What do I mean by Anime style Fan Service?

[MithrandirOlorin]

http://jaredmithrandirolorin.blogspot.c ... e-fan.html

As someone who's almost exclusively turning to Anime for my entertainment lately. The only thing about it I dislike is what I call 'Anime style fan service".

I should explain what I mean by that. Since the term fan service isn't even always sexual, and when it is can apply to anything a horny viewer might enjoy.

I don't have a problem with women dressing sexy, or being sexy, or having sex, or using their sexuality as a weapon, I enjoy that as much as any other straight guy or lesbian.

There is even some fan service that I'm not a fan of that still isn't offensive to me in the way this stuff is. Like Beach Episodes, Beach Episodes may or may not contain what I'm talking about, but regardless that premise itself is fan service, but going to the beach is something people do. I don't care for it and wouldn't be likely to include one in a show I wrote, but they don't bother me.

Still it's hard for me to give it all a single common denominator. But I think I can maybe narrow it all down to three. DigiBro has also talked about fan service in his K-On videos and in videos specifically about fan service. I don't quite always agree with his takes on things though.

I want to say before getting started that not all Anime has this stuff. I don't think it's even safe to say the majority does. And a number of shows unfortunately have it early on to hook people (but turning off others) but then basically drops it. Nanoha drops it's Loli fan service about half way through it's first season. And I haven't watched it but according to DigiBro Manabi Straight has some awkward fan service moments in it's very first episode that never show up again.

There are plenty of Anime I've enjoyed in-spite of having these problems. But they are still a mark against it and the more it has the less likely it is I'll be able to give it a 10 on MAL. A lot of my fellow feminists really enjoy certain shows that are high offender of this but being really self aware and meta about it while trying to deliver a message. But Kill la Kill turns me off from it's very art style so I can't get into it.

Number One: Is mainly an issue of what the Camera is doing, or since we're talking about animation the hypothetical camera. The way it seems to zoom in on panties or breasts or butts no mater how illogical it is at that moment. Like in the second Evangelion Rebuild movie when we are given a close up on Asuka's panties while she's sleeping.

Whether or not I particularly want to see a female character's panties, I can't call it offensive if she is intentionally showing them to someone. So those kinds of scenes are not my issue really. You can even justify if character are seeing them when she didn't intend to though that'd still be uncomfortable. But if the audience is being shown a close up on them when no one on the show can see them, that's a problem.

Again it's not them being visible at all that is the problem, it's that being the main thing the hypothetical camera wants to focus on. You could say the Magic Skirt trope is the opposite counterpart, that ti's a type of teasing fans service itself when they are never visible no matter implausible it is. I guess I'm simply the kind of person where that is what I like. But the 90s Sailor Moon anime did allow what's under the skirts to be visible sometimes (DiC often edited those moments) but it was never what the camera zoomed in on. Likewise with the live action show PGSM.

Number Two: Is about the physiology of human female breasts in certain Anime. If it was only a matter of exaggerated size I couldn't call it specific to Anime, we see the same thing in Western Superhero Comics. What I mean here is a combination of that with them seemingly having the density of Jello.

Now I'm someone who doesn't consider being unrealistic inherently a criticism, I'll be a making a post specifically on that some day. But the point there is I want fiction to be preferable to reality, and I can't relate to the fact that seemingly some Anime fans want breasts to have the density of Jello.

Number Three: Is the only scenario that is directly from the writing. The script writer could put 1 and 2 right in the script, but it could just as easily be something a director added along the development process.

I'm referring to the overused Accidental Groping or Accidental Pervert scenario. But my issue isn't the same as many others you see complaining about it. You it seems to a lot of people what bothers them is the woman "overacting" to it and not immediately assuming it was an accident.

We live a world where a man who bragged about grabbing women by the Pussy got elected President of the United States. Women have every reason to not just assume it was an accident or take a guy's word for it. And Japanese culture still has a much greater fixation on feminine purity then the West has, so no western Anime viewer male or female knows what it's like to be a Japanese woman dealing with that.

My issue is with happening to begin with, not cause it's unrealistic, but because I simply won't wanna see that.

So I'm tired of that scene with Rei and Shingi from Evangelion being cited by people like DigiBro as the ultimate Subversion or Deconstruction of this trope. Cause what they keep saying is that it's soooo much more realistic that Rei doesn't slap him. But that wasn't Anno's intent, the intent was to show that Rei isn't normal, her indifference to her breasts being grabbed shows that she's abnormal. It is a Subversion because it playing out differently at all makes it one. But it does not fix what I see as being wrong with how often this happens in Anime. That's why SFDebris is the only reviewer I've seen have the correct reaction to that sequence.

The subversion I might be willing to consider subversive is it not really being an accident at all but a creepy guy trying to play it off as one. But you'd have to be very careful with addressing that since that is sexual assault.

[Admiral X]

I honestly don't mind it that much, and can actually quite enjoy it if it isn't done stupidly, in which case my reaction is more to laugh than anything else. For me it's more a matter of whether it grows naturally out of the story, or if it's just shoved in your face constantly like in something like High School of the Dead or Burst Angel. Burst Angel is a little more amusing in that there are constant examples of camel toe and pokies, yet in instances of actual nudity, the body parts that cause these are either conveniently hidden, or the characters just develop a case of Barbie anatomy. I guess for me it's more a matter of what the show is about, and how seriously I'm supposed to take it. For me, High School of the Dead was a disappointment because it honestly could have been like the Japanese version of The Walking Dead, but it was filled with some of the most ridiculous fan service I've ever seen, with constant panty shots and weird physics-defying boobs. Of course I also like to make fun of shows like Sekirei, even though the entire point of the show was always its fan service, because of ridiculous things like clothes shredding because of a punch and the like. Also, I found that show to be mind-numbingly boring for long stretches and very formulaic to the point that the nudity was all the show had going for it, and even that wasn't terribly enjoyable because of the context of it. Plus the whole deal with the useless male protagonist who has to be pure to the point of being a monk, like in every harem show ever, even if they aren't so free with boobs (Ah! My Goddess comes to mind).

So basically, the upshot of that long ramble is that it's not a matter of me liking or disliking fan service per say, it's how the fan service is executed.

Incidentally, one of the funny things about Evangelion for me is all the nudity in the rebuild movies (having only seen the first two at this point), especially since it's all been Rei. In the End of Evangelion movie, I took the infamous scene with Shinji jacking off to Asuka to be something of a shot at the obsessive fanboys who literally did/do masturbate to these characters, yet the rebuild seems to be going along with that and even providing more fap material.

[excalibur]

I think this video tells a lot about fanservice https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uKZOBcZVMD0

[Admiral X]

I largely agree with him as far as it's more about the context of the fan service, mainly just because I'm not a prude. The thing I don't really agree with him on is that if the show was mainly meant to be not serious or just fan service from the get-go gives it some kind of a pass. To me, if the entire point of the show is just fan service, then it is a bad show. If all I want is boobs, I can look that up on the internet anytime I want, or pick from any number of other sources of pornography. Ecchi for ecchi's sake is pointless and you might as well go full hentai, IMO. I mean, no one expects much from porn either.

I also agree with him in that I find a lot of the tropes associated with fan service to be tiresome, like where the male main character accidentally sees a female character in a state of undress, and she screams and slaps him or beats him up in some way. It's definitely a lot better when the character wants to be seen by the other character.

[MithrandirOlorin]

I think this video tells a lot about fanservice https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uKZOBcZVMD0

That is one of the Digibro videos I had in mind when I made the OP. I agree with him on some things but not all.

[excalibur]

I think going back to this, there are more misconceptions of Anime because of fan service. At a glance, one can also see it as a lot of pervert fantasies, which isn't going to be denied, but miss the entire point because people always encompass an art style into one genre when anime is made up of multiple genre. It's like saying "I like to watch movies"...you can't get any more vague than that other than saying "visual media".

This is why I continue to encourage people to watch a genre of anime they are into. Some like horror, others like detective mystery. A lot prefer just action. When asked, there's an almost countless amount of choices to introduce someone into this. Even printed media like "Light novels" for the people who just loves to read can be used.