Sequel trilogy vs. prequel trilogy

[Yukaphile]

Let's get it on!

Personally, I've seen a few clips from the sequels, and as bad as the dialogue and plot holes are in the prequels, they seem vastly more entertaining. Only reason I can't love Revenge of the Sith 100% is that it's standing in the shadow of a FAR superior novel, one that is no longer canon thanks to Disney, but in any event, I do find it highly entertaining in my own way, and love it... I'll say 90%. Come on, let's admit it. They got NARM CHARM. Where they are so damned fucking cheesy, you can't help but love 'em. Er... except Episode I, with its blatant body humor gags. Ew.

[Mecha82]

As some one who has actually watched sequels and isn't Legends fan I do like them over prequels. Why? Here's why.

Over all sequels are more confidently made movies helped by those being made by people that are able to both write and direct movies. Look I am not down playing Lucas' influence but he needed others to help him or give him advive to get make originals what they are. And it really shows in prequels were he didn't have that.

Sure he was world builder but not writer and director. Especially not director considering how difficukt even seasoned actors like Liam Neesan, Ewan McGregor and Natalie Portman had under him let alone unexperienced child actor like Jake Lloyd. And we have seen that Hayden Christensen can act when he is in movie directed by some one who can actually direct.

I also found sequels to me more enjoyable with less things that I don't like. Which is important to me when I watch movie. Do I find it enjoyable to watch. And even things that I don't like about in those I have started to see in new more positive light. I know it's popular to nitpick things on internet and try to find plot holes from every little thing but that's not who I am.

Look, I don't hide fact that I like sequels. Why should I? It's not like people that hate those hide it. Then again I always say that hate is too strong emotion to be wasted on things like movies that are just entertainment and don't matter in grand scheme of things.

Oh and one more thing. People that claim that TLJ is worst movie ever don't know what they are talking about because clearly they haven't seen actually bad movies and mix them not liking something to be same as that being worst ever.

[Yukaphile]

I think Last Jedi might be "the worst" in terms of people's impression of overall character assassination. We could buy Luke turning out that way. But there is no buildup in the preceding movies since they hamstrung themselves in retelling A New Hope. I don't think it's that they are DELIBERATELY engineering it so people will HAVE to buy their EU content. That would imply an overall level of planning ahead of time that I don't think they had prior to the announcement they were gonna create a new film trilogy all the way back in 2012. I think they do have the mindset it's a good way to explain their plot holes, however, since they saw how well that worked with the prequels.

As for Legends, my only comment here is on the hypocrisy. When it was decanonized in 2014, people sneered Legends had awful stories, so good riddance. Dark Empire was one that was name-dropped a lot. And yet, here we are, half a decade later, and a big-budget international movie basically took the very same storyline Dark Empire had and put it on screen to the delight of fans. Not only does it imply all the arguments used to marginalize Legends fans are null and void since it suggests adapting Legends books would have worked (kinda like what the MCU did), it also paints those in charge as hypocrites who may preach "creative freedom," but will do whatever they can to turn a buck. Pandering to my fandom as a Legends fan this way doesn't make me happy, it makes me angrier with all of these little easter eggs. And if I was a Disney fan, I would think I'd be rightly pissed they're not doing anything new and would think they were focused too much on Legends fans and not me and my generation coming up, since the older material is still there. Because think about it, Legends still exists, and now the new canon is, in a way, too slavishly adherent to it. All of which could be solved if Lucasfilm would just allow the existence of parallel timelines. It'd ease blowback from the Legends community whenever they put in another easter egg or "recanonize" a character. But when you're chasing billions of dollars in sales, who cares?

[MithrandirOlorin]

The Prequels are better then the OT so they are certainly better then the OT"s cheap inferior knock offs.

But done with this fighting, I want to find a community that just likes all the movies and doesn't waste time on hate.

And the post ROTJ saga of Legends was done anyway, it was already stretching it's logical conclusion. You got the equivalent of 20 Trilogies so I don't see any point sin whining that Disney didn't continue dragging it out.

[Yukaphile]

There's still stories you could tell, and many that were canceled after the buyout. And really, it's Lucasfilm's own fault that they are so ingrained into the "fantasy" aspects of Star Wars, they ignore the sci-fi elements, so that there can't be another parallel timeline out there.

You say that without ever having read the stories yourselves. People here call me out over that, so I'm sure as hell gonna call you out over it.

[PerrySimm]

Mecha may be right to point out that the sequels are more interesting from a *filmmaking* standpoint. It's plain that there was more creative freedom for the writers and directors, but of course this is exemplified by VIII falling flat on its face. As opposed to the prequels, where my main instinct is to fall asleep.

Still, it feels like the right answer is "neither" - it simply isn't possible to recapture the spirit of the first two films... or, at least, not by the strategies used in either set of films.

[Yukaphile]

Their claims to "creative freedom" is just too much damned hypocrisy. And especially notable in their utter risk-aversion. TFA was ANH 2.0. And that they ripped off Dark Empire to give the derailed trilogy structure but won't admit where they got the idea when they jettisoned the EU into a non-canon limbo where it can't be a parallel universe alongside the newer stuff, has to be superseded by it because alternate timelines "ruin" what is the "magic" of Star Wars, paints them even more as corporate tyrants at odds with actual artistic vision and storytelling. Just wait until they begin adapting elements from The Old Republic to the new canon. It is coming. Kennedy has said so. And in fact, I'm gonna create a new thread dedicated specifically just to this.

[ChiggyvonRichthofen]

The sentiment I've seen tossed around is- The prequels are a good idea executed badly, while the sequel trilogy is a bad idea executed well. This isn't totally true, as I think most would agree that stuff like John Williams' work, some of the duels, order 66, and a few other scenes were done very well, and the sequel trilogy has some poorly executed stuff. Overall though, I agree with the sentiment, and ultimately I'd side with the prequels as being, if not technically better as movies, better contributions to the Star Wars universe.

People dislike some of the developments brought about by the prequels (e.g. midichlorians), but they serve as a wellspring for a bunch of Star Wars material in other formats. Not all of it was good and I do think EU writers kind of overdid it with the number of stories set within a very narrow time period, but there's no denying that the potential was there for interesting stuff.

No doubt future material will be set around the time of the sequel trilogy, but I just don't see it as fertile ground for interesting stories. The First Order rises out of nowhere and falls out of nowhere in the span of like a year. We know the New Republic is ineffectual and that the Resistance is pathetically small in TLJ then ridiculously massive by the climax of TRoS. Combine those problems with the derivative nature of the story itself, and it's just not an attractive era.

[Winter]

I think on the biggest problems with the Disney Sequel Trilogy vs. the Prequel Trilogy is this. The Prequels were a story Lucas wanted to tell and while I do agree that they needed more time to cook and that Lucas needed help to bring these ideas into focus they were good stories or, at the very least, good ideas.

As ChiggyvonRichthofen said the Prequels was a wellspring of ideas with great potential that gave way to some amazing ideas stories like both Clone Wars series, the clone wars comics and the post-Clone Wars Pre-Original Trilogy that Lucas and others were beginning to work on before the Disney buyout.

By contrast, the Disney Era is just doing whatever it thinks fans want in a Star Wars film. The Force Awakens was a light on dialogue heavy on action movie with a ton of practical effects and real sets. There were more videos about how the film used as much practical effects and made a big deal about BB-8 than there was about the characters or plots.

Then, after Awakens came out, The Last Jedi made a big deal about how it would shack things up which was very likely a response to fans calling Awakens out on being a retread of A New Hope. Several interviews kept turning to the subject of how TLJ wasn't going to be like any other Star Wars movie before and how it would shock fans with it's twists and turns.

Then came Rise of Skywalker which was Very Clearly made with the mindset of trying to appease those who disliked TLJ as the film spent most of it's first acting undoing EVERYTHING TLJ had set out to buildup.

During the making of a the Mortis arc in the Clone Wars there was a scene that was written and recorded that included Darth Bane and Darth Revan who would have talked with The Son and everyone was mostly on board with it. But after going over the scene, Lucas called up Filoni and said that after thinking it over, they should cut the scene and Filoni agreed as it contradicted established canon and was pretty much fanserves for the sake of fanserves.

Contrast this with the "I am all the Jedi" moment which goes against established canon that only people who have undergone the key training to become a Force Ghost. The only exception to that rule is Anakin who I'm willing to give a pass to on the grounds of being the chosen one so he likely was able to become a Force Ghost because of how much power he had.

But this moment exists for the sake of fanserves which actually ended up annoying fans because it goes against canon.

Say what you will about the Prequels, but Lucas did listen to fans WITHOUT altering his vision while Disney was trying to just do what they thought fans wanted even at the cost of continuity. In the end, the Lucas Era, for me, is a series of passion products made by people who had stories they wanted to tell while teh Disney Era is mostly just a series of products meant to be sold.

Not to say that one was all good and the other is all bad but the latter does feel a bit less memorable then the former.

[PapaPalpatine]

If it comes down to a choice between Jar Jar acting like Roger Rabbit In Space or Vice Admiral Fashion Victim being a smug, man-hating harpy, I'll happily give the Gungan a second chance.