going "radio silent". Linkara did rant against harassing people involved with work of fiction that one doesn't like in social media in his latest videos (Cassandra Caintrospective 3-1 and 3-2) and he is spot on with that rant while himself still being able to be critical and brutally honest towards work itself. Not liking some work of fiction isn't valid reason to act that way towards those involved. Then again nothing justifies behavior like that.

[Yukaphile]

Let's not pretend their attitudes are any better. Chuck Wendig flat-out told fans to "go write fanfiction," which even people who love and write fanfiction (like myself) will admit the majority of it is low-brow, and most people consider it low-brow. I get it, there's a huge flood of angry fanboys coming at them, but they act as if there's no legitimate criticisms in what they say past the right-wing trolls and the racism and sexism. So in effect they are ignoring the cult fans and focusing on the movie audiences that make them money. Legends fans are only given "token" gestures because the movies make more money, and that's what they care about.

[Mecha82]

I am sorry if this angers you but I disagree. It's better because they aren't harassing others in social media over something petty. Them telling fans to write fanfiction doesn't harm anyone unlike harassing people in social media does. Look while I was once angry over something similar said by Matt Ward to criticism over Chaos Demon Codex written by him being OP even back then I felt that behavior like that isn't justified. Also people that act that way make it more difficult for any legitimate criticism to be taken seriously.

At end of day they goal is to make money. Not to please vocal group of fans that feel entitled to demand that they are given what they want and only what they want that have read every novel, comic book and source book from Legends but to appeal to much bigger group of audience that doesn't care about all that and just want to enjoy movies and maybe even animated shows like TCW and Rebels.

Then again while I admit that it feels pointless I am trying to be voice of reason and I feel tired because it feels pointless but I have had to keep doing it time after time. Because of it I won't be even reading this thread anymore or bothering with your other thread on similar topic that you had made.

[Yukaphile]

Yeah, I can agree with your last part. Represent your franchise better. I saw people dropping the N-bomb on the stormtrooper in 2015 in the video for the trailer, and it sickened me. "How can a n***** be a stormtrooper?" Disgusting. Those people make it harder. And make their goals of having Legends validated even harder. I don't deny that. Hell, there's even legit criticism to that guy's complaint, however atrocious his slur was. I've seen people wonder how he was black given they assumed most of the stormtroopers were versions of the clone troopers, when they actually came from Imperial flight academies. So there is a way to combat this with logic. But when somebody drops that N-bomb, you're not gonna care enough to wanna debate them so much as verbally rape, flay, and eviscerate and then nuke them for good measure.

Yeah, but there's no reason they can't make Legends TV shows or cartoons. They will never do so under the new administration because of their own hypocrisies when comparing Legends to what think is a more respectable and mainstream continuity, and that's sad. Imagine a cartoon series about the Yuuzhan Vong War? There's so much potential here those assholes are not fulfilling. It is about making money, yes. And it's something Chuck touched up on in his look at George Lucas, that at what point does art cease being about art and belong to the people and not the creator? For Star Trek and Star Wars, I think that time is now. It should be in the public domain.

[Elderdog]

I'd argue that it's because the Legends Canon was the only real lifeline that the fans had to the franchise considering that Lucas took years to release the prequel trilogy and explain the Clone Wars; until that time the only Star Wars media that fans had where the comics, books, and some bad to mediocre TV shows and movies. Thankfully, the Thrawn Trilogy was able to reinvigorate the franchise but, in some ways Thrawn was to good and Lucas basically flooded the market with so much Star Wars media that the canon became almost impenetrable to the average fan.
Heck, I remember obsessively collecting all of the essential guides and going on Wookiepedia binges so I could understand every aspect of the Star Wars universe and have a leg up on my friends whenever we discussed Star Wars. However, when Disney announced that they where making the Sequel trilogy all that knowledge I had gathered became unnecessary and I admit that I felt disappointed but, I was happy that there would be more movies and that new people would be able to streamline the franchise. The problem was that not everyone felt like that, and the hardcore Legends fandom felt betrayed and developed into a bitter subculture within the fandom and we haven't recovered since.

Are you still happy with the new people and some of the old guard acting like idiots on social media?

I'm just happy that Star Wars still exists and for the most part I figure that I'll wait another 15-20 years for the fandom to die down. If anything I'm just tired of the cottage industry that's developed on YouTube to cash in on the Last Jedi "outrage" and the pettiness of some of the old guard's membership. Also, the most extreme elements of the fandom have always had a tendency to act like idiots and it won't stop anytime soon.

Kathleen K went radio silent and they are in retreat on new projects. It is a real outrage.

What are the big before TFA examples?

As far as the new projects are concerned the next major batch of movies that are coming out are going to be around 2022 and there's also The Mandolorian and the 7th Season of Clone Wars. As far as pre- TFA examples are concerned the fandom treated Ahmed Best and Jake Lloyd horribly to the point where Ahmed Best considered killing himself and Jake Lloyd gave up acting due to being bullied about his role in the movie. If you need confirmation I'm going to be putting the relevant articles below.
https://www.bbc.com/news/entertainment-arts-44708983
https://web.archive.org/web/20120312032 ... s-for-good
https://www.ign.com/articles/2019/02/26 ... wars-movie
There was also some backlash against the Ewoks that probably soured George Lucas's relationship with the fandom.
Also, in regards to Kathleen Kennedy I can't really blame her for going radio silent considering that some people lose all sense of decorum when they can hide behind a twitter account.

[Yukaphile]

I don't trust them on any Legends projects because Star Wars is being manned by incompetent idiots who only care about the bottom line. I suspected it in 2015 after Legends was quickly thrown out like trash simply so they could rush a ripoff movie that felt like a complete remake to satisfy seething original trilogy fanboys, then had it confirmed with everything they've done since then, like changing directors for some weird reason. Seems more like corporate power and abuse of elite privileges than about storytelling.

[Karha of Honor]

I'd argue that it's because the Legends Canon was the only real lifeline that the fans had to the franchise considering that Lucas took years to release the prequel trilogy and explain the Clone Wars; until that time the only Star Wars media that fans had where the comics, books, and some bad to mediocre TV shows and movies. Thankfully, the Thrawn Trilogy was able to reinvigorate the franchise but, in some ways Thrawn was to good and Lucas basically flooded the market with so much Star Wars media that the canon became almost impenetrable to the average fan.
Heck, I remember obsessively collecting all of the essential guides and going on Wookiepedia binges so I could understand every aspect of the Star Wars universe and have a leg up on my friends whenever we discussed Star Wars. However, when Disney announced that they where making the Sequel trilogy all that knowledge I had gathered became unnecessary and I admit that I felt disappointed but, I was happy that there would be more movies and that new people would be able to streamline the franchise. The problem was that not everyone felt like that, and the hardcore Legends fandom felt betrayed and developed into a bitter subculture within the fandom and we haven't recovered since.

Are you still happy with the new people and some of the old guard acting like idiots on social media?

I'm just happy that Star Wars still exists and for the most part I figure that I'll wait another 15-20 years for the fandom to die down. If anything I'm just tired of the cottage industry that's developed on YouTube to cash in on the Last Jedi "outrage" and the pettiness of some of the old guard's membership. Also, the most extreme elements of the fandom have always had a tendency to act like idiots and it won't stop anytime soon.

Kathleen K went radio silent and they are in retreat on new projects. It is real outrage.

What are the big before TFA examples?

Considering how some entitled and toxic fans have been acting I can't blame Kathleen Kennedy from going "radio silent". Linkara did rant against harassing people involved with work of fiction that one doesn't like in social media in his latest videos (Cassandra Caintrospective 3-1 and 3-2) and he is spot on with that rant while himself still being able to be critical and brutally honest towards work itself. Not liking some work of fiction isn't valid reason to act that way towards those involved. Then again nothing justifies behavior like that.

People hated Ahsoka early on but Dave Filoni did not go radio silent.
Considering how much crap they watched are SW fans even entitled?

Let's not pretend their attitudes are any better. Chuck Wendig flat-out told fans to "go write fanfiction," which even people who love and write fanfiction (like myself) will admit the majority of it is low-brow, and most people consider it low-brow. I get it, there's a huge flood of angry fanboys coming at them, but they act as if there's no legitimate criticisms in what they say past the right-wing trolls and the racism and sexism. So in effect they are ignoring the cult fans and focusing on the movie audiences that make them money. Legends fans are only given "token" gestures because the movies make more money, and that's what they care about.

So you cannot be right wing and dislike the new SW?

[Yukaphile]

Why you still responding to me, um... Mr. Honor? You blocked me. I saw.

Nevertheless, most of the loudest noise I see is coming from right-wingers. And for all the wrong reasons. Complaining about gender and racial differences when honestly, that should be secondary to the story and plot. Original Star Wars heavily favored white men, but that does not mean the story and characters were weak. It's just in the absence of a strong story with engaging characters, right-wingers focus on the bullshit superficial stuff that doesn't matter. Not that extreme left-wingers don't, because they are the biggest party responsible for the stigmatization of white people, but regardless, the loudest, stupidest kind of hate is coming from right-wingers. Like the hate against Kelly Marie Tran for her race and gender. Calling her a "dumb and autistic jungle retard." I hate political correctness, of course, but damn, that's just savage. That person meant to hurt somebody as much as possible.

[Yukaphile]

Kathleen Kennedy going on radio silence is NOT a damned good idea. Especially since Last Jedi was so divisive. It makes them look like thin-skinned, uptight cowards. And how they are ever going to get a pulse on fandom if they don't do that? She talked about an Old Republic project, but that's frankly terrifying to me. It's literally a case of nobody wins. I could very easily see them making dumb mistakes that won't win them any fans. Like, let's assume this is a KOTOR movie. Okay then. With Revan and everything. But then the big problem thus arises, what continuity is this? Is this an adaptation that shoves the first game to the side? The first game had enormous interactive freedom, a movie will not, so already a lot of fans will be put off by that. If it's canon, then why not do something new, like say, make Revan female or black? A reboot should be about exploring the unlimited possibilities of a universe, and I know the right-wing trolls would tear them apart for making Revan a black female, but come on, they've shown they publicly don't care about right-wingers, so do it, take a stand. However, if it's basically just KOTOR repackaged into a movie or even a new game format, but simply part of the "new canon," that does nothing past making a very cynical, sleazy marketing move designed to try and boost sales at the least amount of effort, which is what I've seen from them in recent years so yes, it feels like nobody will win no matter what they do, but they're not making it any easier on themselves.

[BridgeConsoleMasher]

Why you still responding to me, um... Mr. Honor? You blocked me. I saw.

This is like the 5th time you've brought up that he's blocked you.

When you put somebody on the foe list, their post turns into a caption just saying that they posted something. It gives you an option to read the message right there. Blocking people is just a means being able to read the blocked person's message at your own discretion.