Sfdebris.net

McAvoy wrote: ↑Sun Jun 09, 2024 3:21 am Like why was there a need to include the Mirror universe anyway. The show already had a decent storyline going. War with the Klingons and us following Michael who committed a mutiny who started the war. Also having the war from the Klingon's point of view.

I strongly suspect when they were writing it was the other way around; they started with the mirror universe stuff and built the rest of the plot around it. The war just gets you there and justifies the "The Federation Turns to the Terran Emperor and her Evil Plan" last arc.

Also something I forgot to mention in my own postmortem: Emperor Phillipa Georgiou is an absolute delight of a character and Michelle Yeoh steals every scene she's in.

McAvoy wrote: ↑Sun Jun 09, 2024 3:21 am Its not about the why they did it in the show itself (in show) but why they needed to have it from a writer's or producer view.

Like why was there a need to include the Mirror universe anyway. The show already had a decent storyline going. War with the Klingons and us following Michael who committed a mutiny who started the war. Also having the war from the Klingon's point of view.

Cause war with the Klingons and the Mutineer was the Bryan Fuller's (the first writer) story, when Discovery was going to be an anthology series, with the second season going to be a different show. Berg and Haberts pulled things in a different direction (though it is supposedly true to Fuller's vision).

hammerofglass wrote: ↑Sun Jun 09, 2024 11:22 am

McAvoy wrote: ↑Sun Jun 09, 2024 3:21 am Like why was there a need to include the Mirror universe anyway. The show already had a decent storyline going. War with the Klingons and us following Michael who committed a mutiny who started the war. Also having the war from the Klingon's point of view.

I strongly suspect when they were writing it was the other way around; they started with the mirror universe stuff and built the rest of the plot around it. The war just gets you there and justifies the "The Federation Turns to the Terran Emperor and her Evil Plan" last arc.

Also something I forgot to mention in my own postmortem: Emperor Phillipa Georgiou is an absolute delight of a character and Michelle Yeoh steals every scene she's in.

I half agree with ya, I think michelle Yeoh is a WONDERFUL actress and more of her is great. But I hated emperor Georgiou. What a try hard character I could never take seriously with her cringe lines and even cringier behavior. I ZERO blame Yeoh, she CAN make this kind of character work... just not with what she's given.

McAvoy wrote: ↑Sun Jun 09, 2024 3:21 am

BridgeConsoleMasher wrote: ↑Sun Jun 09, 2024 2:52 am

McAvoy wrote: ↑Sat Jun 08, 2024 6:05 am Spore Drive. Why was this necessary in Discovery? I just never got it. Like I said, it just felt like they tacked on a super power to the ship that no other ship had to make the ship different.

The idea in the first season was that experiments were being done by a renegade exploiting the federation to get back home.

The next season used it as a casual device to help them discover new worlds more easily and also have a little bit of drama on its own with Stamitz and his development of it.

In the future it was useful in giving Discovery the edge on hyper travel given the outcome of the burn. The federation had become highly disenfranchised and Discovery's arrival changes a lot of things for them.

Its not about the why they did it in the show itself (in show) but why they needed to have it from a writer's or producer view.

Like why was there a need to include the Mirror universe anyway. The show already had a decent storyline going. War with the Klingons and us following Michael who committed a mutiny who started the war. Also having the war from the Klingon's point of view.

I don't think this is nitpicking IMO. Nitpicking would be like complaining why the uniforms were so different or how did that saucer spin like it did when they spun up (literally) that drive.

I know it's kind of written episode by episode, but I like following the show and shaping it as a parallel for our times. Every star trek show has a different rendition of allegory and particular components change from one to the other. Klingons for instance depict the colonial conquests of authoritarian socialist governments during the sixties, while in TNG they depicted post authoritarian allies as marked by the pivoting events of STVI. The mirror universe otoh I think resembled McCarthyism of the era, while here I think it could resemble something similar in modern times you can kind of see it as a metaphor as a metaphor for post 9/11 Patriot act America.

So, thinking more about the last season, and I really did like the Breen being a prime antagonist. Though I think someone here asked earlier if it was some sort of reveal, but I thought they showed them with their masks on and off in one of the first episodes?

BridgeConsoleMasher wrote: ↑Sun Jun 16, 2024 5:06 pm So, thinking more about the last season, and I really did like the Breen being a prime antagonist. Though I think someone here asked earlier if it was some sort of reveal, but I thought they showed them with their masks on and off in one of the first episodes?

Well yeah, we saw what's his name's face in episode 1. The reveal was that he was a Breen. So that is what a Breen looks like. Honestly, I never had an idea what I thought a Breen would look like, but I would not have thought they looked like that.

For some reason I thought they would be blue, but that's it.

BridgeConsoleMasher wrote: ↑Sun Jun 16, 2024 5:06 pm So, thinking more about the last season, and I really did like the Breen being a prime antagonist. Though I think someone here asked earlier if it was some sort of reveal, but I thought they showed them with their masks on and off in one of the first episodes?

I think I was the one to bring up if the Breen face thing even mattered, and frankly... just felt odd to do so. On the one hand, I like the concept and hey, they remember the Breen... but dunno, it feels underwhelming. Like... they just have fluid faces. That's it?

The face thing mattered in that he showed his face to outsiders. That he was a Breen before he was revealed to be a Breen. They never explained why their face is transparent and his isn't.

I think this season could have benefited from more episodes exploring the relationship. To give the audience an idea why it was so important.

McAvoy wrote: ↑Mon Jun 17, 2024 11:25 pm

BridgeConsoleMasher wrote: ↑Sun Jun 16, 2024 5:06 pm So, thinking more about the last season, and I really did like the Breen being a prime antagonist. Though I think someone here asked earlier if it was some sort of reveal, but I thought they showed them with their masks on and off in one of the first episodes?

Well yeah, we saw what's his name's face in episode 1. The reveal was that he was a Breen. So that is what a Breen looks like. Honestly, I never had an idea what I thought a Breen would look like, but I would not have thought they looked like that.

For some reason I thought they would be blue, but that's it.

I wouldn’t really call that a narrative or tropic reveal though.


Either way you are answering my sentiment. Though if you want to discuss it as either a “reveal” or not then that’s fine.


The borg in season 3 of Picard showed up about half way through and had a shock score tune and everything. This is just kind of the first scene that the two characters are in. And it just kind of plays out. We already can tell they are Breen before they take off their helmets.

Nobody700 wrote: ↑Mon Jun 17, 2024 11:43 pm

BridgeConsoleMasher wrote: ↑Sun Jun 16, 2024 5:06 pm So, thinking more about the last season, and I really did like the Breen being a prime antagonist. Though I think someone here asked earlier if it was some sort of reveal, but I thought they showed them with their masks on and off in one of the first episodes?

I think I was the one to bring up if the Breen face thing even mattered, and frankly... just felt odd to do so. On the one hand, I like the concept and hey, they remember the Breen... but dunno, it feels underwhelming. Like... they just have fluid faces. That's it?

Well his face was all hydrated only in the scene where they meet and not in any other chronological following.

The indication being that they probably keep their helmets on indefinitely and electively like the mandalorians. In the first scene with him he is already dried out and we never see him replenish, which tells us about both him and the other Breen.