TOS: Patterns of Force

[clearspira]

Except wasn't Jim Crow predominantly in the South? It's not as if it was part of The Union legacy or something, both it and the Confederacy are part of the South's legacy.

The first thing the Union should have done upon victory was to say ''this Union legacy of yours? stick it up your butt.'' That's the thing about being the winner - you get to tell the loser what to do.
I do want to emphasise that I am really just being petty to Charles here due to his all or nothing attitude concerning the Germans and want him to know it by picking another all or nothing example. Reducto ad absurdum is the word for today.

Did you assume I'd be a Southern apologist?

As for German blame for the Nazi party, it boils down to the fact there is a history of attempts by certain parties to rewrite history. To state all atrocities by the German government during WW2 were the activities of Nazi party members, the SS, and a small group of "bad seeds."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clean_Wehrmacht

It's important that the monstrousness of the Confederacy and Nazis not be de-emphasized or the people who allowed them to get away with their actions. The average German who finds themselves in a police state is not a perpetrator but a victim but the assumption that people were ignorant of what the Nazis were or the numbers of people who supported Hitler or his atrocities were miniscule is bad history.

TBH, yes, it had crossed my mind that you might be a hyprocrite. But I am not above admitting that I am a petty man and TBH again, probably wouldn't have written what I just wrote if I wasn't drinking (its late here). You have my apologies, its not like my country can claim any high ground on treating others like crap.

[Admiral X]

Have to say, I'm really sick of the fact discussion on this subject matter seems to be basically impossible anymore. It's honestly like the more extremely vocal among us have gotten their history lessons from movies and comic books and can't handle the idea of nuance in the discussion. It's really frustrating.

[CharlesPhipps]

Have to say, I'm really sick of the fact discussion on this subject matter seems to be basically impossible anymore. It's honestly like the more extremely vocal among us have gotten their history lessons from movies and comic books and can't handle the idea of nuance in the discussion. It's really frustrating.

Not a word more of RL, I promise.

[BridgeConsoleMasher]

Except wasn't Jim Crow predominantly in the South? It's not as if it was part of The Union legacy or something, both it and the Confederacy are part of the South's legacy.

The first thing the Union should have done upon victory was to say ''this Union legacy of yours? stick it up your butt.'' That's the thing about being the winner - you get to tell the loser what to do.
I do want to emphasise that I am really just being petty to Charles here due to his all or nothing attitude concerning the Germans and want him to know it by picking another all or nothing example. Reducto ad absurdum is the word for today.

Did you assume I'd be a Southern apologist?

As for German blame for the Nazi party, it boils down to the fact there is a history of attempts by certain parties to rewrite history. To state all atrocities by the German government during WW2 were the activities of Nazi party members, the SS, and a small group of "bad seeds."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clean_Wehrmacht

It's important that the monstrousness of the Confederacy and Nazis not be de-emphasized or the people who allowed them to get away with their actions. The average German who finds themselves in a police state is not a perpetrator but a victim but the assumption that people were ignorant of what the Nazis were or the numbers of people who supported Hitler or his atrocities were miniscule is bad history.

TBH, yes, it had crossed my mind that you might be a hyprocrite. But I am not above admitting that I am a petty man and TBH again, probably wouldn't have written what I just wrote if I wasn't drinking (its late here). You have my apologies, its not like my country can claim any high ground on treating others like crap.

Not late enough apparently.

just kidding.

[BridgeConsoleMasher]

Have to say, I'm really sick of the fact discussion on this subject matter seems to be basically impossible anymore. It's honestly like the more extremely vocal among us have gotten their history lessons from movies and comic books and can't handle the idea of nuance in the discussion. It's really frustrating.

I would say it isn't the most volatile of topics of its kind in itself.

[Boundless_Cheer]

This episode is one of the reasons why I could never take the idea of treating TOS as "canon", in the sense of every little detail and the dated aesthetic being inviolable holy writ binding all subsequent series forever, entirely seriously.

[Yukaphile]

Well, Harve Bennett took that approach, like for The Voyage Home, when having Kirk ask if the humpback whale existed on any other planet, probably a reference to how humans are spread across many other worlds in TOS, which doesn't stand up to logic, but there it is, as he had watched every episode at least once. There's a man who did his homework.

[Admiral X]

Something neither JJ Abrams, nor any of the schmucks currently running the franchise can claim. Props to both Bennett and Meyer for doing their homework.

[Beastro]

This episode is one of the reasons why I could never take the idea of treating TOS as "canon", in the sense of every little detail and the dated aesthetic being inviolable holy writ binding all subsequent series forever, entirely seriously.

TOS canon comes with an almost unspeakable rule about episodes like this where they are default ignored.

[Deledrius]

This episode is one of the reasons why I could never take the idea of treating TOS as "canon", in the sense of every little detail and the dated aesthetic being inviolable holy writ binding all subsequent series forever, entirely seriously.

TOS canon comes with an almost unspeakable rule about episodes like this where they are default ignored.

Basically, the TNG era already did this work for us at this point. It chose which elements would become "the franchise".