The Hermit's Journey. To arms, prequel defenders, to arms!

[Karha of Honor]

The EU had its audience, and there was good stuff in there... but for all that there were FORTY YEARS of comics and novels... (which contradicted themselves as well!) how much really came out of them that were widely appreciated?

Han and Leia's kids? Zahn's Thrawn trilogy? And as a result of that maybe Mara Jade?

8000 different stories about cleaning up remnant bits of the Empire? (WHich they eventually realized had gotten old which is when they introduced the Vong 20 years later.. which could have worked but was badly executed and for way too long.) Luke almost going to the dark side a bunch of times? The most interesting ideas carried forward in some iteration.

We got Thrawn in the new cartoon. We got Han and Leia's kid going Dark Side. We didn't get a wife for Luke, but since we're not following every second of his life for decades that matters less than it did.

For all that there were 40 years of material and people that loved them (I'm among them) there honestly wasn't *that* much truly worth preserving, that much that was widely accepted and acclaimed that everyone pointed to and went "THAT is exactly how it should be." Out of hundreds of novels and thousands of comics, mostly just the Thrawn trilogy. And really, 40 years is a long time.
They don't burn your copies of the old material or your memories of it, but it was time for a clean start. No long running franchise that has more than one creator can go that long without needing a clean restart occasionally. Look at Marvel and DC soft reboot themselves once a decade.

Everything started running into contradictions as far back as the prequel trilogy starting. Heck, event the first Clone Wars cartoon, made in 2003, that was awesome as heck... was already wiped out of canon once the CGI show started... in 2008!

At least KotoR is basically still intact because it goes so far back none of the new changes touch it anyway.

2 kotors, certain SWTOR storylines, Legacy by Ostrander had some good buzz. There ill not be an another KOTOR comic book. it is dead unlike the Treklit in the original universe.


They don't burn your copies of the old material or your memories of it, but it was time for a clean start. No long running franchise that has more than one creator can go that long without needing a clean restart occasionally. Look at Marvel and DC soft reboot themselves once a decade.

They play around with about 80 years and a lot Earth stuff the EU played around with 30000 and a gieant galaxy. Way easier to manage.

[Winter]

The EU had its audience, and there was good stuff in there... but for all that there were FORTY YEARS of comics and novels... (which contradicted themselves as well!) how much really came out of them that were widely appreciated?

Han and Leia's kids? Zahn's Thrawn trilogy? And as a result of that maybe Mara Jade?

8000 different stories about cleaning up remnant bits of the Empire? (WHich they eventually realized had gotten old which is when they introduced the Vong 20 years later.. which could have worked but was badly executed and for way too long.) Luke almost going to the dark side a bunch of times? The most interesting ideas carried forward in some iteration.

We got Thrawn in the new cartoon. We got Han and Leia's kid going Dark Side. We didn't get a wife for Luke, but since we're not following every second of his life for decades that matters less than it did.

For all that there were 40 years of material and people that loved them (I'm among them) there honestly wasn't *that* much truly worth preserving, that much that was widely accepted and acclaimed that everyone pointed to and went "THAT is exactly how it should be." Out of hundreds of novels and thousands of comics, mostly just the Thrawn trilogy. And really, 40 years is a long time.
They don't burn your copies of the old material or your memories of it, but it was time for a clean start. No long running franchise that has more than one creator can go that long without needing a clean restart occasionally. Look at Marvel and DC soft reboot themselves once a decade.

Everything started running into contradictions as far back as the prequel trilogy starting. Heck, event the first Clone Wars cartoon, made in 2003, that was awesome as heck... was already wiped out of canon once the CGI show started... in 2008!

At least KotoR is basically still intact because it goes so far back none of the new changes touch it anyway.

I see what you mean but at the same time I still kinda wish they just didn't throw it all away. However, I do wonder what the story that Lucas had come up with looked like. Honestly I would like to see that story in the same vain as The Star Wars comics, where we what could have been if Lucas had made his third draft of his movie. Get some top notch writers to smooth out the rough edges and put it to paper and see what they come up with.

But that's for another time back to the EU. I do wonder, given the mixed reception of the Disney Era movies I wonder if Disney will reboot the franchise at some point in the future. I doubt they would reboot the entire franchise as the fanbase would never hear of it and thanks to the Clone Wars and Rebels, along with the fans warming up to them over the last few years, I don't think anyone would want the Prequels to be wiped from canon so it's more likely that Disney would pretty much ignore everything after Return of the Jedi.

Should this come to pass I can only see one of two out comes. One they adapt Lucas' original ideas, which is sadly very unlikely with the passing of Carrie Fisher, (F#ck you 2016) or get new actors to play the original trio and adapt The Thrawn Trilogy.

Sense I have no idea what Lucas' story for Episode's 7 through 9 look like I'd do admit that I am a bit more interested in a adaption of the Thrawn Trilogy and given just how highly praised Thrawn has been over on Star Wars Rebels I'd say that its more likely we would see something like this.

What do you think, would you want to see a adaptation of the story that gave birth to the original Star Wars EU or are you just fine with the Disney films?

[Nevix]

The EU had its audience, and there was good stuff in there... but for all that there were FORTY YEARS of comics and novels... (which contradicted themselves as well!) how much really came out of them that were widely appreciated?

Han and Leia's kids? Zahn's Thrawn trilogy? And as a result of that maybe Mara Jade?

8000 different stories about cleaning up remnant bits of the Empire? (WHich they eventually realized had gotten old which is when they introduced the Vong 20 years later.. which could have worked but was badly executed and for way too long.) Luke almost going to the dark side a bunch of times? The most interesting ideas carried forward in some iteration.

We got Thrawn in the new cartoon. We got Han and Leia's kid going Dark Side. We didn't get a wife for Luke, but since we're not following every second of his life for decades that matters less than it did.

For all that there were 40 years of material and people that loved them (I'm among them) there honestly wasn't *that* much truly worth preserving, that much that was widely accepted and acclaimed that everyone pointed to and went "THAT is exactly how it should be." Out of hundreds of novels and thousands of comics, mostly just the Thrawn trilogy. And really, 40 years is a long time.
They don't burn your copies of the old material or your memories of it, but it was time for a clean start. No long running franchise that has more than one creator can go that long without needing a clean restart occasionally. Look at Marvel and DC soft reboot themselves once a decade.

Everything started running into contradictions as far back as the prequel trilogy starting. Heck, event the first Clone Wars cartoon, made in 2003, that was awesome as heck... was already wiped out of canon once the CGI show started... in 2008!

At least KotoR is basically still intact because it goes so far back none of the new changes touch it anyway.

2 kotors, certain SWTOR storylines, Legacy by Ostrander had some good buzz. There ill not be an another KOTOR comic book. it is dead unlike the Treklit in the original universe.


They don't burn your copies of the old material or your memories of it, but it was time for a clean start. No long running franchise that has more than one creator can go that long without needing a clean restart occasionally. Look at Marvel and DC soft reboot themselves once a decade.

They play around with about 80 years and a lot Earth stuff the EU played around with 30000 and a gieant galaxy. Way easier to manage.

If you play Star Wars: The Old Republic, you get books 3 through 10 of KOTOR's storyline, as the creators saw a way to get the story through there. Although... watching a story summary/story video collection is probably better.

Like Chuck's review of ToR, from the Infiltrator's viewpoint.

As for the actual Hermit's Journey... I think the division with George Lucas results from his push for digital filming being heavily overshadowed by how badly he messed up on the Prequels, and by him selling Star Wars to Disney.

He's (arguably) a genius creator... if you keep his flaws in check. Flaws that I know more about thanks to the Hermit's Journey documentary. I also DO know how influential George Lucas was in the initial push for Digital Film and other innovations too.

[Karha of Honor]

The EU had its audience, and there was good stuff in there... but for all that there were FORTY YEARS of comics and novels... (which contradicted themselves as well!) how much really came out of them that were widely appreciated?

Han and Leia's kids? Zahn's Thrawn trilogy? And as a result of that maybe Mara Jade?

8000 different stories about cleaning up remnant bits of the Empire? (WHich they eventually realized had gotten old which is when they introduced the Vong 20 years later.. which could have worked but was badly executed and for way too long.) Luke almost going to the dark side a bunch of times? The most interesting ideas carried forward in some iteration.

We got Thrawn in the new cartoon. We got Han and Leia's kid going Dark Side. We didn't get a wife for Luke, but since we're not following every second of his life for decades that matters less than it did.

For all that there were 40 years of material and people that loved them (I'm among them) there honestly wasn't *that* much truly worth preserving, that much that was widely accepted and acclaimed that everyone pointed to and went "THAT is exactly how it should be." Out of hundreds of novels and thousands of comics, mostly just the Thrawn trilogy. And really, 40 years is a long time.
They don't burn your copies of the old material or your memories of it, but it was time for a clean start. No long running franchise that has more than one creator can go that long without needing a clean restart occasionally. Look at Marvel and DC soft reboot themselves once a decade.

Everything started running into contradictions as far back as the prequel trilogy starting. Heck, event the first Clone Wars cartoon, made in 2003, that was awesome as heck... was already wiped out of canon once the CGI show started... in 2008!

At least KotoR is basically still intact because it goes so far back none of the new changes touch it anyway.

2 kotors, certain SWTOR storylines, Legacy by Ostrander had some good buzz. There ill not be an another KOTOR comic book. it is dead unlike the Treklit in the original universe.


They don't burn your copies of the old material or your memories of it, but it was time for a clean start. No long running franchise that has more than one creator can go that long without needing a clean restart occasionally. Look at Marvel and DC soft reboot themselves once a decade.

They play around with about 80 years and a lot Earth stuff the EU played around with 30000 and a gieant galaxy. Way easier to manage.

If you play Star Wars: The Old Republic, you get books 3 through 10 of KOTOR's storyline, as the creators saw a way to get the story through there. Although... watching a story summary/story video collection is probably better.

Like Chuck's review of ToR, from the Infiltrator's viewpoint.

As for the actual Hermit's Journey... I think the division with George Lucas results from his push for digital filming being heavily overshadowed by how badly he messed up on the Prequels, and by him selling Star Wars to Disney.

He's (arguably) a genius creator... if you keep his flaws in check. Flaws that I know more about thanks to the Hermit's Journey documentary. I also DO know how influential George Lucas was in the initial push for Digital Film and other innovations too.

Genius creator...

He mixed other stuff well once and is friends with a lot of industry people. That is it.

[J!!]

disney did not spend 4 billion dollars to buy some else's glorified fanfiction.

they spent 4 billion dollars so that they could make their own glorified fanfiction.

[Madner Kami]

I see what you mean but at the same time I still kinda wish they just didn't throw it all away. However, I do wonder what the story that Lucas had come up with looked like. Honestly I would like to see that story in the same vain as The Star Wars comics, where we what could have been if Lucas had made his third draft of his movie. Get some top notch writers to smooth out the rough edges and put it to paper and see what they come up with.

But that's for another time back to the EU. I do wonder, given the mixed reception of the Disney Era movies I wonder if Disney will reboot the franchise at some point in the future. I doubt they would reboot the entire franchise as the fanbase would never hear of it and thanks to the Clone Wars and Rebels, along with the fans warming up to them over the last few years, I don't think anyone would want the Prequels to be wiped from canon so it's more likely that Disney would pretty much ignore everything after Return of the Jedi.

Should this come to pass I can only see one of two out comes. One they adapt Lucas' original ideas, which is sadly very unlikely with the passing of Carrie Fisher, (F#ck you 2016) or get new actors to play the original trio and adapt The Thrawn Trilogy.

Sense I have no idea what Lucas' story for Episode's 7 through 9 look like I'd do admit that I am a bit more interested in a adaption of the Thrawn Trilogy and given just how highly praised Thrawn has been over on Star Wars Rebels I'd say that its more likely we would see something like this.

What do you think, would you want to see a adaptation of the story that gave birth to the original Star Wars EU or are you just fine with the Disney films?

Why are you people so hot on Reboots all the time? The beauty of the SW-setting in particular is in how easy you can expand the story of the setting wherever you please. They got an entire galaxy to play with and an unfathombale timeline to explore. You simply do not need reboots at all.

[Karha of Honor]

disney did not spend 4 billion dollars to buy some else's glorified fanfiction.

they spent 4 billion dollars so that they could make their own glorified fanfiction.

Fan fiction that at one time cost 200 million dollars to make one product.

And erasing everyhing got them what exactly?

[ChiggyvonRichthofen]

For all that there were 40 years of material and people that loved them (I'm among them) there honestly wasn't *that* much truly worth preserving, that much that was widely accepted and acclaimed that everyone pointed to and went "THAT is exactly how it should be." Out of hundreds of novels and thousands of comics, mostly just the Thrawn trilogy. And really, 40 years is a long time.
They don't burn your copies of the old material or your memories of it, but it was time for a clean start. No long running franchise that has more than one creator can go that long without needing a clean restart occasionally. Look at Marvel and DC soft reboot themselves once a decade.

As someone who has definitely not kept up on all of the EU material, I agree, and I don't think it's exclusive to Star Wars EU.

Publishers and the various powers that be are obviously out there for the money, and they know that the vast majority of their audience are established fans of certain characters or a certain time period. They want minutiae filled in and tertiary characters explored. There can be good stories made out of this sort of stuff, but a lot of times the most interesting parts of that story have already been told. So the creativity of writers are hampered by expectation and all the boxes that they have to check off to tell a story that's going to sell to the intended audience. Most often there aren't going to be many risks taken with the characters, and the lack of a real ending can be a big problem for a story.

There are a ton of examples of an artist having to come to terms with the popularity of his or her creation/character. We saw it with Leonard Nimoy as Spock, and with Arthur Conan Doyle and Sherlock Holmes. Alec Guinness went from seeing Star Wars as a fun little movie with a certain charm to (at least partially) resenting its hold over his career.

Another factor is the level of talent involved, which is again related to money. Because of the creative problems associated with EU-type stuff, and maybe the stigma attached to it, a lot of talented artists aren't going to want to become involved. With the movies it's a different story, and companies like Disney are willing to pay big money to get the best vfx, sfx, and some exciting writers or directors. And because that's where the big money is, of course they're willing to overwrite everything else if it gets in the way of what they want to do. Of course, the movies also tie themselves (way too closely, imo) to the OT because they know that's what draws in the fans. Star Trek has been doing the same thing for 15 years now.

To me, outside the movies the best Star Wars material has easily been its video games, in part because a great video game has different requirements than a great book or comic. At least a couple titles are among the all-time best games.

[MerelyAFan]

Truly the greatest loss of the old SW EU canon was the term Moffrences and high ranking imperial officers acknowledging each other with "I bid you dark greetings."

[Karha of Honor]

For all that there were 40 years of material and people that loved them (I'm among them) there honestly wasn't *that* much truly worth preserving, that much that was widely accepted and acclaimed that everyone pointed to and went "THAT is exactly how it should be." Out of hundreds of novels and thousands of comics, mostly just the Thrawn trilogy. And really, 40 years is a long time.
They don't burn your copies of the old material or your memories of it, but it was time for a clean start. No long running franchise that has more than one creator can go that long without needing a clean restart occasionally. Look at Marvel and DC soft reboot themselves once a decade.

As someone who has definitely not kept up on all of the EU material, I agree, and I don't think it's exclusive to Star Wars EU.

Publishers and the various powers that be are obviously out there for the money, and they know that the vast majority of their audience are established fans of certain characters or a certain time period. They want minutiae filled in and tertiary characters explored. There can be good stories made out of this sort of stuff, but a lot of times the most interesting parts of that story have already been told. So the creativity of writers are hampered by expectation and all the boxes that they have to check off to tell a story that's going to sell to the intended audience. Most often there aren't going to be many risks taken with the characters, and the lack of a real ending can be a big problem for a story.

There are a ton of examples of an artist having to come to terms with the popularity of his or her creation/character. We saw it with Leonard Nimoy as Spock, and with Arthur Conan Doyle and Sherlock Holmes. Alec Guinness went from seeing Star Wars as a fun little movie with a certain charm to (at least partially) resenting its hold over his career.

Another factor is the level of talent involved, which is again related to money. Because of the creative problems associated with EU-type stuff, and maybe the stigma attached to it, a lot of talented artists aren't going to want to become involved. With the movies it's a different story, and companies like Disney are willing to pay big money to get the best vfx, sfx, and some exciting writers or directors. And because that's where the big money is, of course they're willing to overwrite everything else if it gets in the way of what they want to do. Of course, the movies also tie themselves (way too closely, imo) to the OT because they know that's what draws in the fans. Star Trek has been doing the same thing for 15 years now.

To me, outside the movies the best Star Wars material has easily been its video games, in part because a great video game has different requirements than a great book or comic. At least a couple titles are among the all-time best games.

Star Wars directors were historically nothing special. I would not want the greatest filmmakers doing it even if i am deep SW fan. I do not think the semi fairy tale world SW needs the best artists to begin with.