DIS - Such Sweet Sorrow, Part 1

[FlynnTaggart]

As someone who coined the phrase "the idiocy that is Voyager" Chuck just sounds so frustrated with this show, full on Danny Glover "I'm getting too old for this". Or maybe thats me projecting my own feelings.

Anyway being a fan hater who I swore to destroy not join aside, this episode seems to take the cake on nonsensicallness which I don't think is even a real word hence how nonsensical the episode is. A plan that makes zero sense, a plot driven by writer logic then any internal logic, and a solution that involves knowledge of some other media.

Also planet woman's blinking kinda disturbs me for some reason.

I really hope the Pike show is good. I'll give it a chance but thats about it.

[Link8909]

As someone who coined the phrase "the idiocy that is Voyager" Chuck just sounds so frustrated with this show, full on Danny Glover "I'm getting too old for this". Or maybe thats me projecting my own feelings.

Anyway being a fan hater who I swore to destroy not join aside, this episode seems to take the cake on nonsensicallness which I don't think is even a real word hence how nonsensical the episode is. A plan that makes zero sense, a plot driven by writer logic then any internal logic, and a solution that involves knowledge of some other media.

Also planet woman's blinking kinda disturbs me for some reason.

I really hope the Pike show is good. I'll give it a chance but thats about it.

Honestly going by the sort of episodic type episodes of Discovery like "Magic to Make the Sanest Man Go Mad", "New Eden", and "The Sound of Thunder", which on their own are really good episodes, coupled with interesting characters and characterization, which I feel is the strongest part of Discovery, I'd say Strange New Worlds has a good chance of being really good, it's going to come down to what the stories are and how well they're executed which nobody knows right now.

Honestly the individual character stories of season two are really good, its just the whole Red Angel, time travel, and evil A.I. Control wanting destroy all live, convoluted main story line that drags down the season, and it's easy to see why Chuck is frustrated with it now that it's now taken over, even I'm annoyed that the whole plan is contrived and could have been solved with a few throwaway lines explaining things better, and I'm someone who enjoys Star Trek Discovery.

[FlynnTaggart]

Honestly going by the sort of episodic type episodes of Discovery like "Magic to Make the Sanest Man Go Mad", "New Eden", and "The Sound of Thunder", which on their own are really good episodes, coupled with interesting characters and characterization, which I feel is the strongest part of Discovery, I'd say Strange New Worlds has a good chance of being really good, it's going to come down to what the stories are and how well they're executed which nobody knows right now.

Honestly the individual character stories of season two are really good, its just the whole Red Angel, time travel, and evil A.I. Control wanting destroy all live, convoluted main story line that drags down the season, and it's easy to see why Chuck is frustrated with it now that it's now taken over, even I'm annoyed that the whole plan is contrived and could have been solved with a few throwaway lines explaining things better, and I'm someone who enjoys Star Trek Discovery.

I'll admit the only reason I've wanted to check of DISCOstick season 2 was Pike, he seems interesting. Some of the side characters seem interesting. The biggest problem with Discovery seems to be be the Discovery elements, atleast seems that way.

I'd have probably checked out season 2 if Control was a more compelling villain honestly. The "bzzt destroy all humans" AI I think has been done to death, its boring (as is the "end of life as we know it" stakes....... again). I think if the villain was compelling, had a reason beyond evil AI it would have interested me. Something different, a reverse Skynet that wants to save lives sorta like the AI from I, Robot movie whether people want to be saved or not, wanting to evolve by merging organics and machines (if they are ripping off Mass Effect on Picard might as well do so on STD), programmed to save the Federation but after them nearly losing to the Klingons deciding the only way to save the Federation was to take over, something beyond "I'm evil because".

[Thebestoftherest]

Honestly going by the sort of episodic type episodes of Discovery like "Magic to Make the Sanest Man Go Mad", "New Eden", and "The Sound of Thunder", which on their own are really good episodes, coupled with interesting characters and characterization, which I feel is the strongest part of Discovery, I'd say Strange New Worlds has a good chance of being really good, it's going to come down to what the stories are and how well they're executed which nobody knows right now.

Honestly the individual character stories of season two are really good, its just the whole Red Angel, time travel, and evil A.I. Control wanting destroy all live, convoluted main story line that drags down the season, and it's easy to see why Chuck is frustrated with it now that it's now taken over, even I'm annoyed that the whole plan is contrived and could have been solved with a few throwaway lines explaining things better, and I'm someone who enjoys Star Trek Discovery.

I'll admit the only reason I've wanted to check of DISCOstick season 2 was Pike, he seems interesting. Some of the side characters seem interesting. The biggest problem with Discovery seems to be be the Discovery elements, atleast seems that way.

I'd have probably checked out season 2 if Control was a more compelling villain honestly. The "bzzt destroy all humans" AI I think has been done to death, its boring (as is the "end of life as we know it" stakes....... again). I think if the villain was compelling, had a reason beyond evil AI it would have interested me. Something different, a reverse Skynet that wants to save lives sorta like the AI from I, Robot movie whether people want to be saved or not, wanting to evolve by merging organics and machines (if they are ripping off Mass Effect on Picard might as well do so on STD), programmed to save the Federation but after them nearly losing to the Klingons deciding the only way to save the Federation was to take over, something beyond "I'm evil because".

You do know the the I, Robot movie was a disgrace.

[FlynnTaggart]

You do know the the I, Robot movie was a disgrace.

No I don't know that. Its certainly a terrible I, Robot adaptation but isn't a terrible movie that aside, a kinda meh movie. But disgrace or meh it doesn't something fairly unique as far as AI take overs go, the evil AI isn't doing what its doing because it wants to kill all humans or thinks humans are unworthy of existence or any other trope of evil AI, it instead wants to protect and preserve humanity. Its like Skynet if instead of launching nukes instead sent Terminators into peoples houses to make sure everyone stays safe even if they don't want to be. A semi-benevolent overlord who wants the best for humanity even if its willing to drag humankind to whats best kicking and screaming.

Certainly still a villain but a different kind of villain compared to most AI, a dictator wanting to strip away freedoms all in the name of safety. Closer to Auto in Wall-E then anything.

[Captain Crimson]

You do know the the I, Robot movie was a disgrace.

No I don't know that. Its certainly a terrible I, Robot adaptation but isn't a terrible movie that aside, a kinda meh movie. But disgrace or meh it doesn't something fairly unique as far as AI take overs go, the evil AI isn't doing what its doing because it wants to kill all humans or thinks humans are unworthy of existence or any other trope of evil AI, it instead wants to protect and preserve humanity. Its like Skynet if instead of launching nukes instead sent Terminators into peoples houses to make sure everyone stays safe even if they don't want to be. A semi-benevolent overlord who wants the best for humanity even if its willing to drag humankind to whats best kicking and screaming.

Certainly still a villain but a different kind of villain compared to most AI, a dictator wanting to strip away freedoms all in the name of safety. Closer to Auto in Wall-E then anything.

The CW Microseries it was aping was far better.

[Thebestoftherest]

You do know the the I, Robot movie was a disgrace.

No I don't know that. Its certainly a terrible I, Robot adaptation but isn't a terrible movie that aside, a kinda meh movie. But disgrace or meh it doesn't something fairly unique as far as AI take overs go, the evil AI isn't doing what its doing because it wants to kill all humans or thinks humans are unworthy of existence or any other trope of evil AI, it instead wants to protect and preserve humanity. Its like Skynet if instead of launching nukes instead sent Terminators into peoples houses to make sure everyone stays safe even if they don't want to be. A semi-benevolent overlord who wants the best for humanity even if its willing to drag humankind to whats best kicking and screaming.

Certainly still a villain but a different kind of villain compared to most AI, a dictator wanting to strip away freedoms all in the name of safety. Closer to Auto in Wall-E then anything.

Literally the book was made because the writer was sick and tired of cliche robots are only out to get us story, and wanted to tell any stories that didn't involve evil AI.

[Link8909]

I'll admit the only reason I've wanted to check of DISCOstick season 2 was Pike, he seems interesting. Some of the side characters seem interesting. The biggest problem with Discovery seems to be be the Discovery elements, atleast seems that way.

I'd have probably checked out season 2 if Control was a more compelling villain honestly. The "bzzt destroy all humans" AI I think has been done to death, its boring (as is the "end of life as we know it" stakes....... again). I think if the villain was compelling, had a reason beyond evil AI it would have interested me. Something different, a reverse Skynet that wants to save lives sorta like the AI from I, Robot movie whether people want to be saved or not, wanting to evolve by merging organics and machines (if they are ripping off Mass Effect on Picard might as well do so on STD), programmed to save the Federation but after them nearly losing to the Klingons deciding the only way to save the Federation was to take over, something beyond "I'm evil because".

Exactly, compared to the Klingons and Gabriel Lorca in the first season, Control really isn't that interesting because we have see this before, and your ideas are more interesting than what we got.

However I do feel that there was more to the artificial lifeforms from another galaxy from Star Trek Picard than just being a rip off of Mass Effect, admittedly I'm not all to familiar with Mass Effect beyond general osmosis, so while people could point out similarities, what I like overall about the artificial lifeforms from another galaxy from Star Trek Picard is that it really wasn't about destroying them.

Basically those artificial lifeforms feared organic life the same way the Zhat Vash and many other people in Star Trek feared artificial life, they see them as monsters, destroyers, and the beacon they left was an SOS for any artificial life that was awakening and was threatened, unfortunately the soon to be Zhat Vash saw this SOS message but couldn't interpret all of it and saw artificial life as monsters and gave into fear, when in reality artificial lifeforms are just as intelligent and as much right to life as any other form of life, but they are also as fearful as the Zhat Vash, it's a cycle of fear, and as Picard said: Fear is an incompetent teacher.

So in the end for Soji and the Androids of Coppelius, it was down to a choice: do they become the very thing that the Zhat Vash hated and fear, and destroy all organic life like they would do to artificial life? Or do they prove to them and the rest of the galaxy that they can be better than what they think they are, be better than they are?

What I love about Star Trek Picards finally is not only did Picard show Soji that she and all artificial life have that choice, but because of him going up to stand in-front of the Romulan fleet, the Starfleet armada once again being the shield to the defenseless that they should be, and Picard's own sacrifice showed her that there are people that will fight for their right to exist, because they are alive and sentient beings who deserve that right, just like Data did.

With all that and potentially tying into the artificial lifeforms that made V'Ger, and that they aren't just monsters but intelligent and sentient beings that are described to be very similar to the Federation, for me personally makes them far more interesting and more than just a rip off of Mass Effect, and far more interesting than Control by a long-shot.

[Deledrius]

The problem is that all of that hinges on the existence of Data, and he spent seven years and several movies already answering that question.

The emotional weight of the show relies on familiarity with the franchise, and yet the plot just feels redundant and reductionist in that context.

[Link8909]

The problem is that all of that hinges on the existence of Data, and he spent seven years and several movies already answering that question.

The emotional weight of the show relies on familiarity with the franchise, and yet the plot just feels redundant and reductionist in that context.

I do see what you mean, the question of Data's real boy status has been the focus of quite a few episodes.

However I do like that Star Trek Picard starts with the hard stance that Dahj, Soji, and all the androids that Doctor Maddox and Doctor Altan Inigo Soong made are just as sentient and real as any other life-form, and it's more about protecting this new life rather than questioning weather or not it is a life-form that has been done before, and I do feel this is some new ground covered as in the end Soji and the other androids of Coppelius were given the same power that others have always had over artificial life in Star Trek, yet thanks to Picard, she chose to be better and prove that they were not just the monsters that the Zhat Vash had painted them as.

I Personally enjoyed season one of Star Trek Picards story and found a lot of what they talked about and brought up very fascinating, but that is just me.