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If you read my "No More Rubber Foreheads" thread, you'll know I feel strongly about alien characters in science fiction, and about making them properly alien.

In comic books, since those are limited only by imagination and artistic skill, you'd expect less aliens that look exactly like humans, not more, but most truly alien-looking species only show up as monsters of the week or extras in spaceport crowd scenes. Anyone with a starring role is bound to be at the most humanoid, and more likely similar enough in appearance to pass for human in the swimsuit portion of a Miss America pageant.

But that's not exactly what I'm here to talk about. Those guys already form so much of our pantheon of established extraterrestrial characters, that it's worth thinking what we can DO about that now that we're stuck with it.

Basically, I want reminders that all aliens, especially the aliens that LOOK just like humans, aren't humans. I want Robin to be confused and awkward first time he gets naked with Starfire because he doesn't know what to do with an ovipositor. Somebody mentioning that they smell the ocean and Supergirl getting very embarassed because kryptonian farts are salt-based instead of sulphur-based. No matter what the outside covering, there's an entirely different process going on under the hood. I'm coming up with bad examples, but like, Sebacean heat delirium, the nerve that regulates toxins. Show me some reminder that a Kryptonian or a Mandalorian or whatever human-looking entity is not just a human with a weird culture and superpowers, but something which, biologically, we have less in common with than a banana tree, something with a whole evolutionary heritage going back to the first cell which is utterly different from ours.

You know what I mean?

Aliens, even aliens that look human, are not just humans with superpowers.

Given that aliens are frequently metaphors for human minorities and prejudice I think that's a problematic idea.

The problem, of course, is separating the metaphor from writing about aliens as an actual thing.

Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar after all.

Then again, Cthulhu is meant to be Jesus according to some people.

Fuzzy Necromancer wrote: ↑Thu Aug 23, 2018 11:11 pm If you read my "No More Rubber Foreheads" thread, you'll know I feel strongly about alien characters in science fiction, and about making them properly alien.

In comic books, since those are limited only by imagination and artistic skill, you'd expect less aliens that look exactly like humans, not more, but most truly alien-looking species only show up as monsters of the week or extras in spaceport crowd scenes. Anyone with a starring role is bound to be at the most humanoid, and more likely similar enough in appearance to pass for human in the swimsuit portion of a Miss America pageant.

But that's not exactly what I'm here to talk about. Those guys already form so much of our pantheon of established extraterrestrial characters, that it's worth thinking what we can DO about that now that we're stuck with it.

Basically, I want reminders that all aliens, especially the aliens that LOOK just like humans, aren't humans. I want Robin to be confused and awkward first time he gets naked with Starfire because he doesn't know what to do with an ovipositor. Somebody mentioning that they smell the ocean and Supergirl getting very embarassed because kryptonian farts are salt-based instead of sulphur-based. No matter what the outside covering, there's an entirely different process going on under the hood. I'm coming up with bad examples, but like, Sebacean heat delirium, the nerve that regulates toxins. Show me some reminder that a Kryptonian or a Mandalorian or whatever human-looking entity is not just a human with a weird culture and superpowers, but something which, biologically, we have less in common with than a banana tree, something with a whole evolutionary heritage going back to the first cell which is utterly different from ours.

You know what I mean?

Aliens, even aliens that look human, are not just humans with superpowers.

First I want to cut mandalorians out of the equation because from how I understand it humans in Star Wars are all humans. Asking how Mandalorians are different from humans is like asking how english are different from welsh.
As to beings that look so different but could pass as human. Let's look at two well known examples.
Superman and the Doctor.
Superman: Biology unexplained other than absorbs sunlight and Yellow sunlight super charges the species. Home environment means on Earth can defy gravity, super tough. With yellow light incredible strength, speed, and eyes that see way more as well as have energy emission.
Eats human food easily and barely notices environment changes. IE as comfortable in death valley as the north pole and in between. Nothing but the powers is alien. But are not those powers alien in their own right?


The Doctor: Medically examined and his blood is defintily not human (Spearhead from Space) He has two hearts and failure of one is almost as bad as full heart attack in a human. (Master once had to give him CPR for it.) Helium does not affect their vocal chords because they are shaped differently. At the moment of 'death' can regenerate into a new younger body. (I have a theory on this. See below) He has the most under the hood alien features. Reacting to things a bit differently But not entirely ignoring them either. He can still die if shot. So he avoids getting shot. Electrocution puts him on his knees while killing humans And so forth. I think he most closely resembles your request for Alien in the aliens.


The Doctor and regeneration: The Gallifrean people do not move about in time through super powers they rely on technology and through this technology they refined themselves. Regeneration does not just make you a younger version of yourself. But another version of you. Almost as though you brought an alternate reality version of you and put your memories inside. The original time lords limited themselves and future generations to only twelve regenerations for one of two reasons. To not fall into the trap of 'immortality'. Or, more likely, the more you take on the alternate forms the more widely you pull on reality to get them. Hence the Master and the Doctor getting a female forms after they went beyond their twelve regenerations. Reality is getting further and further from the original body.

Just my speculation.

CharlesPhipps wrote: ↑Fri Aug 24, 2018 6:02 am Given that aliens are frequently metaphors for human minorities and prejudice I think that's a problematic idea.

The problem, of course, is separating the metaphor from writing about aliens as an actual thing.

Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar after all.

Then again, Cthulhu is meant to be Jesus according to some people.

If you use aliens as an allegory for oppressed minorities, ya'llready dun fukked up.

You wanna see some GOOD scifi writing? H. G. Wells conceived of aliens as the colonists/imperialists and humans as the oppressed natives.

Fuzzy Necromancer wrote: ↑Sat Aug 25, 2018 2:15 am
If you use aliens as an allegory for oppressed minorities, ya'llready dun fukked up.

Not a fan of Bajorans, I take it?

You wanna see some GOOD scifi writing? H. G. Wells conceived of aliens as the colonists/imperialists and humans as the oppressed natives.

Yep, which only works because the oppressed natives are the English.

CharlesPhipps wrote: ↑Sat Aug 25, 2018 2:21 am

Fuzzy Necromancer wrote: ↑Sat Aug 25, 2018 2:15 am
If you use aliens as an allegory for oppressed minorities, ya'llready dun fukked up.

Not a fan of Bajorans, I take it?

You wanna see some GOOD scifi writing? H. G. Wells conceived of aliens as the colonists/imperialists and humans as the oppressed natives.

Yep, which only works because the oppressed natives are the English.

The bajorans were AN oppressed group, but they aren't any particular oppressed group. If you wanna see how that kind of writing can go horribly wrong, look at Detroit: Become Human (robots rather than aliens, but the point still stands).

Anyway, most star trek races are pretty...hatty and underwhelming. Humans with another culture.

I want aliens that ARE alien, whether they look it or not. That have more fundamental differences the the culture they come from or whether they can fly.

I think Detroit: Beyond Human was actually pretty fun but then again, it was Blade Runner + Humans (a cult classic TV show) so it was cribbing from better works.

Also, mysteriously starred white people for the most part.

Fuzzy Necromancer wrote: ↑Sat Aug 25, 2018 7:57 pm I want aliens that ARE alien, whether they look it or not. That have more fundamental differences the the culture they come from or whether they can fly.

Few and far between because it's very difficult to pull off convincingly (easy enough to do superficially). The alien, whatever they look like, still has to work - no being random and doing weird stuff for the sake of it and trying to handwave it away with "well it's alien, of course we can't understand it!" That's lazy writing, not being alien. Not having ever met any aliens means we've not got a clue about what sort of range of different but valid options there are but the "how is this supposed to work?" question needs to be answered, or at least give the impression that the author has an answer whether it's given or not.

I'm going to agree with Fuzzy Necromancer here. I know, I'll have to go lie down in a quiet room for a while later...

Young Justice (the cartoon) had M'Gann reveal herself to be a White Martian, and she looks all kinds of alien in her native form. But she insists that her more familiar form (basically a teenage human girl, but green) is who she really is. It reminded me of gender dysphoria.

By having an alien be more alien, sometimes we can get an analog to a human issue that makes an end run around conclusions we've already settled on. The M'Gann issue didn't really change my opinion on anything (which isn't germane here, and I don't want to derail the thread), but it made me sympathize more with people who feel they are trapped in the wrong body.

Riedquat wrote: ↑Sat Aug 25, 2018 10:55 pm

Fuzzy Necromancer wrote: ↑Sat Aug 25, 2018 7:57 pm I want aliens that ARE alien, whether they look it or not. That have more fundamental differences the the culture they come from or whether they can fly.

Few and far between because it's very difficult to pull off convincingly (easy enough to do superficially).

My response to that is, in the immortal words of Cranky Kong, "Git gud"