Sfdebris.net

In Chuck's B5 reviews, he had wondered why there was a warrior caste if the Minbari had an "ape shall not kill ape" system set up, but from my viewing of B5, it seems that Valen aka Sinclair had been the one to set up their current system, the Grey Council, equal balance, and instituted said law of "ape shall not kill ape." Since prior to that, there was lots of caste wars. Hope this helps, Chuck!

There were also no castes in Minbari society before Valen decreed it.

Also castes are designated at birth almost always, if you're born to 2 Warrior Caste parents you will be Warrior Caste no matter if your profession is teacher, doctor or etc.

The exception are Minbari who chose to change their caste because they are really drawn to the iconic professions of another caste, so a Worker Caste might really really want to be a priest and thus will change casts.

Yukaphile wrote: ↑Tue Jan 15, 2019 4:08 pm In Chuck's B5 reviews, he had wondered why there was a warrior caste if the Minbari had an "ape shall not kill ape" system set up, but from my viewing of B5, it seems that Valen aka Sinclair had been the one to set up their current system, the Grey Council, equal balance, and instituted said law of "ape shall not kill ape." Since prior to that, there was lots of caste wars. Hope this helps, Chuck!

What episode in what series was this decided? Seems like a retcon to explain this obvious problem to me.

I can't recall exactly, it was somewhere in Season 3, I'd have to go check through the transcripts again.

Remember that B5 also has canon comic books and novels due to JMS writing them or providing outlines for other authors. The DC B5 comics, for instance, are canon, as are the Del Rey trilogies (Psi Corps trilogy by J. Gregory Keyes, Centauri trilogy by Peter David, and Technomage trilogy by Jeanne Cavelos). Cavelos' novel The Shadow Within is also canon IIRC, as is the novel To Dream In The City of Sorrows by JMS' then-wife Kathryn Drennan (the writer who wrote the episode "By Any Means Necessary", one of Season 1's best), That last novel actually provides confirmation of some of what Valen did for Minbari culture. He gave the Worker Caste an equal voice on thee Gray Council, he allowed them into the Rangers in defiance of Warrior Caste opposition, etc. And the book's title refers to Tuzanor's nickname, which is drawn from a pre-Valen war between Minbari waged nearby that caused so much death that Tuzanor was called "The City of Sorrows", and that to dream in the City of Sorrows was to dream of a better future.

Likewise, in the episode when Delenn was crowned Ranger the One, Marcus challenged the Warrior duel to the death. So the rule Ape shalt not kill Ape has sub-clauses too.

Maybe Warriors defend the Realm from external enemies.

Artabax wrote: ↑Thu Jan 17, 2019 11:47 pm Likewise, in the episode when Delenn was crowned Ranger the One, Marcus challenged the Warrior duel to the death. So the rule Ape shalt not kill Ape has sub-clauses too.

Maybe Warriors defend the Realm from external enemies.

"To Dream In The City of Sorrows" reveals the loophole in a conversation between Sinclair and Marcus: when you invoke the duel to the death, you take responsibility for your death if you are defeated. Therefore the other warrior did not kill you, and the rule is not broken.

So the rule Ape shalt not kill Ape is True

from a certain point of view

Sounds like the usual "rituals, dueling, etc." aren't murder so they're A-OK!

Still seems weird that war wouldn't fit under that umbrella of acceptable death.