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I certainly agree with Chuck about the habit of Voyager's writers tend to undercut the dramatic potential of their own stories. Although Prey is overall decent, and it does come in what's arguably Voyager's best season.

Scorpion was arguably the best of Voyager, but Species 8472 was always doomed to lose their luster in future appearances. They'd have a hard time regularly showing them today on a tv budget, let alone over 20 years ago. As cool as they might have been in their first appearance, it would have been just as well for them to either be a one-off or else to have stayed consistently on the "edges" of episodes, talked about, feared, but rarely seen.

ChiggyvonRichthofen wrote: ↑Sun Feb 09, 2020 10:39 pm I certainly agree with Chuck about the habit of Voyager's writers tend to undercut the dramatic potential of their own stories. Although Prey is overall decent, and it does come in what's arguably Voyager's best season.

Scorpion was arguably the best of Voyager, but Species 8472 was always doomed to lose their luster in future appearances. They'd have a hard time regularly showing them today on a tv budget, let alone over 20 years ago. As cool as they might have been in their first appearance, it would have been just as well for them to either be a one-off or else to have stayed consistently on the "edges" of episodes, talked about, feared, but rarely seen.

Species 8472 are somewhat remarkable in that while it took several seasons for Voyager to nerf the Borg into becoming little more than an active pest, the former were made into just another Delta Quadrant alien species in little more than a year and a half. Its a telling sign that of the two races original to this show featured in Prey, it would be the Hirogen that would not only get more explored but be a bigger threat to Voyager in future episodes.

Fianna wrote: ↑Sat Feb 08, 2020 8:13 pm Seemed to me like there was an obvious "take a third option" solution to this dilemma: send both the 8472 and the Hirogen hunter to the 8472's universe. That would allow him to continue the hunt, just like the Hirogen were insisting.

Sure, he'd almost certainly be killed hunting the 8472 on their home turf, and would even if he survived, is unlikely to find a way back to his home universe, but if the Hirogen are as big into hunting as they claim, their response to that should be, "Challenge accepted!"

+1 I think this would have been a better ending than just effectively capitulating.

Up until this episode, the standard 7 of 9 episode was: 7 is still loyal to the Borg, therefore, she tries to destroy the ship, therefore Janeway instantly forgives her. This episode is 7 of 9 saves the ship, therefore Janeway instantly punishes her.

Everybody looking forward to the first Spiderman review?

"The Sick Bay force field goes down" It's really a shame Starfleet doesn't have more advanced technology for holding prisoners. May, something like iron bars and a deadbolt?

It's long been noted that Janeway's personality/opinions favor what the writer wants to say that episode rather than follow consistent characterization. She's right. Everyone who doesn't agree with her is wrong, even if she takes diametrically opposed positions from one episode to another.

However, I'd say the education of Seven of Nine did pose some problems. She wanted to encourage her individuality, but also was running a ship with a military command structure. The two situations ARE going to clash at some point.

To a lesser degree, the "politeness lessons" are a similar conflict. Because we are emotional beings, we react to things like tone of voice, inflection, and word choice. Sometimes that means in order to get the best result, we don't use the most direct or honest language. We balance some of our individual needs with harmony in the group because there are long term benefits.

It's something we figure out as we grow up. Seven is being dumped into it as an adult AND is in a military environment.

cdrood wrote: ↑Mon Feb 10, 2020 4:00 pm "The Sick Bay force field goes down" It's really a shame Starfleet doesn't have more advanced technology for holding prisoners. May, something like iron bars and a deadbolt?

I always assumed that the sickbay force field was for quarantine rather than for holding prisoners. That's why the Doctor can walk through it as he would be the only member of the medical staff who could do so safely.

Still a bit worrying that the ship's smallpox defences can ''go down'' without warning however...

clearspira wrote: ↑Mon Feb 10, 2020 6:19 pm

cdrood wrote: ↑Mon Feb 10, 2020 4:00 pm "The Sick Bay force field goes down" It's really a shame Starfleet doesn't have more advanced technology for holding prisoners. May, something like iron bars and a deadbolt?

I always assumed that the sickbay force field was for quarantine rather than for holding prisoners. That's why the Doctor can walk through it as he would be the only member of the medical staff who could do so safely.

Still a bit worrying that the ship's smallpox defences can ''go down'' without warning however...

It's one of those things where "drama" contrivances outweigh basic in-universe design solutions, like Neelix being able to bypass computer security. There's no way that the crucial forcefields in Sickbay and the Brig wouldn't have an independent power supply with failsafes (some likely physical), given the level of technology in the Federation.

But that would make it hard to write cliché plots where the prisoner/contagion escapes due to an exciting combat scene!

cdrood wrote: ↑Mon Feb 10, 2020 4:00 pm "The Sick Bay force field goes down" It's really a shame Starfleet doesn't have more advanced technology for holding prisoners. May, something like iron bars and a deadbolt?

So many of the foes Starfleet goes up against would shred those like tinfoil that it isn't worth the extra weight, plus when the forcefields go down it usually means the "warp core breach immanent" alarm is about to go off and you don't want to leave a prisoner to be explodified.
You gotta give them the same chance to run for their lives as everybody else.