Force Awakens editor making waves

[Captain Crimson]

Maybe you would care more if you saw it as I did? It's creative theft. Not legal theft, mind you, since they own the IP. They can strip it down for parts all they want to. But at the end of the day, it is also diminishing and cheapening a lot of art. Art that was made tailored to a singular vision, and not only what was merely popular and sells well either. You also strike me as if you didn't explore much past a few EU novels. I love plenty many more than those you listed. Matt Stover, Drew Karpyshyn, Kevin J. Anderson, Jude Watson, James Luceno, etc... and I could name many more.

Yeah, I don't see issue in what you call "creative theft". I guess it's becaue I have been liking how they have been using those elements from old EU. Funny that you mentioned those authors because only one from those who I remember is Kevin J. Anderson and I don't like his work. Like at all. Yes, that's how much I hate Dark Apprentice. I can only assume that others wrote so forgetable stories that they names didn't stick to my mind.

Well, it's the larger issue. They spin a yarn about how the old EU was never canon, which is fine if people like Ms. Kennedy want to say that. For the simple reason she was not familiar with the lore. The long-time workers such as Mr. Hidalgo saying that, though, when there's quotes of him referring to people in the EU as past and treating it that way, does not hold up. As to what they put into the canon, well, it wouldn't be such a huge issue if this existed at the expense of the older continuity. So that it is supplanting it. That is probably where you get accusations that they are SJWs. Like gender-swapping and race-lifting. Seriously, RO is the Death Star novel meets the Dark Forces books. Is it fun? Sure! But it's also replacing the male lead, Kyle Katarn, with a girl. And when they openly boast about that stuff, you can't help but notice. Probably where the trolls make genuine criticism hard, since they drown it out.

I just wish they could keep calling the EU what it was, "canon for its time." And continue work on it. Even Mr. Hidalgo had said if you were going to reboot it, that occasionally you could return to it. But they do not even do that. Despite obvious fan demand, and thousands of dollars raised. No, it doesn't have to be anything huge or special, but TOR updates and one single comic released in six years is too little for too many people. It would ease a lot of fan anxieties if they were to say they need to catch up on the EU, and let the new authors have a crack at it alongside the older ones. They said wait until the movies were done, which was a polite brush-off, I think, since they intended for it to continue for years. Now I loved #108. I think in terms of continuity, it was greatly handled. They could easily keep doing the same thing. I don't get why they don't.

I think LF was handed over to people who had no idea to the sheer depth and density of the lore, and it felt overwhelming. So discontinuing it and throwing in easter eggs makes sense in a cruel corporate way. But at the same time, stuff they say doesn't help their case and what they tell fans. Ms. Kennedy says they want their own creative liberties. But then with how much they've taken from the EU, why didn't they keep it around to fill in the gaps? It would have done a splendid job. So why isn't it getting continued? I think for a simple reason. They really ARE unoriginal. Or perhaps lazy. What other SF do you like? You could construct so much possibilities from all you know about it. But the less you know, how effective do you would be if you were brought on and had certain marks to hit, that really hindered your creative process? I think that's what we're seeing play out, and that only people with a certain political mindset are allowed to work there so they can't be accused of being racist and sexist and what have you. Everything Ms. Kennedy says to their version of SW, in contrast to the EU, strikes me as psychological projection. Mr. Lucas's management was the one to usher in true creative freedom, not hers, and everything they wish theirs to be.

Well, you know what, while I can't speak to the other experiences you've had, I sense that you gave up sometime around the mid-nineties. And he was far from the only writer. For me personally, I think the EU hit its strongest peak in terms of storytelling, art, vision, and continuity from the late nineties to the mid aughts. The Darth Bane trilogy is well-regarded, and it's something one of the authors for the High Republic project is now looking to for inspiration, reportedly. So I would like to give you a few passages from two of those books.

Darth Bane: Path of Destruction

Dessel was lost in the suffering of his job, barely even aware of his surroundings. His arms ached from the endless pounding of the hydraulic jack. Small bits of rock skipped off the cavern wall as he bored through, ricocheting off his protective goggles and stinging his exposed face and hands. Clouds of atomized dust filled the air, obscuring his vision, and the screeching whine of the jack filled the cavern, drowning out all other sounds as it burrowed centimeter by agonizing centimeter into the thick vein of cortosis woven into the rock before him.

Impervious to both heat and energy, cortosis was prized in the construction of armor and shielding by both commercial and military interests, especially with the galaxy at war. Highly resistant to blaster bolts, cortosis alloys supposedly could withstand even the blade of a lightsaber. Unfortunately, the very properties that made it so valuable also made it extremely difficult to mine. Plasma torches were virtually useless; it would take days to burn away even a small section of cortosis-laced rock. The only effective way to mine it was through the brute force of hydraulic jacks pounding relentlessly away at a vein, chipping the cortosis free bit by bit.

Cortosis was one of the hardest materials in the galaxy. The force of the pounding quickly wore down the head of a jack, blunting it until it became almost useless. The dust clogged the hydraulic pistons, making them jam. Mining cortosis was hard on the equipment . . . and even harder on the miners.

Des had been hammering away for nearly six standard hours. The jack weighed more than thirty kilos, and the strain of keeping it raised and pressed against the rock face was taking its toll. His arms were trembling from the exertion. His lungs were gasping for air and choking on the clouds of fine mineral dust thrown up from the jack's head. Even his teeth hurt: the rattling vibration felt as if it were shaking them loose from his gums.

Darth Bane: Rule of Two

Darth Bane felt them long before he saw them.

Those ignorant in the ways of the Force saw it as only a weapon or tool: It could strike out against a foe in battle; it could levitate nearby objects and draw them into a waiting palm or fling them across a room. But these were mere wizard’s tricks to one who understood its true power and potential.

The Force was a part of all living things, and all living things were a part of the Force. It flowed through every being, every animal and creature, every tree and plant. The fundamental energies of life and death coursed through it, causing ripples in the very fabric of existence.

Even distracted by the agonizing flashes of the blades slicing apart the inside of his skull, Bane was sensitive to these ripples. They gave him an awareness that transcended space and even time, granting him brief glimpses into the always shifting possibilities of the future. That was how, still two kilometers and several minutes away from where Kaan and his army had made their camp, he knew others were already there.

There were eight in total, all human—six men and two women. Mercenaries who had signed on with the Brotherhood for credits and a chance to strike at the hated Republic, they had survived the final battle with Hoth’s troops. They had most likely fled the confrontation the instant Kaan had descended into the bowels of the planet’s surface to lay his trap for the Jedi, displaying the loyalty of all followers bought and paid for. And now, like blood beetles picking the rotting meat off a bantha’s corpse, they had come to scavenge whatever remnants of value they could find from the deserted Sith camp.

I mean, I hardly consider this forgettable. We should be able to have two continuities, not one that is supplanting the other, existing at the expense of the other one. For all their talk of being these huge Legends fans and that putting the references into their new canon is honoring it, it rings very hollow. This is coming from people who don't understand the lore they say they do. The same way they claim to be honoring Mr. Lucas, when we KNOW for a fact they'd rejected his story treatments, and possibly again during TROS production. And if they were following his vision, Ahsoka would be dead. That is a fine and dandy approach to take, really! I think many of us have a complicated love-hate relationship with George Lucas. If they felt they could do better why don't they say that? Stack that alongside the EU policies, and I sincerely hope you can see where I am coming from here. I don't think that they are honoring Mr. Lucas or the EU. And I want them to be more honest.

[Gekired]

Maybe you would care more if you saw it as I did? It's creative theft. Not legal theft, mind you, since they own the IP. They can strip it down for parts all they want to. But at the end of the day, it is also diminishing and cheapening a lot of art. Art that was made tailored to a singular vision, and not only what was merely popular and sells well either. You also strike me as if you didn't explore much past a few EU novels. I love plenty many more than those you listed. Matt Stover, Drew Karpyshyn, Kevin J. Anderson, Jude Watson, James Luceno, etc... and I could name many more.

Yeah, I don't see issue in what you call "creative theft". I guess it's becaue I have been liking how they have been using those elements from old EU. Funny that you mentioned those authors because only one from those who I remember is Kevin J. Anderson and I don't like his work. Like at all. Yes, that's how much I hate Dark Apprentice. I can only assume that others wrote so forgetable stories that they names didn't stick to my mind.

Well, it's the larger issue. They spin a yarn about how the old EU was never canon, which is fine if people like Ms. Kennedy want to say that. For the simple reason she was not familiar with the lore. The long-time workers such as Mr. Hidalgo saying that, though, when there's quotes of him referring to people in the EU as past and treating it that way, does not hold up. As to what they put into the canon, well, it wouldn't be such a huge issue if this existed at the expense of the older continuity. So that it is supplanting it. That is probably where you get accusations that they are SJWs. Like gender-swapping and race-lifting. Seriously, RO is the Death Star novel meets the Dark Forces books. Is it fun? Sure! But it's also replacing the male lead, Kyle Katarn, with a girl. And when they openly boast about that stuff, you can't help but notice. Probably where the trolls make genuine criticism hard, since they drown it out.

I just wish they could keep calling the EU what it was, "canon for its time." And continue work on it. Even Mr. Hidalgo had said if you were going to reboot it, that occasionally you could return to it. But they do not even do that. Despite obvious fan demand, and thousands of dollars raised. No, it doesn't have to be anything huge or special, but TOR updates and one single comic released in six years is too little for too many people. It would ease a lot of fan anxieties if they were to say they need to catch up on the EU, and let the new authors have a crack at it alongside the older ones. They said wait until the movies were done, which was a polite brush-off, I think, since they intended for it to continue for years. Now I loved #108. I think in terms of continuity, it was greatly handled. They could easily keep doing the same thing. I don't get why they don't.

I think LF was handed over to people who had no idea to the sheer depth and density of the lore, and it felt overwhelming. So discontinuing it and throwing in easter eggs makes sense in a cruel corporate way. But at the same time, stuff they say doesn't help their case and what they tell fans. Ms. Kennedy says they want their own creative liberties. But then with how much they've taken from the EU, why didn't they keep it around to fill in the gaps? It would have done a splendid job. So why isn't it getting continued? I think for a simple reason. They really ARE unoriginal. Or perhaps lazy. What other SF do you like? You could construct so much possibilities from all you know about it. But the less you know, how effective do you would be if you were brought on and had certain marks to hit, that really hindered your creative process? I think that's what we're seeing play out, and that only people with a certain political mindset are allowed to work there so they can't be accused of being racist and sexist and what have you. Everything Ms. Kennedy says to their version of SW, in contrast to the EU, strikes me as psychological projection. Mr. Lucas's management was the one to usher in true creative freedom, not hers, and everything they wish theirs to be.

Well, you know what, while I can't speak to the other experiences you've had, I sense that you gave up sometime around the mid-nineties. And he was far from the only writer. For me personally, I think the EU hit its strongest peak in terms of storytelling, art, vision, and continuity from the late nineties to the mid aughts. The Darth Bane trilogy is well-regarded, and it's something one of the authors for the High Republic project is now looking to for inspiration, reportedly. So I would like to give you a few passages from two of those books.

Darth Bane: Path of Destruction

Dessel was lost in the suffering of his job, barely even aware of his surroundings. His arms ached from the endless pounding of the hydraulic jack. Small bits of rock skipped off the cavern wall as he bored through, ricocheting off his protective goggles and stinging his exposed face and hands. Clouds of atomized dust filled the air, obscuring his vision, and the screeching whine of the jack filled the cavern, drowning out all other sounds as it burrowed centimeter by agonizing centimeter into the thick vein of cortosis woven into the rock before him.

Impervious to both heat and energy, cortosis was prized in the construction of armor and shielding by both commercial and military interests, especially with the galaxy at war. Highly resistant to blaster bolts, cortosis alloys supposedly could withstand even the blade of a lightsaber. Unfortunately, the very properties that made it so valuable also made it extremely difficult to mine. Plasma torches were virtually useless; it would take days to burn away even a small section of cortosis-laced rock. The only effective way to mine it was through the brute force of hydraulic jacks pounding relentlessly away at a vein, chipping the cortosis free bit by bit.

Cortosis was one of the hardest materials in the galaxy. The force of the pounding quickly wore down the head of a jack, blunting it until it became almost useless. The dust clogged the hydraulic pistons, making them jam. Mining cortosis was hard on the equipment . . . and even harder on the miners.

Des had been hammering away for nearly six standard hours. The jack weighed more than thirty kilos, and the strain of keeping it raised and pressed against the rock face was taking its toll. His arms were trembling from the exertion. His lungs were gasping for air and choking on the clouds of fine mineral dust thrown up from the jack's head. Even his teeth hurt: the rattling vibration felt as if it were shaking them loose from his gums.

Darth Bane: Rule of Two

Darth Bane felt them long before he saw them.

Those ignorant in the ways of the Force saw it as only a weapon or tool: It could strike out against a foe in battle; it could levitate nearby objects and draw them into a waiting palm or fling them across a room. But these were mere wizard’s tricks to one who understood its true power and potential.

The Force was a part of all living things, and all living things were a part of the Force. It flowed through every being, every animal and creature, every tree and plant. The fundamental energies of life and death coursed through it, causing ripples in the very fabric of existence.

Even distracted by the agonizing flashes of the blades slicing apart the inside of his skull, Bane was sensitive to these ripples. They gave him an awareness that transcended space and even time, granting him brief glimpses into the always shifting possibilities of the future. That was how, still two kilometers and several minutes away from where Kaan and his army had made their camp, he knew others were already there.

There were eight in total, all human—six men and two women. Mercenaries who had signed on with the Brotherhood for credits and a chance to strike at the hated Republic, they had survived the final battle with Hoth’s troops. They had most likely fled the confrontation the instant Kaan had descended into the bowels of the planet’s surface to lay his trap for the Jedi, displaying the loyalty of all followers bought and paid for. And now, like blood beetles picking the rotting meat off a bantha’s corpse, they had come to scavenge whatever remnants of value they could find from the deserted Sith camp.

I mean, I hardly consider this forgettable. We should be able to have two continuities, not one that is supplanting the other, existing at the expense of the other one. For all their talk of being these huge Legends fans and that putting the references into their new canon is honoring it, it rings very hollow. This is coming from people who don't understand the lore they say they do. The same way they claim to be honoring Mr. Lucas, when we KNOW for a fact they'd rejected his story treatments, and possibly again during TROS production. And if they were following his vision, Ahsoka would be dead. That is a fine and dandy approach to take, really! I think many of us have a complicated love-hate relationship with George Lucas. If they felt they could do better why don't they say that? Stack that alongside the EU policies, and I sincerely hope you can see where I am coming from here. I don't think that they are honoring Mr. Lucas or the EU. And I want them to be more honest.

Hmmm while I feel Captain says everything here a million times better then I could. I will add this. I wouldn't mind the NEW EU so much if it wasn't so utter crap. Outside of a hand full of novels and funnily enough outside of Ashoka. the rest (The New Thrawn Trilogy, Lords of the Sith, Tarkin, Catalyst) were all written by old EU writers who all have a far better grasp of writing Star Wars then any of the new writers. I mean come on by this point in the old EU we had the Thrawn Trilogy, The Jedi Academy Trilogy, The X-wing Saga, Sarksaber, I,Jedi. Sure we had a far bit of crap but over all we had more good then bad.

In the new EU its the oppisite way round. A hand full of good with a majority of crap.

[Captain Crimson]

Maybe you would care more if you saw it as I did? It's creative theft. Not legal theft, mind you, since they own the IP. They can strip it down for parts all they want to. But at the end of the day, it is also diminishing and cheapening a lot of art. Art that was made tailored to a singular vision, and not only what was merely popular and sells well either. You also strike me as if you didn't explore much past a few EU novels. I love plenty many more than those you listed. Matt Stover, Drew Karpyshyn, Kevin J. Anderson, Jude Watson, James Luceno, etc... and I could name many more.

Yeah, I don't see issue in what you call "creative theft". I guess it's becaue I have been liking how they have been using those elements from old EU. Funny that you mentioned those authors because only one from those who I remember is Kevin J. Anderson and I don't like his work. Like at all. Yes, that's how much I hate Dark Apprentice. I can only assume that others wrote so forgetable stories that they names didn't stick to my mind.

Well, it's the larger issue. They spin a yarn about how the old EU was never canon, which is fine if people like Ms. Kennedy want to say that. For the simple reason she was not familiar with the lore. The long-time workers such as Mr. Hidalgo saying that, though, when there's quotes of him referring to people in the EU as past and treating it that way, does not hold up. As to what they put into the canon, well, it wouldn't be such a huge issue if this existed at the expense of the older continuity. So that it is supplanting it. That is probably where you get accusations that they are SJWs. Like gender-swapping and race-lifting. Seriously, RO is the Death Star novel meets the Dark Forces books. Is it fun? Sure! But it's also replacing the male lead, Kyle Katarn, with a girl. And when they openly boast about that stuff, you can't help but notice. Probably where the trolls make genuine criticism hard, since they drown it out.

I just wish they could keep calling the EU what it was, "canon for its time." And continue work on it. Even Mr. Hidalgo had said if you were going to reboot it, that occasionally you could return to it. But they do not even do that. Despite obvious fan demand, and thousands of dollars raised. No, it doesn't have to be anything huge or special, but TOR updates and one single comic released in six years is too little for too many people. It would ease a lot of fan anxieties if they were to say they need to catch up on the EU, and let the new authors have a crack at it alongside the older ones. They said wait until the movies were done, which was a polite brush-off, I think, since they intended for it to continue for years. Now I loved #108. I think in terms of continuity, it was greatly handled. They could easily keep doing the same thing. I don't get why they don't.

I think LF was handed over to people who had no idea to the sheer depth and density of the lore, and it felt overwhelming. So discontinuing it and throwing in easter eggs makes sense in a cruel corporate way. But at the same time, stuff they say doesn't help their case and what they tell fans. Ms. Kennedy says they want their own creative liberties. But then with how much they've taken from the EU, why didn't they keep it around to fill in the gaps? It would have done a splendid job. So why isn't it getting continued? I think for a simple reason. They really ARE unoriginal. Or perhaps lazy. What other SF do you like? You could construct so much possibilities from all you know about it. But the less you know, how effective do you would be if you were brought on and had certain marks to hit, that really hindered your creative process? I think that's what we're seeing play out, and that only people with a certain political mindset are allowed to work there so they can't be accused of being racist and sexist and what have you. Everything Ms. Kennedy says to their version of SW, in contrast to the EU, strikes me as psychological projection. Mr. Lucas's management was the one to usher in true creative freedom, not hers, and everything they wish theirs to be.

Well, you know what, while I can't speak to the other experiences you've had, I sense that you gave up sometime around the mid-nineties. And he was far from the only writer. For me personally, I think the EU hit its strongest peak in terms of storytelling, art, vision, and continuity from the late nineties to the mid aughts. The Darth Bane trilogy is well-regarded, and it's something one of the authors for the High Republic project is now looking to for inspiration, reportedly. So I would like to give you a few passages from two of those books.

Darth Bane: Path of Destruction

Dessel was lost in the suffering of his job, barely even aware of his surroundings. His arms ached from the endless pounding of the hydraulic jack. Small bits of rock skipped off the cavern wall as he bored through, ricocheting off his protective goggles and stinging his exposed face and hands. Clouds of atomized dust filled the air, obscuring his vision, and the screeching whine of the jack filled the cavern, drowning out all other sounds as it burrowed centimeter by agonizing centimeter into the thick vein of cortosis woven into the rock before him.

Impervious to both heat and energy, cortosis was prized in the construction of armor and shielding by both commercial and military interests, especially with the galaxy at war. Highly resistant to blaster bolts, cortosis alloys supposedly could withstand even the blade of a lightsaber. Unfortunately, the very properties that made it so valuable also made it extremely difficult to mine. Plasma torches were virtually useless; it would take days to burn away even a small section of cortosis-laced rock. The only effective way to mine it was through the brute force of hydraulic jacks pounding relentlessly away at a vein, chipping the cortosis free bit by bit.

Cortosis was one of the hardest materials in the galaxy. The force of the pounding quickly wore down the head of a jack, blunting it until it became almost useless. The dust clogged the hydraulic pistons, making them jam. Mining cortosis was hard on the equipment . . . and even harder on the miners.

Des had been hammering away for nearly six standard hours. The jack weighed more than thirty kilos, and the strain of keeping it raised and pressed against the rock face was taking its toll. His arms were trembling from the exertion. His lungs were gasping for air and choking on the clouds of fine mineral dust thrown up from the jack's head. Even his teeth hurt: the rattling vibration felt as if it were shaking them loose from his gums.

Darth Bane: Rule of Two

Darth Bane felt them long before he saw them.

Those ignorant in the ways of the Force saw it as only a weapon or tool: It could strike out against a foe in battle; it could levitate nearby objects and draw them into a waiting palm or fling them across a room. But these were mere wizard’s tricks to one who understood its true power and potential.

The Force was a part of all living things, and all living things were a part of the Force. It flowed through every being, every animal and creature, every tree and plant. The fundamental energies of life and death coursed through it, causing ripples in the very fabric of existence.

Even distracted by the agonizing flashes of the blades slicing apart the inside of his skull, Bane was sensitive to these ripples. They gave him an awareness that transcended space and even time, granting him brief glimpses into the always shifting possibilities of the future. That was how, still two kilometers and several minutes away from where Kaan and his army had made their camp, he knew others were already there.

There were eight in total, all human—six men and two women. Mercenaries who had signed on with the Brotherhood for credits and a chance to strike at the hated Republic, they had survived the final battle with Hoth’s troops. They had most likely fled the confrontation the instant Kaan had descended into the bowels of the planet’s surface to lay his trap for the Jedi, displaying the loyalty of all followers bought and paid for. And now, like blood beetles picking the rotting meat off a bantha’s corpse, they had come to scavenge whatever remnants of value they could find from the deserted Sith camp.

I mean, I hardly consider this forgettable. We should be able to have two continuities, not one that is supplanting the other, existing at the expense of the other one. For all their talk of being these huge Legends fans and that putting the references into their new canon is honoring it, it rings very hollow. This is coming from people who don't understand the lore they say they do. The same way they claim to be honoring Mr. Lucas, when we KNOW for a fact they'd rejected his story treatments, and possibly again during TROS production. And if they were following his vision, Ahsoka would be dead. That is a fine and dandy approach to take, really! I think many of us have a complicated love-hate relationship with George Lucas. If they felt they could do better why don't they say that? Stack that alongside the EU policies, and I sincerely hope you can see where I am coming from here. I don't think that they are honoring Mr. Lucas or the EU. And I want them to be more honest.

Hmmm while I feel Captain says everything here a million times better then I could. I will add this. I wouldn't mind the NEW EU so much if it wasn't so utter crap. Outside of a hand full of novels and funnily enough outside of Ashoka. the rest (The New Thrawn Trilogy, Lords of the Sith, Tarkin, Catalyst) were all written by old EU writers who all have a far better grasp of writing Star Wars then any of the new writers. I mean come on by this point in the old EU we had the Thrawn Trilogy, The Jedi Academy Trilogy, The X-wing Saga, Sarksaber, I,Jedi. Sure we had a far bit of crap but over all we had more good then bad.

In the new EU its the oppisite way round. A hand full of good with a majority of crap.

I would say that is because they solicited advice from Mr. Lucas. And we know that many of the new creators want to do just that. Or focus more upon the old EU - past easter eggs, I assume. Big issue there is there's so many factions at LF that can't steer the ship appropriate. You got the big Hollywood directors with all their vanity and ego, brought aboard to make a billion dollars, and no one is going to tell them what to do. You got the story group, that has been tragically underused and seems to me just to be there for PR and marketing purposes. You got the authors for the novels, with all their baggage or the stuff that makes them seem woefully out of depth. And you got the big studio suits and producers that don't understand a thing about the lore or fans. In short, I think the faction that wants to use him are drowned by those who think he is a liability. Perhaps that is why the new books lack stakes. I mean, even the YA novels for the old EU had stakes.

[Mecha82]

Maybe you would care more if you saw it as I did? It's creative theft. Not legal theft, mind you, since they own the IP. They can strip it down for parts all they want to. But at the end of the day, it is also diminishing and cheapening a lot of art. Art that was made tailored to a singular vision, and not only what was merely popular and sells well either. You also strike me as if you didn't explore much past a few EU novels. I love plenty many more than those you listed. Matt Stover, Drew Karpyshyn, Kevin J. Anderson, Jude Watson, James Luceno, etc... and I could name many more.

Yeah, I don't see issue in what you call "creative theft". I guess it's becaue I have been liking how they have been using those elements from old EU. Funny that you mentioned those authors because only one from those who I remember is Kevin J. Anderson and I don't like his work. Like at all. Yes, that's how much I hate Dark Apprentice. I can only assume that others wrote so forgetable stories that they names didn't stick to my mind.

Well, it's the larger issue. They spin a yarn about how the old EU was never canon, which is fine if people like Ms. Kennedy want to say that. For the simple reason she was not familiar with the lore. The long-time workers such as Mr. Hidalgo saying that, though, when there's quotes of him referring to people in the EU as past and treating it that way, does not hold up. As to what they put into the canon, well, it wouldn't be such a huge issue if this existed at the expense of the older continuity. So that it is supplanting it. That is probably where you get accusations that they are SJWs. Like gender-swapping and race-lifting. Seriously, RO is the Death Star novel meets the Dark Forces books. Is it fun? Sure! But it's also replacing the male lead, Kyle Katarn, with a girl. And when they openly boast about that stuff, you can't help but notice. Probably where the trolls make genuine criticism hard, since they drown it out.

I just wish they could keep calling the EU what it was, "canon for its time." And continue work on it. Even Mr. Hidalgo had said if you were going to reboot it, that occasionally you could return to it. But they do not even do that. Despite obvious fan demand, and thousands of dollars raised. No, it doesn't have to be anything huge or special, but TOR updates and one single comic released in six years is too little for too many people. It would ease a lot of fan anxieties if they were to say they need to catch up on the EU, and let the new authors have a crack at it alongside the older ones. They said wait until the movies were done, which was a polite brush-off, I think, since they intended for it to continue for years. Now I loved #108. I think in terms of continuity, it was greatly handled. They could easily keep doing the same thing. I don't get why they don't.

I think LF was handed over to people who had no idea to the sheer depth and density of the lore, and it felt overwhelming. So discontinuing it and throwing in easter eggs makes sense in a cruel corporate way. But at the same time, stuff they say doesn't help their case and what they tell fans. Ms. Kennedy says they want their own creative liberties. But then with how much they've taken from the EU, why didn't they keep it around to fill in the gaps? It would have done a splendid job. So why isn't it getting continued? I think for a simple reason. They really ARE unoriginal. Or perhaps lazy. What other SF do you like? You could construct so much possibilities from all you know about it. But the less you know, how effective do you would be if you were brought on and had certain marks to hit, that really hindered your creative process? I think that's what we're seeing play out, and that only people with a certain political mindset are allowed to work there so they can't be accused of being racist and sexist and what have you. Everything Ms. Kennedy says to their version of SW, in contrast to the EU, strikes me as psychological projection. Mr. Lucas's management was the one to usher in true creative freedom, not hers, and everything they wish theirs to be.

Well, you know what, while I can't speak to the other experiences you've had, I sense that you gave up sometime around the mid-nineties. And he was far from the only writer. For me personally, I think the EU hit its strongest peak in terms of storytelling, art, vision, and continuity from the late nineties to the mid aughts. The Darth Bane trilogy is well-regarded, and it's something one of the authors for the High Republic project is now looking to for inspiration, reportedly. So I would like to give you a few passages from two of those books.

Darth Bane: Path of Destruction

Dessel was lost in the suffering of his job, barely even aware of his surroundings. His arms ached from the endless pounding of the hydraulic jack. Small bits of rock skipped off the cavern wall as he bored through, ricocheting off his protective goggles and stinging his exposed face and hands. Clouds of atomized dust filled the air, obscuring his vision, and the screeching whine of the jack filled the cavern, drowning out all other sounds as it burrowed centimeter by agonizing centimeter into the thick vein of cortosis woven into the rock before him.

Impervious to both heat and energy, cortosis was prized in the construction of armor and shielding by both commercial and military interests, especially with the galaxy at war. Highly resistant to blaster bolts, cortosis alloys supposedly could withstand even the blade of a lightsaber. Unfortunately, the very properties that made it so valuable also made it extremely difficult to mine. Plasma torches were virtually useless; it would take days to burn away even a small section of cortosis-laced rock. The only effective way to mine it was through the brute force of hydraulic jacks pounding relentlessly away at a vein, chipping the cortosis free bit by bit.

Cortosis was one of the hardest materials in the galaxy. The force of the pounding quickly wore down the head of a jack, blunting it until it became almost useless. The dust clogged the hydraulic pistons, making them jam. Mining cortosis was hard on the equipment . . . and even harder on the miners.

Des had been hammering away for nearly six standard hours. The jack weighed more than thirty kilos, and the strain of keeping it raised and pressed against the rock face was taking its toll. His arms were trembling from the exertion. His lungs were gasping for air and choking on the clouds of fine mineral dust thrown up from the jack's head. Even his teeth hurt: the rattling vibration felt as if it were shaking them loose from his gums.

Darth Bane: Rule of Two

Darth Bane felt them long before he saw them.

Those ignorant in the ways of the Force saw it as only a weapon or tool: It could strike out against a foe in battle; it could levitate nearby objects and draw them into a waiting palm or fling them across a room. But these were mere wizard’s tricks to one who understood its true power and potential.

The Force was a part of all living things, and all living things were a part of the Force. It flowed through every being, every animal and creature, every tree and plant. The fundamental energies of life and death coursed through it, causing ripples in the very fabric of existence.

Even distracted by the agonizing flashes of the blades slicing apart the inside of his skull, Bane was sensitive to these ripples. They gave him an awareness that transcended space and even time, granting him brief glimpses into the always shifting possibilities of the future. That was how, still two kilometers and several minutes away from where Kaan and his army had made their camp, he knew others were already there.

There were eight in total, all human—six men and two women. Mercenaries who had signed on with the Brotherhood for credits and a chance to strike at the hated Republic, they had survived the final battle with Hoth’s troops. They had most likely fled the confrontation the instant Kaan had descended into the bowels of the planet’s surface to lay his trap for the Jedi, displaying the loyalty of all followers bought and paid for. And now, like blood beetles picking the rotting meat off a bantha’s corpse, they had come to scavenge whatever remnants of value they could find from the deserted Sith camp.

I mean, I hardly consider this forgettable. We should be able to have two continuities, not one that is supplanting the other, existing at the expense of the other one. For all their talk of being these huge Legends fans and that putting the references into their new canon is honoring it, it rings very hollow. This is coming from people who don't understand the lore they say they do. The same way they claim to be honoring Mr. Lucas, when we KNOW for a fact they'd rejected his story treatments, and possibly again during TROS production. And if they were following his vision, Ahsoka would be dead. That is a fine and dandy approach to take, really! I think many of us have a complicated love-hate relationship with George Lucas. If they felt they could do better why don't they say that? Stack that alongside the EU policies, and I sincerely hope you can see where I am coming from here. I don't think that they are honoring Mr. Lucas or the EU. And I want them to be more honest.

Hmmm while I feel Captain says everything here a million times better then I could. I will add this. I wouldn't mind the NEW EU so much if it wasn't so utter crap. Outside of a hand full of novels and funnily enough outside of Ashoka. the rest (The New Thrawn Trilogy, Lords of the Sith, Tarkin, Catalyst) were all written by old EU writers who all have a far better grasp of writing Star Wars then any of the new writers. I mean come on by this point in the old EU we had the Thrawn Trilogy, The Jedi Academy Trilogy, The X-wing Saga, Sarksaber, I,Jedi. Sure we had a far bit of crap but over all we had more good then bad.

In the new EU its the oppisite way round. A hand full of good with a majority of crap.

From my experience it was other way around with old EU. There was more crap than good material. So really idea that old EU is some how better than new EU is just illusion when they are pretty much equal when it comes to good and bad. It's just comes down to which one each prefers over other rather than one being better by default like fans of old EU like to claim. While being delusional that adapting they beloved stories would be possible.

[Captain Crimson]

Maybe you would care more if you saw it as I did? It's creative theft. Not legal theft, mind you, since they own the IP. They can strip it down for parts all they want to. But at the end of the day, it is also diminishing and cheapening a lot of art. Art that was made tailored to a singular vision, and not only what was merely popular and sells well either. You also strike me as if you didn't explore much past a few EU novels. I love plenty many more than those you listed. Matt Stover, Drew Karpyshyn, Kevin J. Anderson, Jude Watson, James Luceno, etc... and I could name many more.

Yeah, I don't see issue in what you call "creative theft". I guess it's becaue I have been liking how they have been using those elements from old EU. Funny that you mentioned those authors because only one from those who I remember is Kevin J. Anderson and I don't like his work. Like at all. Yes, that's how much I hate Dark Apprentice. I can only assume that others wrote so forgetable stories that they names didn't stick to my mind.

Well, it's the larger issue. They spin a yarn about how the old EU was never canon, which is fine if people like Ms. Kennedy want to say that. For the simple reason she was not familiar with the lore. The long-time workers such as Mr. Hidalgo saying that, though, when there's quotes of him referring to people in the EU as past and treating it that way, does not hold up. As to what they put into the canon, well, it wouldn't be such a huge issue if this existed at the expense of the older continuity. So that it is supplanting it. That is probably where you get accusations that they are SJWs. Like gender-swapping and race-lifting. Seriously, RO is the Death Star novel meets the Dark Forces books. Is it fun? Sure! But it's also replacing the male lead, Kyle Katarn, with a girl. And when they openly boast about that stuff, you can't help but notice. Probably where the trolls make genuine criticism hard, since they drown it out.

I just wish they could keep calling the EU what it was, "canon for its time." And continue work on it. Even Mr. Hidalgo had said if you were going to reboot it, that occasionally you could return to it. But they do not even do that. Despite obvious fan demand, and thousands of dollars raised. No, it doesn't have to be anything huge or special, but TOR updates and one single comic released in six years is too little for too many people. It would ease a lot of fan anxieties if they were to say they need to catch up on the EU, and let the new authors have a crack at it alongside the older ones. They said wait until the movies were done, which was a polite brush-off, I think, since they intended for it to continue for years. Now I loved #108. I think in terms of continuity, it was greatly handled. They could easily keep doing the same thing. I don't get why they don't.

I think LF was handed over to people who had no idea to the sheer depth and density of the lore, and it felt overwhelming. So discontinuing it and throwing in easter eggs makes sense in a cruel corporate way. But at the same time, stuff they say doesn't help their case and what they tell fans. Ms. Kennedy says they want their own creative liberties. But then with how much they've taken from the EU, why didn't they keep it around to fill in the gaps? It would have done a splendid job. So why isn't it getting continued? I think for a simple reason. They really ARE unoriginal. Or perhaps lazy. What other SF do you like? You could construct so much possibilities from all you know about it. But the less you know, how effective do you would be if you were brought on and had certain marks to hit, that really hindered your creative process? I think that's what we're seeing play out, and that only people with a certain political mindset are allowed to work there so they can't be accused of being racist and sexist and what have you. Everything Ms. Kennedy says to their version of SW, in contrast to the EU, strikes me as psychological projection. Mr. Lucas's management was the one to usher in true creative freedom, not hers, and everything they wish theirs to be.

Well, you know what, while I can't speak to the other experiences you've had, I sense that you gave up sometime around the mid-nineties. And he was far from the only writer. For me personally, I think the EU hit its strongest peak in terms of storytelling, art, vision, and continuity from the late nineties to the mid aughts. The Darth Bane trilogy is well-regarded, and it's something one of the authors for the High Republic project is now looking to for inspiration, reportedly. So I would like to give you a few passages from two of those books.

Darth Bane: Path of Destruction

Dessel was lost in the suffering of his job, barely even aware of his surroundings. His arms ached from the endless pounding of the hydraulic jack. Small bits of rock skipped off the cavern wall as he bored through, ricocheting off his protective goggles and stinging his exposed face and hands. Clouds of atomized dust filled the air, obscuring his vision, and the screeching whine of the jack filled the cavern, drowning out all other sounds as it burrowed centimeter by agonizing centimeter into the thick vein of cortosis woven into the rock before him.

Impervious to both heat and energy, cortosis was prized in the construction of armor and shielding by both commercial and military interests, especially with the galaxy at war. Highly resistant to blaster bolts, cortosis alloys supposedly could withstand even the blade of a lightsaber. Unfortunately, the very properties that made it so valuable also made it extremely difficult to mine. Plasma torches were virtually useless; it would take days to burn away even a small section of cortosis-laced rock. The only effective way to mine it was through the brute force of hydraulic jacks pounding relentlessly away at a vein, chipping the cortosis free bit by bit.

Cortosis was one of the hardest materials in the galaxy. The force of the pounding quickly wore down the head of a jack, blunting it until it became almost useless. The dust clogged the hydraulic pistons, making them jam. Mining cortosis was hard on the equipment . . . and even harder on the miners.

Des had been hammering away for nearly six standard hours. The jack weighed more than thirty kilos, and the strain of keeping it raised and pressed against the rock face was taking its toll. His arms were trembling from the exertion. His lungs were gasping for air and choking on the clouds of fine mineral dust thrown up from the jack's head. Even his teeth hurt: the rattling vibration felt as if it were shaking them loose from his gums.

Darth Bane: Rule of Two

Darth Bane felt them long before he saw them.

Those ignorant in the ways of the Force saw it as only a weapon or tool: It could strike out against a foe in battle; it could levitate nearby objects and draw them into a waiting palm or fling them across a room. But these were mere wizard’s tricks to one who understood its true power and potential.

The Force was a part of all living things, and all living things were a part of the Force. It flowed through every being, every animal and creature, every tree and plant. The fundamental energies of life and death coursed through it, causing ripples in the very fabric of existence.

Even distracted by the agonizing flashes of the blades slicing apart the inside of his skull, Bane was sensitive to these ripples. They gave him an awareness that transcended space and even time, granting him brief glimpses into the always shifting possibilities of the future. That was how, still two kilometers and several minutes away from where Kaan and his army had made their camp, he knew others were already there.

There were eight in total, all human—six men and two women. Mercenaries who had signed on with the Brotherhood for credits and a chance to strike at the hated Republic, they had survived the final battle with Hoth’s troops. They had most likely fled the confrontation the instant Kaan had descended into the bowels of the planet’s surface to lay his trap for the Jedi, displaying the loyalty of all followers bought and paid for. And now, like blood beetles picking the rotting meat off a bantha’s corpse, they had come to scavenge whatever remnants of value they could find from the deserted Sith camp.

I mean, I hardly consider this forgettable. We should be able to have two continuities, not one that is supplanting the other, existing at the expense of the other one. For all their talk of being these huge Legends fans and that putting the references into their new canon is honoring it, it rings very hollow. This is coming from people who don't understand the lore they say they do. The same way they claim to be honoring Mr. Lucas, when we KNOW for a fact they'd rejected his story treatments, and possibly again during TROS production. And if they were following his vision, Ahsoka would be dead. That is a fine and dandy approach to take, really! I think many of us have a complicated love-hate relationship with George Lucas. If they felt they could do better why don't they say that? Stack that alongside the EU policies, and I sincerely hope you can see where I am coming from here. I don't think that they are honoring Mr. Lucas or the EU. And I want them to be more honest.

Hmmm while I feel Captain says everything here a million times better then I could. I will add this. I wouldn't mind the NEW EU so much if it wasn't so utter crap. Outside of a hand full of novels and funnily enough outside of Ashoka. the rest (The New Thrawn Trilogy, Lords of the Sith, Tarkin, Catalyst) were all written by old EU writers who all have a far better grasp of writing Star Wars then any of the new writers. I mean come on by this point in the old EU we had the Thrawn Trilogy, The Jedi Academy Trilogy, The X-wing Saga, Sarksaber, I,Jedi. Sure we had a far bit of crap but over all we had more good then bad.

In the new EU its the oppisite way round. A hand full of good with a majority of crap.

From my experience it was other way around with old EU. There was more crap than good material. So really idea that old EU is some how better than new EU is just illusion when they are pretty much equal when it comes to good and bad. It's just comes down to which one each prefers over other rather than one being better by default like fans of old EU like to claim. While being delusional that adapting they beloved stories would be possible.

You have no basis saying that when by your own admission you haven't read the majority of the EU, and only read a few novels you hated, and seem to take your cue from online articles. Now granted, I could be misspeaking here, so if I am, I apologize. But there is a reason even among Legends bashers that TOR era and the prequels era is so beloved, because it was many great stories, and by that time, the EU had found its footing. The late nineties going into the mid aughts was when the EU was at its strongest. This is like judging TNG based on S1 and S2. You have no room to make such a hyperbolic claim unless you have actually sat down to read those stories. Am I saying the majority of Disney canon is crap? No. I'd never make that claim, ever. But you are the one who is doing so about Legends. And it really does seem to me as if you have had a few bad experiences with EU fans. Though I could be wrong.

[Mecha82]

Like I said before I did read plenty of old EU back in day. It's just that most of it was either bad or forgetable with some good ones. So no, I didn't get impression that old EU is some how flawless like lot of old EU fans like to claim. Is new EU flawless? Of course not. But claiming that it's inferior to old EU when both have they highs and lows is just fanboy bias. And it's those old EU fanboys that have managed turned me away from old EU. So they have complised opposite that they were trying to do all because they insist that they way is ony correct way of being SW fan.

[Captain Crimson]

Like I said before I did read plenty of old EU back in day. It's just that most of it was either bad or forgetable with some good ones. So no, I didn't get impression that old EU is some how flawless like lot of old EU fans like to claim. Is new EU flawless? Of course not. But claiming that it's inferior to old EU when both have they highs and lows is just fanboy bias. And it's those old EU fanboys that have managed turned me away from old EU. So they have complised opposite that they were trying to do all because they insist that they way is ony correct way of being SW fan.

All you cited was Kevin J. Anderson, and older posts reference NJO. Fair enough, but have you read past that point? As I had said, there is a reason that a lot of EU fans supported the post-Endor reboot, but still wanted the prequels and TOR stuff to be "canon," as fluid as that word is. Because that was the pinnacle for the EU. I think you're also off-base. I would never claim it was flawless nor does anyone I know claim it's flawless. Some people I know DESPISE TCW, and refuse to accept it as part of Legends, and yet... you gotta take the bad with the good, while I am like 50-50 on it myself. But claiming old EU is inferior to new EU is the point you yourself have raised, that the majority of it was crap, when that's like hundreds of novels, hundreds, that you have not given me the impression you've read most of them to base this claim on. The burden of proof is on you to provide examples past those you have, so please do that?

I never said Legends was flawless, either, nor that the new EU is crap, even if Gekired made that claim. Could I see how people might think that? Sure, I am not a fan of TJAT. I could see how some would be skeptical about that. I'm also not a fan of AND. What I had said is that it has no stakes. And that is true. Even a YA series for Legends had stakes, and sometimes came in multiple-part story arcs. Can you say the same for the new EU? I'm not gatekeeping on you either, my friend. I'm just telling it like it is. To claim majority of Legends or new EU is crap is purely subjective, and Gekired is entirely entitled to that opinion, as are you yours. I just want you to clarify your thinking in making such bold claims, despite the hyperbolic nature of human language.

[Gekired]

Like I said before I did read plenty of old EU back in day. It's just that most of it was either bad or forgetable with some good ones. So no, I didn't get impression that old EU is some how flawless like lot of old EU fans like to claim. Is new EU flawless? Of course not. But claiming that it's inferior to old EU when both have they highs and lows is just fanboy bias. And it's those old EU fanboys that have managed turned me away from old EU. So they have complised opposite that they were trying to do all because they insist that they way is ony correct way of being SW fan.

All you cited was Kevin J. Anderson, and older posts reference NJO. Fair enough, but have you read past that point? As I had said, there is a reason that a lot of EU fans supported the post-Endor reboot, but still wanted the prequels and TOR stuff to be "canon," as fluid as that word is. Because that was the pinnacle for the EU. I think you're also off-base. I would never claim it was flawless nor does anyone I know claim it's flawless. Some people I know DESPISE TCW, and refuse to accept it as part of Legends, and yet... you gotta take the bad with the good, while I am like 50-50 on it myself. But claiming old EU is inferior to new EU is the point you yourself have raised, that the majority of it was crap, when that's like hundreds of novels, hundreds, that you have not given me the impression you've read most of them to base this claim on. The burden of proof is on you to provide examples past those you have, so please do that?

I never said Legends was flawless, either, nor that the new EU is crap, even if Gekired made that claim. Could I see how people might think that? Sure, I am not a fan of TJAT. I could see how some would be skeptical about that. I'm also not a fan of AND. What I had said is that it has no stakes. And that is true. Even a YA series for Legends had stakes, and sometimes came in multiple-part story arcs. Can you say the same for the new EU? I'm not gatekeeping on you either, my friend. I'm just telling it like it is. To claim majority of Legends or new EU is crap is purely subjective, and Gekired is entirely entitled to that opinion, as are you yours. I just want you to clarify your thinking in making such bold claims, despite the hyperbolic nature of human language.

Just wanted to add something to this. You bring up how many didn't want to lose the prequel stuff and TOR stuff. That is very true. Its funny i was just reading two Marvel epic collection Trades of the Menace Revealed. Which focuses on the Star Wars Universe between episode 1 and 2. Its focuses on the adventures of various Jedi while the council comes to terms with the return of the Sith and more worryingly. Did they kill the Master or merely the Apprentice. Its introduces us to many of the Bakground Jedi and really gets us to know them better. Plo-Kunn, Ki Adi Mundi, Quinlin Vos, the Dark Lady and so many more. We get a better sense of what life is like, the scale of the crime syndicates, the continued efforts of the Jedi to protect the Republic and so much more. We see some great new side characters as well.

Then you had novels like Cloak of Deception, The Medistar duology, Rogue Planet, and so many more that really fleshed out and developed the prequel era and really made up for some of the short comings of the prequels. FYI. Big Prequel fan myself but I do recognise many of its flaws.

All of this now gone sadly. Same with the TOR era which gave us the videogames, the Comic series, the Golden age of the sith comics and so much more.

The New EU i find from my experience with it has not done this for the Sequel era. . I find I lack an understanding of the feel of characters, the major players, the crime syndicates, the heroes and villains. Yes their has been a lot put out set in that era yet its failed to get me invested. Its failed to make up for the flaws of the sequel trilogy and get invested in many of the background characters their. (FYI. I pretty hate the sequel era and view that it has easily the worst SW film ever aka Ep 8. With respect to those of you who like it of course) Now admittedly a lot of this is because their still trying to figure out how this era operates, the goals and agenda's the history and so on mainly cause they keep retconning everything. So that doesn't help.

[Captain Crimson]

Like I said before I did read plenty of old EU back in day. It's just that most of it was either bad or forgetable with some good ones. So no, I didn't get impression that old EU is some how flawless like lot of old EU fans like to claim. Is new EU flawless? Of course not. But claiming that it's inferior to old EU when both have they highs and lows is just fanboy bias. And it's those old EU fanboys that have managed turned me away from old EU. So they have complised opposite that they were trying to do all because they insist that they way is ony correct way of being SW fan.

All you cited was Kevin J. Anderson, and older posts reference NJO. Fair enough, but have you read past that point? As I had said, there is a reason that a lot of EU fans supported the post-Endor reboot, but still wanted the prequels and TOR stuff to be "canon," as fluid as that word is. Because that was the pinnacle for the EU. I think you're also off-base. I would never claim it was flawless nor does anyone I know claim it's flawless. Some people I know DESPISE TCW, and refuse to accept it as part of Legends, and yet... you gotta take the bad with the good, while I am like 50-50 on it myself. But claiming old EU is inferior to new EU is the point you yourself have raised, that the majority of it was crap, when that's like hundreds of novels, hundreds, that you have not given me the impression you've read most of them to base this claim on. The burden of proof is on you to provide examples past those you have, so please do that?

I never said Legends was flawless, either, nor that the new EU is crap, even if Gekired made that claim. Could I see how people might think that? Sure, I am not a fan of TJAT. I could see how some would be skeptical about that. I'm also not a fan of AND. What I had said is that it has no stakes. And that is true. Even a YA series for Legends had stakes, and sometimes came in multiple-part story arcs. Can you say the same for the new EU? I'm not gatekeeping on you either, my friend. I'm just telling it like it is. To claim majority of Legends or new EU is crap is purely subjective, and Gekired is entirely entitled to that opinion, as are you yours. I just want you to clarify your thinking in making such bold claims, despite the hyperbolic nature of human language.

Just wanted to add something to this. You bring up how many didn't want to lose the prequel stuff and TOR stuff. That is very true. Its funny i was just reading two Marvel epic collection Trades of the Menace Revealed. Which focuses on the Star Wars Universe between episode 1 and 2. Its focuses on the adventures of various Jedi while the council comes to terms with the return of the Sith and more worryingly. Did they kill the Master or merely the Apprentice. Its introduces us to many of the Bakground Jedi and really gets us to know them better. Plo-Kunn, Ki Adi Mundi, Quinlin Vos, the Dark Lady and so many more. We get a better sense of what life is like, the scale of the crime syndicates, the continued efforts of the Jedi to protect the Republic and so much more. We see some great new side characters as well.

Then you had novels like Cloak of Deception, The Medistar duology, Rogue Planet, and so many more that really fleshed out and developed the prequel era and really made up for some of the short comings of the prequels. FYI. Big Prequel fan myself but I do recognise many of its flaws.

All of this now gone sadly. Same with the TOR era which gave us the videogames, the Comic series, the Golden age of the sith comics and so much more.

The New EU i find from my experience with it has not done this for the Sequel era. . I find I lack an understanding of the feel of characters, the major players, the crime syndicates, the heroes and villains. Yes their has been a lot put out set in that era yet its failed to get me invested. Its failed to make up for the flaws of the sequel trilogy and get invested in many of the background characters their. (FYI. I pretty hate the sequel era and view that it has easily the worst SW film ever aka Ep 8. With respect to those of you who like it of course) Now admittedly a lot of this is because their still trying to figure out how this era operates, the goals and agenda's the history and so on mainly cause they keep retconning everything. So that doesn't help.

Now, TBF, the top dogs "say" it's not gone, but their utter apathy to continue building on the mythology is, I think, symptomatic to the larger issue: They're out of depth to the lore past anything but the broadest of strokes, which is something that people from all walks of fandom have said at one point or another, whether they are casuals or TCW fans or gamers or even fandom menace idiots. Also their confusion on what does and does not qualify as canon also gives the impression they are in over their heads, and don't have confidence standing on their own.

I think a part of that is that the merchandising mentality has infected the brand to a level it never was under Mr. Lucas. I mean, that's why they are hesitant to continue upon Legends, even though it would definitely ease the blowback to a degree. Because in today's hyper-accelerated world with our HD obsession and connected presence globally, who wants to read books? I mean, it wouldn't be that hard to continue building on the older mythology. So their throwing in easter eggs to it feels hollow. Same way their liberal policies, so-called, feel the same. I have nothing against the lesbian kiss in TROS. I do have issues they declare it a victory, and it's cut overseas.

What a mess. How would you feel if they retconned the ST as they inched closer to it in their new EU? I mean, I think by that point it will have been years since the movie released, so it might be a further attempt to reconcile the fandom, and of course that we have seen lots of forces in the SW production overriding what another has done just because they don't like it, and feel it doesn't belong in SW. Like midi-chlorians or the old EU or anything Mr. Lucas gives them. The irony is here other forum members like Mecha82 love the Disney canon for what they are. Which is great. Anything which makes someone else happy, well... we need more of that in the world. But I suspect if they started patching in newer retcons to address the criticisms of TLJ years later, which despite the thrill ride TROS was doing, that even the aforementioned user is going to have issues. What they effectively said in 2014 is continuity doesn't matter. And we've seen that play out. And it should be very concerning to us.

[Gekired]

Like I said before I did read plenty of old EU back in day. It's just that most of it was either bad or forgetable with some good ones. So no, I didn't get impression that old EU is some how flawless like lot of old EU fans like to claim. Is new EU flawless? Of course not. But claiming that it's inferior to old EU when both have they highs and lows is just fanboy bias. And it's those old EU fanboys that have managed turned me away from old EU. So they have complised opposite that they were trying to do all because they insist that they way is ony correct way of being SW fan.

All you cited was Kevin J. Anderson, and older posts reference NJO. Fair enough, but have you read past that point? As I had said, there is a reason that a lot of EU fans supported the post-Endor reboot, but still wanted the prequels and TOR stuff to be "canon," as fluid as that word is. Because that was the pinnacle for the EU. I think you're also off-base. I would never claim it was flawless nor does anyone I know claim it's flawless. Some people I know DESPISE TCW, and refuse to accept it as part of Legends, and yet... you gotta take the bad with the good, while I am like 50-50 on it myself. But claiming old EU is inferior to new EU is the point you yourself have raised, that the majority of it was crap, when that's like hundreds of novels, hundreds, that you have not given me the impression you've read most of them to base this claim on. The burden of proof is on you to provide examples past those you have, so please do that?

I never said Legends was flawless, either, nor that the new EU is crap, even if Gekired made that claim. Could I see how people might think that? Sure, I am not a fan of TJAT. I could see how some would be skeptical about that. I'm also not a fan of AND. What I had said is that it has no stakes. And that is true. Even a YA series for Legends had stakes, and sometimes came in multiple-part story arcs. Can you say the same for the new EU? I'm not gatekeeping on you either, my friend. I'm just telling it like it is. To claim majority of Legends or new EU is crap is purely subjective, and Gekired is entirely entitled to that opinion, as are you yours. I just want you to clarify your thinking in making such bold claims, despite the hyperbolic nature of human language.

Just wanted to add something to this. You bring up how many didn't want to lose the prequel stuff and TOR stuff. That is very true. Its funny i was just reading two Marvel epic collection Trades of the Menace Revealed. Which focuses on the Star Wars Universe between episode 1 and 2. Its focuses on the adventures of various Jedi while the council comes to terms with the return of the Sith and more worryingly. Did they kill the Master or merely the Apprentice. Its introduces us to many of the Bakground Jedi and really gets us to know them better. Plo-Kunn, Ki Adi Mundi, Quinlin Vos, the Dark Lady and so many more. We get a better sense of what life is like, the scale of the crime syndicates, the continued efforts of the Jedi to protect the Republic and so much more. We see some great new side characters as well.

Then you had novels like Cloak of Deception, The Medistar duology, Rogue Planet, and so many more that really fleshed out and developed the prequel era and really made up for some of the short comings of the prequels. FYI. Big Prequel fan myself but I do recognise many of its flaws.

All of this now gone sadly. Same with the TOR era which gave us the videogames, the Comic series, the Golden age of the sith comics and so much more.

The New EU i find from my experience with it has not done this for the Sequel era. . I find I lack an understanding of the feel of characters, the major players, the crime syndicates, the heroes and villains. Yes their has been a lot put out set in that era yet its failed to get me invested. Its failed to make up for the flaws of the sequel trilogy and get invested in many of the background characters their. (FYI. I pretty hate the sequel era and view that it has easily the worst SW film ever aka Ep 8. With respect to those of you who like it of course) Now admittedly a lot of this is because their still trying to figure out how this era operates, the goals and agenda's the history and so on mainly cause they keep retconning everything. So that doesn't help.

Now, TBF, the top dogs "say" it's not gone, but their utter apathy to continue building on the mythology is, I think, symptomatic to the larger issue: They're out of depth to the lore past anything but the broadest of strokes, which is something that people from all walks of fandom have said at one point or another, whether they are casuals or TCW fans or gamers or even fandom menace idiots. Also their confusion on what does and does not qualify as canon also gives the impression they are in over their heads, and don't have confidence standing on their own.

I think a part of that is that the merchandising mentality has infected the brand to a level it never was under Mr. Lucas. I mean, that's why they are hesitant to continue upon Legends, even though it would definitely ease the blowback to a degree. Because in today's hyper-accelerated world with our HD obsession and connected presence globally, who wants to read books? I mean, it wouldn't be that hard to continue building on the older mythology. So their throwing in easter eggs to it feels hollow. Same way their liberal policies, so-called, feel the same. I have nothing against the lesbian kiss in TROS. I do have issues they declare it a victory, and it's cut overseas.

What a mess. How would you feel if they retconned the ST as they inched closer to it in their new EU? I mean, I think by that point it will have been years since the movie released, so it might be a further attempt to reconcile the fandom, and of course that we have seen lots of forces in the SW production overriding what another has done just because they don't like it, and feel it doesn't belong in SW. Like midi-chlorians or the old EU or anything Mr. Lucas gives them. The irony is here other forum members like Mecha82 love the Disney canon for what they are. Which is great. Anything which makes someone else happy, well... we need more of that in the world. But I suspect if they started patching in newer retcons to address the criticisms of TLJ years later, which despite the thrill ride TROS was doing, that even the aforementioned user is going to have issues. What they effectively said in 2014 is continuity doesn't matter. And we've seen that play out. And it should be very concerning to us.

Thats the thing though. Since ep 9 came out. We had nothing but retcon after retcon after retcon to try and fix plotholes in episode 9 and episode 8 and 7 on top of it. It gets tiring after a while. I mean again going back to the old EU.

We didn't have say... the entire Legacy of the Force series devoted to filling in plotholes in episode 3. Or Fate of the Jedi didn't exist just to try and better fit the sequel and original trilogies together.

Generally the old EU took notes and advice from George and expanded on his world. Now yes George did do stuff that contradicted the EU meaning major changes had to be made. Aka his Take on the Mandolorians completely screwing over what the EU had been doing with them up to that point.

The New EU and Lucasfilm in generally just seems to have no direction at the same time their meant to be pushing new directions and characters and setting and so on. No one seems to be on the same page and everyone seems to be rushing to keep up with other people while those people are rushing to keep up with other people and rinse and repeat.

Then ya hear things like the story that got this thread set up in the first place and well here we are.

Now I will add that yes their are people who enjoy the new Disney canon. I do not get why myself but i shall respect their right to do so. But i ask then same curtsy be returned to me for not liking the New EU overall. Lords knows the nightmarish response the media had to those who didn't like ep 8 and the constant name calling and declaring them members of hate groups and so on really didn't help anything and probably made the current division in the fandom so much worse then it would have been

Anyway a great thread and some great insights from you Captain. BTW sorry if i cause any issues here for anybody.