Dragon Age II: EA boogaloo

[Zoinksberg]

The end of episode 11 where he is begging everyone for a peaceful resolution and getting more exasperated while continuing to have to defend himself, I was expecting the "5 minutes later" caption.

However, I was hoping it would have returned with Feels Good by Tony Toni Tone playing and Chuck screaming "Yeah, come on! Get some!" as he mowed the last few down.

[AlucardNoir]

It's moments like the Dalish massacre we end up doing that makes me wonder about the mental state of the writers of DAII. How can those be the only choices? what is wrong with you people?

[Steve]

It's moments like the Dalish massacre we end up doing that makes me wonder about the mental state of the writers of DAII. How can those be the only choices? what is wrong with you people?

You can avoid that if you openly blame Merrill and make her feel like crap, IIRC.

[Fuzzy Necromancer]

It's moments like the Dalish massacre we end up doing that makes me wonder about the mental state of the writers of DAII. How can those be the only choices? what is wrong with you people?

You can avoid that if you openly blame Merrill and make her feel like crap, IIRC.

That is barely better than Genocide.

[Ikiry0]

God dammit Anders just...shut the fuck up Anders. Shut up. Can't we just...make you tranquil or something?

[Jonathan101]

Eh. I don't think Anders is saying anything Chuck doesn't to other characters. The only difference is who Anders is directing it at (and that Anders says it to peoples faces rather than over videos).

With regards to Merril, her ultimate problem isn't innocence or naivety- it is arrogance and loneliness. The fact that the demon in question was a Pride demon and had chosen her to be its vessel says it all- if she thinks that pure intentions can make anything work out, then she implicitly thinks that her own intentions are pure and that she can fix everything and that the REAL problem is that nobody believes in her...rather than simply her not being good enough.

And of course it comes from her never fitting in and nobody liking her. She's a bit like Naruto (random comparison but it holds up)- she wants to achieve something great in order to earn the respect and admiration of her people because they've always looked down on her. Except, she simply can't face the music that she isn't good enough, because thats the last thing she clings to.

Yeah, Anders goes about it in a dickish way...but frankly (speaking as a person educated on this subject), people like Merril really do need a degree of tough love (granted, maybe with more tact) and to learn humility, because showing excessive sympathy or pity after they screw up is playing into their insecurities and self-delusions - that they are not okay as they are and they need to do something about it (no matter how stupid) and be supported in doing so, rather than accepting that its okay to be flawed and not everybody has to like you for you to feel good about yourself.

[CharlesPhipps]

My Hawke basically read the crowd with the Daelish and being the lovable rogue that he was, basically said the truth: Merill fucked up and he was taking her away from this place to never trouble them again. Merill was shell shocked but I managed to get her home and away from it where I said, "You know, **** those ignoramuses. They were never going to accept you had the right of it. Let them think the Earth is still flat."

But, honestly, he was still lying because if Merill had gone through with her plan she would have been possessed by a Pride demon. Not because Merill was being careless, it's the fact Blood Magic is ALWAYS a trap. Because it comes from demons and was originally taught to humanity by Dumat. It's Schmuck Bait. Merill also ignored the fact no one wanted to hear any of her research due to the means it came from. Even if she fixed the Illuvian, everyone would assume it's a demon possessed monster device.

Anders is also right that Merill is playing with evil forces but he doesn't phrase it well because:

1. He hates elves (probably due to Velanna)
2. Merill is everything he envies as well as hates (a mage who grew up in freedom and a blood magician)

[AlucardNoir]

It's moments like the Dalish massacre we end up doing that makes me wonder about the mental state of the writers of DAII. How can those be the only choices? what is wrong with you people?

You can avoid that if you openly blame Merrill and make her feel like crap, IIRC.

Yeah, openly blame the innocent person for the stupidity of Keeper "I'm gonna become an Abomination so you don't even have the chance to be tempted", why didn't I think about that? That's not a good choice and in no way better then killing them all in self defense. We don't attack them, they attack us - and only do so if we tell them the truth. The only way we get to walk away is if we put the blame for Maretharis actions on Merrill, because Marethari was a stupid child and Merrill as her keeper was supposed to protect her from making idiotic decisions like becoming an abomination - oh wait.

I will not lie for Maretharis stupidity. Fuck, white lies are what got us in this situation to begin with. If Marethari hadn't lied to the Dalish about Merrill in the first place they wouldn't be so riled up that they'd attack us for literally saving them from an abomination.

Just put yourself in Hawk's place. You just killed a woman who has spent the past 6 years warning you your companion would become an abomination. You didn't kill her to protect your companion from her, you didn't kill her because she simply decided your companion had done enough. No, you killed her because she did exactly what she claimed your companion was going to do. And now here are her friends and your choices are to either tell them the truth, that their leader was a hypocrite that did exactly what she told them your companion would do and have them attack you or tell them their now dead leader was correct about your companion (despite having literally proof of the reverse) and assume responsibility for her actions - in which case they let you leave, despite having just killed their leader.

Do you really not see a problem with these choices and how one is literally not better then the other? If you were Hawk what would you choose? and indifferent of your choice, which of the three (but let's face it two) choices in game should start a fight? The one were you take responsibility for the presumed killer of their leader or the one were you try and explain why their keeper is dead, and they attack before you actually tell them she is dead? (IIRC)

Bad choices, bad choices all around.

[Winter]

Say what you will about Solas but at least he made a effort to be nice to people and admitted when he was wrong and when you called him out on his more questionable behavior he would admit fault and try to change. Also Anders talks a big talk about how he wishes to help Mages but for the most part all he does is bitch and moan about how badly their treated and only "helps" them at the very end of the game while Solas is actively trying to help the elves throughout the game while also trying to make up for his mistakes.

Solas is pretty much Anders in DA2 done right, he's overall really likable, complex and rather nuanced as a villain, I would go as far to say that Solas is the best overall villain in the BioWare canon and a good example of how to write a anti-villain. Anders on the other hand works well on paper as you do see where he's coming from and you get why he's doing all this but that all falls apart the moment you start talking to him because all he does is moan about how hard mages have and is rude to anyone and everyone who do not agree with him 100%. And even if you do agree with him 100% he is still impossible to deal with.

Also, Anders represents how unimportant you and you choices are as he will, spoilers, always blow the Chantry to Hell even if you have kicked him off your team at this point he will always be there to make the situation worse. In contrast, Solas shows, at least in Trespasser, how your choices not only matter but have the potential to change the world as if you have a high enough friendship points with him and you say that you will prove to him that he doesn't need to destroy the world he says how would treasure the chance to be proven wrong once again just like you proved him wrong before.

[CharlesPhipps]

I would absolutely choose lying because, again, I wouldn't handle the issue like a paladin but a rogue. I understand that the truth is not going to be the best thing when a beloved political leader is killed trying to save her daughter from a threat--real or imagined.

As for Solas vs. Anders?

I disagree. Anders is passionate about his cause and only goes to terrorism because things go completely to hell. Solas starts and ends at the same place he is in his story arc. He's a static character. He's also very much "for" elves but considers Daelish and City Elves both pathetic.