Angels Take Manhattan (DW)

[Starbug]

Am I the only one who actually likes River Song? I would have been just fine with her as a regular companion, snarking over time and space with the Doctor. Would have been better than Clara by miles.

No, you're not the only one who likes her, but I think she works best in small doses, sometimes knowing more than the Doctor, sometimes less.

[Ghilz]

I'd have actually liked a River Song spin-off. I like her, and I think she works best when NOT around the Doctor too much, that way you don't get frustrated at her often overshadowing him. I think she'd have worked great to see her have adventures of her own.

[Durandal_1707]

^ Seconded. That would have been great.

[CareerKnight]

I think Moffat is spreading himself way too thin and should honestly drop one of the two things he's on. It would ultimately lead to a better show for both things really. Who and Sherlock alike.

Pretty sure Sherlock is over at this point. The last episode felt like a series finale and its getting harder and harder to shoot around the main actors other projects.

I haven't watched this episode yet so maybe it is explain but how is there still a paradox if Rory is sent back in at the end?

[Dînadan]

I haven't watched this episode yet so maybe it is explain but how is there still a paradox if Rory is sent back in at the end?

Because he wasn't sent back to the same point; basically the Angels were using that place as a farm and Rory dying screwed that up and killed most of the Angels. The one at the end was a straggler and just sent him back in the regular way rather than back to the farm.

[lsgreg]

Initially, I was a little disappointed Chuck didn't go into the background of Karen Gillan leaving the show. Then I went and read a few things about that and it went kinda like this:
She had dinner with Moffat and said she wanted to leave.
Moffat said okay, I have an idea how to write you out and explained it to her.
She said do it and it happened. Not really noteworthy.

[Durandal_1707]

Initially, I was a little disappointed Chuck didn't go into the background of Karen Gillan leaving the show. Then I went and read a few things about that and it went kinda like this:
She had dinner with Moffat and said she wanted to leave.
Moffat said okay, I have an idea how to write you out and explained it to her.
She said do it and it happened. Not really noteworthy.

Well, the way she was written out was pretty sympathetic and respectful to the character. It's when a character gets their brain fluid sucked out and spends an episode stumbling around going derp derp derp, then gets shot, and then finally gets left behind on a planet which then explodes, that you start wondering what the hell was going on behind the scenes.

[nebagram]

Initially, I was a little disappointed Chuck didn't go into the background of Karen Gillan leaving the show. Then I went and read a few things about that and it went kinda like this:
She had dinner with Moffat and said she wanted to leave.
Moffat said okay, I have an idea how to write you out and explained it to her.
She said do it and it happened. Not really noteworthy.

Well, the way she was written out was pretty sympathetic and respectful to the character. It's when a character gets their brain fluid sucked out and spends an episode stumbling around going derp derp derp, then gets shot, and then finally gets left behind on a planet which then explodes, that you start wondering what the hell was going on behind the scenes.

Especially when said character was easily the best thing about said show.

[RobbyB1982]

Some of the ideas of the episode were fine, but it was a little too tied up in Moffatt's personal points and reaally relied on certain conceits to really gel.
-once you know history you're a part of that history and thats a fixed timeline... and this includes books written by a trusted source.
-even the Doctor doesn't muck with fixed points because that blows up the universe, as seen with the entire "11 must get shot on the beach and die" thing.
-angels can inhabit anything that shows them

(So it's not that the statue of liberty was always an angel, its that they put a lot of power int he area and then came to inhabit it. And its a cool idea, but having it silently stomp through town to get to the hotel was too much. It would have worked better had they actually gotten out to Liberty Island rather than a hotel, but...)

The main problem is the series (and others) has for so long found loopholes around things, fans instantly went "Well they just saw a tombstone with a name on it, that doesn't mean they had to actually die then or that there was actually a body there. There's plenty of workarounds." which was due to not nailing the emotional component of "Amy wants to live her life with Rory" and instead focused on "Sudden Jump scare with no dramatic build up after the first resolution" followed by "Time paradox that they can't get around by just driving for two hours to be picked up."

Of course, when the time came for Clara to finally leave, they DID do the workaround of "yes, she dies when she dies but there's a cheat in the middle" and everyone was bothered by that too.

Can the next companion just get either an actual happy ending, or just die a real death?

[Durandal_1707]

The only companion in the revived series who has gotten what you'd normally think of as a happy ending has been Martha. No, I don't get it either.