Was Taash Always Non-Binary?

[Winter]

To clarify I mean in the lead up to the release of the game. I think there was always a plan to have a non binary character but I wonder if that character was always Taash or if it was someone else.

As I mentioned before a rumor I read is that Taash was originally cisgender and Imshael was the non binary character. To recap Imshael, a minor villain from Dragon Age: Inquisition, was to return in this game as a companion only this time they would take the form of a human woman instead of a man. I don't know much else but I read that characters referred to Imshael as they/them, he/him and she/her.

What makes me think that Taash was also suppose to be cisgender is that their original design was much more feminine and they were described as a Femme Fatale a few times. Dragon Age: The Veilguard had to leave a LOT of concepts behind thanks to the development Hell EA put them through which included cutting missions like rescuing whomever was left in the fade in DAI, Morrigan, Dorian, and Isabela would have served as advisors to Rook. Solas had a more active role, a Disciple aka free-willed Darkspawn was going to be a companion, Sten was to return as a dreadnought captain and Calpernia was to be a companion.

And another companion was a Saarebas Qunari which is weird because that was also a scrapped idea for Dragon Age II so this some kind of curse in the series, the even numbers will try to include a Saarebas Qunari and then get a mixed reception?

One thing that also makes me think that Taash being non-binary was a last minute addition is how rushed and, IMO, forced the whole arc felt. hammerofglass has said they identified a lot with Taash and their story which hey, fair enough I know I've connected with transwomen characters so I do get it. But Taash just doesn't feel natural to me.

There's a big deal made about them being non-binary but it just doesn't get much chance to be fleshed out and their character feels uneven. Not bad, just unfinished.

Again I do think there was always a plan to have a non binary character (good thing) and it might have been Taash the whole time but the way it's handled, the unused elements of Imshael's story really makes me question this.

[hammerofglass]

One thing that also makes me think that Taash being non-binary was a last minute addition is how rushed and, IMO, forced the whole arc felt. hammerofglass has said they identified a lot with Taash and their story which hey, fair enough I know I've connected with transwomen characters so I do get it. But Taash just doesn't feel natural to me.

Honestly I don't think I'd even call it an arc. She has the "nobody LIKES being a woman" scene where she starts to figure shit out, then she has a bunch of self-reflection and conversations with Neve's trans friends in the Shadow Dragons completely off-screen, and then there's a second scene scene where they announce what identity and pronouns they settled on. That's it. Everything after that is just added detail in the "Taash has a complicated emotional relationship with their mother" theme.

I think they handled it well, but that absolutely could have been tacked on late in development.

[hammerofglass]

This isn't non-binary related but something I do think is evidence of late changes: off-screen Taash that other characters talk about and Taash you actually interact with are not the same person.

Off-screen Taash is Isabella 2.0, loud and boisterous and teaching the non-human members to swear. This is someone who casually insulted Emmerich blew off his attempts to be friendly and called him shit like "skullfucker" until he's on the verge of a nervous breakdown.

On-screen Taash barely interacts with anyone outside their immediate friends and family, has a permanent vibe like they're afraid you're going to start yelling at them, and I don't recall them ever using a term stronger than "bullshit".

[Winter]

This isn't non-binary related but something I do think is evidence of late changes: off-screen Taash that other characters talk about and Taash you actually interact with are not the same person.

Off-screen Taash is Isabella 2.0, loud and boisterous and teaching the non-human members to swear. This is someone who casually insulted Emmerich blew off his attempts to be friendly and called him shit like "skullfucker" until he's on the verge of a nervous breakdown.

On-screen Taash barely interacts with anyone outside their immediate friends and family, has a permanent vibe like they're afraid you're going to start yelling at them, and I don't recall them ever using a term stronger than "bullshit".

There's mission with them at the start of the game that really stood out to me, in a good way. It's one of the first missions we have with them were we go around and feed a few birds at the beach near to where we first met them. I liked this mission and others like it as it was a nice bit of down time that DIDN'T end in a fight.

Maybe this is just me but it almost felt like they were an abuse victim having a quite moment to themselves with someone they were coming to trust. The problem here is while Taash's mom, Shathann, is a little strict and a bit critical she never came off as anywhere near as bad as Taash kept making her out to be.

Again she actively tries to make an effort to understand Taash's being non-binary which for her is hard because of the Qun strict roles for people in their culture but Taash comes off as overly definitive and, if I may, a bit of a brat. Either exaggerating or almost fabricating their mother's flaws.

It is weird how so many characters talk about a character or characters that don't line up with the ones we meet. Taash, as you said, has a permanent vibe like they're afraid you're going to start yelling at them. Off-Screen Shathann is overly strict and borderline or outright abusive to their child while On-Screen Shathann is a bit strict but ultimately a loving mother trying to understand what her child is telling her which given the intense mental brainwashing of the Qunari says a lot about how much she loves her child. Especially for someone who was a priest of the Qun.

[Madner Kami]

Off-Screen Shathann is overly strict and borderline or outright abusive to their child while On-Screen Shathann is a bit strict but ultimately a loving mother trying to understand what her child is telling her which given the intense mental brainwashing of the Qunari says a lot about how much she loves her child. Especially for someone who was a priest of the Qun.

Mind you, not having played the game and only having seen the infamous scenes, particularly the dinner one. The way I read the situation is, that Shathann is actually trying her best to understand what her kid is trying to tell her though, naturally she refers to it in terms that she understands and learned to communicate and think in. At no point, does she seem to shut down Taash, disrespect her in any overtly obvious way or anything that I'd call agressive or, heck, even ignorant whatsoever. Yet Taash replies and acts in ways that imply her mother is borderline hitlering her.

And the most baffling thing about that to me was, a particular thing the mother dropped trying to relate to Taash. I can't rewatch the scene right now, but she said something that to me seemed as if the Qunari aren't inherently averse to the idea of someone's gender-identity not confirming with their physical sex. It's non-acceptence of assigned societal role that's not tolerable to the Qun and that's it (even if it may be a retcon compared to previous lore, I'm not sure).

Also, I vaguely recall having read that Taash's original point of diversion wasn't her gender-identity, but her fire-breathing ability. And while the later got downplayed in the final product, the former got tacked on late in development. If so, I feel it shows. None of what happens in that regard in any of the records I've seen, does make any sense to me. It feels like rushed content that nobody really put more than one thought beyond "Taash is non-binary now and we need to dramatize it and put it to the front and center" to.

[hammerofglass]

There is a LOT more focus on the fire-breather stuff than NB stuff in the actual game. Hell there's a lot more focus on the "raised in an immigrant household" stuff. For all that some culture warriors IRL decided to make it a big deal the gender stuff gets less time and focus in the game than a running gag about the griffin liking truffles.

That's actually the whole point of it. The two of them care deeply for each other and know it but they can't communicate worth a damn. Taash has themself tied into emotional knots about coming out and it makes the conversation go bad but Shathann never actually had an issue with it beyond literally not knowing what the word "non-binary" means.

[Winter]

There is a LOT more focus on the fire-breather stuff than NB stuff in the actual game. Hell there's a lot more focus on the "raised in an immigrant household" stuff. For all that some culture warriors IRL decided to make it a big deal the gender stuff gets less time and focus in the game than a running gag about the griffin liking truffles.

That's actually the whole point of it. The two of them care deeply for each other and know it but they can't communicate worth a damn. Taash has themself tied into emotional knots about coming out and it makes the conversation go bad but Shathann never actually had an issue with it beyond literally not knowing what the word "non-binary" means.

That also really contributes to the feel that this was added late in the game because they do focus more on Taash being a fire-breather then anything else. Again I can't help but point to Dorian confrontation with his father about why he left home.

That scene is one of the best in the series, a son who was betrayed by his father who tried to change him to act more like he wanted and went against his own morals and principles the moment they became an inconvenience to what he thought was most important to him, his house and not his own son's happiness. And in the end it cost him his son when he found out and left.

This is given just as much focus as Taash coming out as non-binary to their mother but I feel one works better then the other.

The reason for Dorian being on bad terms with his family is never fully explained until this moment but the game hints at it every time the subject of his family comes up. His conflict with his family and his father in particular are not is the reason he became so close with Alexius and Felix with the latter becoming something of a surrogate father and the other being effectively his brother.

It's not the most important part of his story but it is a vital part to help explain his character.

Taash being non-binary just doesn't feel like it's that important to their character while being a fire-breather is important.

Dorian being gay works because of what we know about Tevinter while Taash being non-binary almost feels like an after thought. Everything about Dorian is tied together to make one of my all time favorite characters in the series. His sexuality, his backstory, his relationship with his mentor, his family, Felix and you all contribute to his character while Taash feels disconnected from themselves.

As you pointed out Off-Screen Taash is a completely different character from On-Screen Taash which hurts their character.

Just to make this point clear I don't dislike Taash, I find them rather funny at times and several parts of their character is rather endearing, I think their romance with Harding is adorable, their well acted as I honestly can't think of a single scene that is poorly performed and their useful in game. If I was to rank all the characters in Veilguard and the series as a whole Taash would be in the middle, their not the best but their far from the worst.

For me I would say that Anders from DA2 is the companion in the series & Dorian and Varric tied in first place.

[hammerofglass]

The thing is, Taash being non-binary isn't supposed to be important. The game doesn't treat it as important. The other characters don't treat it as important, they just update pronouns and move on. Even Taash in-universe doesn't think it's that important; other than asking people to refer to them differently and resolving some stress it changes nothing about their life. The one time they get accidentally misgendered in the game they wave it off, and then it's Isabella who decides to make a whole production out of it.

Actually the comparison with Dorian is pretty solid. Dorian is the Tevinter companion with daddy issues who incidentally is gay, Taash is the Firebreather with mommy issues who incidentally is non-binary.

Also just to be clear, off-screen Taash is such an asshole I can't imagine this jolly pack of cinnamon roll companions letting them stick around much less having any affection for them. Just a petty bully.

[Madner Kami]

The one time they get accidentally misgendered in the game they wave it off, and then it's Isabella who decides to make a whole production out of it.

Oh gawd, yes. Easily one of the dumbest scenes in gaming history. "Pulling a Barv" is hands down the dumbest way to deal with such a situation, heck any situation. Don't want to draw attention to it? But that's all you are doing right there... geezus fucking christ. What happened to just an honest apology and doing better next time? When did that fall out of fashion? And please, no, put that stupid philosophizing about an apology being an egotistical thing in the... what's it called? In Germany, when you wanna tell someone to put away their stupid idea, you tell them to "Put it into the circular tray.", meaning, to put it into the trash-bin or "Put into the Tray P" with P being the "Papierkorb", the waste-paper-basket. I could swear there was a similar english idiom, but it escapes my sleep-deprived mind...

Anyways, Pulling a Barv up yours, whoever wrote that bullshit.

Also just to be clear, off-screen Taash is such an asshole I can't imagine this jolly pack of cinnamon roll companions letting them stick around much less having any affection for them. Just a petty bully.

So I presume the calling Emmerich names is largely off-screen? It has often been pointed out, that for someone who doesn't want to be (mis)labeled by others, Taash intentionally puts labels with full disregard of the recipients' wishes, on a lot of things and obviously maelific labels at that. Who wrote that and thought this is ok?

[hammerofglass]

... what's it called? In Germany, when you wanna tell someone to put away their stupid idea, you tell them to "Put it into the circular tray.", meaning, to put it into the trash-bin or "Put into the Tray P" with P being the "Papierkorb", the waste-paper-basket. I could swear there was a similar english idiom, but it escapes my sleep-deprived mind...

Put it in the round filing bin.