DS9 "The Reckoning"

[Tonesthegeek]

I've said it before and I'll say it again, Winn is a real Bitch. I'll also say again that they really should have killed off Dukat and let her take the primary villain role. This episode could have been one of the early points where her resentment would push her towards the Pa Wraiths maybe Jake when possessed could have acknowledged her instead of Kira, as she is so desperate for recognition that she'd take it from anyone willing to provide it. Add a couple more instances of that followed by the Pa Wraiths directly communicating with her and we've got a full turn to the dark side for Winn. Now if you wanted to be generous and give Marc Alamo a cameo or two, a Pa Wraith can appear to her in his form, maybe as a test to see if she's willing to trust someone she hates, though It assuming the form of Sisko would be interesting too. I could easily see Winn doing much of the same things Dukat did, including murdering Dax and starting her own cult, perhaps finally falling from grace and that pushes her over the edge to release the Pa Wraiths from the fire caves.

[Durandal_1707]

I already gave my thoughts about this episode in the other thread, so instead, I'll just submit this:

POSSESSED KIRA: "I Await the Custom 'Moji "

SISKO: "Dax, can you flood the entire station except for this one section right here with a lethal dose of wibbly-wobbly-timey-wimey particles?"

DAX: "On it!"

CUSTOM MOJI : "I'm melting! Mellllltttinnnnnnngggggggg"

AUDIENCE: "Hooray, now we don't have to go through any more of this bullshit!"

[Archanubis]

I gotta say, I do like Chuck's way of saying, "Put your head between your legs and kiss your ass goodbye." Took me a minute to get it, too.

[Yukaphile]

Okay, just watched. Lemme unload my thoughts.

I agree with the OP. It would have been great to have Dukat die, and then have him cameo as a Pah-wraith. Or at least have him embrace his revelation in "Waltz" that he hates the Bajorans and wants to kill them all, because after that he just seems the same, still wanting validation for the Occupation, only far less subtle, with the "evilness" now being shoved down our throats, when... but... he shouldn't care! Hell, I'd see him as a man who now blames the Federation for why his daughter is dead. And there's a hint of that in his speech with Damar. Why not embrace that? Answer is obvious. People were already sympathizing with Dukat. The creators really wanted people to hate him as much as they did, so they went to full-blown character assassination.

I want Chewbacca to be our Emissary from God!

I think Chuck's comments on Kai Winn vs. Kira are on the mark, and I'd never really thought about it that way, Kira being the best of envy in service, and Winn being the worst of envy with pride. Or hell, that Jake's resentment made him an easy target. He has no reason to love the Prophets after the previous year when his father almost died. Good catch, Chuck!

Kosst Amojan would be a really cool name for an anime, admittedly.

I do disagree with Chuck that they'd turn into a pure good vs. pure evil fight, and would never hurt an innocent. Refer to Sarah Sisko, again.

[drewder]

Was this the first time kai Winn admitted that the prophets had never spoken to her? I'm pretty sure that became a plot point so her character could do a heal turn on the prophets.

[Archanubis]

Was this the first time kai Winn admitted that the prophets had never spoken to her? I'm pretty sure that became a plot point so her character could do a heal turn on the prophets.

I think this is the first episode they reveal that the Prophets have never spoken to her. They do have her in the "Circle" trilogy mention she does commune with the Orb(s), but it never said she ever had a vision during such session.

[Yukaphile]

Well, in the final arc, she looks into the orbs, and they reject her, so that seems to be something of a retcon.

[Fianna]

In the screenshot Chuck used . . . does anyone else think it looks like the Prophet and Pah-Wraith are shooting those energy beams out of their crotches?

[Yukaphile]

OMG... is it like the Schwartz? It's as big as hers?

[clearspira]

Yeah, letting Dukat live was a huge mistake because his arc had come to an end on that planet with Sisko. It was a good send off. Dukat as a wizard with spells and a cult took the complicated villain we had and turned him into a comic book.

And speaking of wizards, I personally liken Kai Winn to Professor Umbridge. Not as evil as some, but still a real scummy piece of work that hides behind the establishment, is a racist, and is jealous of the main protagonist.