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Was it a mistake to set STD in the Prime Universe?
Posted: Tue Feb 19, 2019 5:40 am
by Yukaphile
Just what it says on the tin. STD seems like it'd be better suited to the Kelvin Universe than the Prime Universe. Now granted, they couldn't do that because of legal issues I hear, but supposing they created a new universe to set this in like JJ Abrams had done in 2009? The only reason for setting it in the Prime Universe is to generate nostalgia, but nostalgia for what? They clearly don't care about the larger continuity of Trek, so just make up your own universe to set this world of Trek in. Is it so hard?
What do you think? Would it have been better to create a third universe apart from the Prime Universe or the Kelvin Universe for STD? Would it at least have made it less controversial? I still think my "make it an alternate dimension and not a changed timeline" idea might have been the way to go.
Re: Was it a mistake to set STD in the Prime Universe?
Posted: Tue Feb 19, 2019 6:43 am
by Winter
I think the best solution was the set it After Voyager/DS9 events as the problem here is that the tech is way more advance then what we had in TOS and Spock having a sister was just silly. Michael being the adoptive daughter of Tuvok would have worked a lot better and would have made use of a really good actor and actually made use of a underutilized character.
However, the main problem with Discovery isn't that it's a prequel the problem is in the writing. Michael just isn't as interesting as a main character IMO, any character not named Tilly or Lorca is kind of dull or forgettable and it's not really that exiting. Making it a sequel instead of a Prequel or setting it in another universe wouldn't fix these problems. These are the issues that have to be addressed in order to help the show grow.
Re: Was it a mistake to set STD in the Prime Universe?
Posted: Tue Feb 19, 2019 7:23 am
by Karha of Honor
They probably only set it into the TOSverse to sell merch.
I vote Kelvinverse.
Re: Was it a mistake to set STD in the Prime Universe?
Posted: Tue Feb 19, 2019 7:32 am
by Worffan101
The mistake was giving Fuller insufficient oversight and going in with the wrong idea of what needed to be done, then giving Bad Robot personnel control with a shoestring budget.
Just really poor planning all around.
Re: Was it a mistake to set STD in the Prime Universe?
Posted: Tue Feb 19, 2019 7:37 am
by BridgeConsoleMasher
Not really sure what difference it makes, but it sorta gives me a headache personally that they kept it in the prime.
If they just wanted to keep creative differences within discretion between Paramount and CBS, then I'll buy that for a dollar. The Marvel Netflix / MCU affiliation was just a waste of time in keeping consideration.
Re: Was it a mistake to set STD in the Prime Universe?
Posted: Tue Feb 19, 2019 10:48 am
by Madner Kami
"Prime Universe" is a term coined to refer to NuTrek, which includes the Kelvinverse. The original Trek-continuity is on permanent hiatus. They use the word "prime" to confused and reel in old fans of the old Trek, not to determine a continued continuity. Please have the sense to not use "Prime Universe/Timeline" in a way, that refers to the continuity which goes from Enterprise to Voyager.
Re: Was it a mistake to set STD in the Prime Universe?
Posted: Tue Feb 19, 2019 12:52 pm
by clearspira
Watch Midnights Edge. It's all about the green. They don't give a fig about the fans.
Re: Was it a mistake to set STD in the Prime Universe?
Posted: Tue Feb 19, 2019 2:12 pm
by Zoinksberg
Madner Kami wrote: ↑Tue Feb 19, 2019 10:48 am
"Prime Universe" is a term coined to refer to NuTrek, which includes the Kelvinverse. The original Trek-continuity is on permanent hiatus. They use the word "prime" to confused and reel in old fans of the old Trek, not to determine a continued continuity. Please have the sense to not use "Prime Universe/Timeline" in a way, that refers to the continuity which goes from Enterprise to Voyager.
This^
We need to start using the terms correctly, as ME revealed and has been somewhat confirmed by those in the know.
TOS, TNG, DS9, VOY, ENT =
Canon
JJ Films =
Kelvinverse (or JJ-verse, etc)
24th century scenes of 2009, STD, and all future Trek =
Prime
Though CBS is quite welcome to hit the giant reset button and prove all of this wrong
Re: Was it a mistake to set STD in the Prime Universe?
Posted: Tue Feb 19, 2019 2:42 pm
by Nealithi
Yukaphile wrote: ↑Tue Feb 19, 2019 5:40 am
Just what it says on the tin. STD seems like it'd be better suited to the Kelvin Universe than the Prime Universe. Now granted, they couldn't do that because of legal issues I hear, but supposing they created a new universe to set this in like JJ Abrams had done in 2009? The only reason for setting it in the Prime Universe is to generate nostalgia, but nostalgia for what? They clearly don't care about the larger continuity of Trek, so just make up your own universe to set this world of Trek in. Is it so hard?
What do you think? Would it have been better to create a third universe apart from the Prime Universe or the Kelvin Universe for STD? Would it at least have made it less controversial? I still think my "make it an alternate dimension and not a changed timeline" idea might have been the way to go.
I think we have enough alternate timelines and universes. I think what others have suggested of having this be the next after Voyager would have been the way to go. Think about it, the Federation and the Klingon Empire keep rubbing each other the wrong way. So another war is likely. A ship that can teleport across the sector and in mid battle would still be a game changer. And the uniform changes both in the main and mirror verse make sense. You keep the TOS fans happy and that merchandise flowing. And no one is making direct comparisons to existing franchises. Personally the paywall is a bit much for me. They want to put Trek on a channel then put them all there to entice more people in. But the new unproven show to launch a service seems daft in hindsight.
Re: Was it a mistake to set STD in the Prime Universe?
Posted: Tue Feb 19, 2019 6:28 pm
by technobabbler
Midnight's Edge makes a convincing circumstantial (their own words) case that all Trek post-2009 is in an alternate timeline (different from 1966 to 2005 Trek).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ojtX_Oz4WsU
Why CBS-Viacom-Bad Robot just wasn't honest with the fans and decided to play semantics instead?...probably a dumb Hollywood decision.
Intuitively it makes sense as Trek 2009's USS Kelvin (ignoring the visual reboot) does not have the same tech as a canon pre-TOS ship would have.
Was it "Fringe"---that show called their original world "alpha" and the alternate world "prime." Wonder if someone CBS genius got was inspired by that terminology.