SW The Old Republic: Sith Warrior

[Steve]

The other problem is BW clearly wants to make the Sith Empire as nuanced as possible while they just kinda phone it in on the Republic.

I could go on at length about this. Don't get me started about the characterization and use of Suresh.

Its basically a Naive Idealism that works on Absolutes, Republic and Jedi have failings sure... but for some odd reason those failings are unforgivable due to the idea that the Republic and Jedi being the good guys should live up to the ideals 'Which I'm pretty sure 90% of people who throw that accusation don't even live up to their own damn standards while the Sith get a pass cause Their Ideals are about being depraved, you can't fault them for following their base lust.

I think there's a natural, visceral dislike of the idea of hypocrisy, so it makes the avowed good guys failing to live up to their goodness more viscerally upsetting that the avowed bad guys happily wallowing in their bad behavior.

There's a saying. "Hypocrisy is the tribute that vice pays to virtue". It's an important one to consider, I think: it doesn't excuse the act, but it points out that there are still virtues, and failing to live up to them doesn't make them false or lies or wrong.

[Wargriffin]

I think there's a natural, visceral dislike of the idea of hypocrisy, so it makes the avowed good guys failing to live up to their goodness more viscerally upsetting that the avowed bad guys happily wallowing in their bad behavior.

There's a saying. "Hypocrisy is the tribute that vice pays to virtue". It's an important one to consider, I think: it doesn't excuse the act, but it points out that there are still virtues, and failing to live up to them doesn't make them false or lies or wrong.

but there is a difference between striving for but missing the mark and outright Hypocrisy 'which would be those espousing nonsense principles they themselves don't follow

There is no distinction between the two... or if there is More effort is given to make the Sith look Flawed in their philosophy

Its a mix of dislike of Hypocrisy and the instilled modern Fear of Failure, seeing Failure as the sign of absolute defeat

The hilarious nature of those absolutes is things like Redemption and Forgiveness can't exist or be accepted

[Steve]

I suppose the distinction could be called dishonest hypocrisy versus honest hypocrisy. The former is that "Declare principles you don't follow yourself and insist others follow them", the latter is "Declare principles you've sometimes failed to live up to". People don't bother trying to differentiate between the two since we demand purity of intent and purpose, and any impurities is a sign of corruption making one unworthy.

Redemption is only permitted to be accepted if done at great cost to "pay" for your mistakes, and even then people grumble about it being undeserved unless the purportedly redeemed never ever ever hints at their old ways coming out again.

[SabreMau]

"Ah, Quentin Tarantino's filming this scene. Someone dies and he thinks we should shoot a close-up of some feet."

"So I go to make sure that the prisoner is delivered smoothly, and it's a good thing, because these guys figure that they're in the middle of Kaas City, nothing bad can happen to us!

You have no idea who you work for, do you?"

TuMarr: "If you don't flee, this be like killing two stone with one bird!"
Lanklyn: "I'm such a fool!"
Chuck: "Not compared to our current company, you're not."

[TheStarWarsTrek]

The issue when you get right down to it is IMO authors in the Star Wars EU have struggled with depicting nuanced morality. On one end of the spectrum, you have mustache twirling, kitten eating adversaries that make you wonder why anyone would ever sign up for the obviously evil bad guys. On the other end, in an attempt to combat the former and add a bit more nuance, I find SW writers often overdue it, adding more and more flaws to the Good Guys and more and virtues to the Bad Guys, to the point where they seem like equally valid positions.

[Mecha82]

That is issue when you have lot of authors with they own vision that no one watches over to make sure that stories stay consistent and with it characterization.

[Yukaphile]

On the other hand, Legends was exploding with originality. Not so in the modern EU. Though what Mecha82 said applies to any sci-fi verse. Hell, that probably applies to Discovery.

[Karha of Honor]

I find SW writers often overdue it, adding more and more flaws to the Good Guys and more and virtues to the Bad Guys, to the point where they seem like equally valid positions.

In which EU products?

[Wargriffin]

I find SW writers often overdue it, adding more and more flaws to the Good Guys and more and virtues to the Bad Guys, to the point where they seem like equally valid positions.

In which EU products?

Its Mostly just BW, since they pretty much have the most prolific games

I mean a large chunk of the whole "The Dark side's not THAT dangerous" came about due to video games trying to explain why your Good character can use darkside powers

[Mecha82]

On the other hand, Legends was exploding with originality. Not so in the modern EU. Though what Mecha82 said applies to any sci-fi verse. Hell, that probably applies to Discovery.

Sure it does apply to lot of work of fiction and not just SW Legends material. Maybe I should had mentioned that originally but what is done is done.