Was the Star Wars Disney Sequel Trilogy Concepts Well Executed?

[Winter]

The most notable argument when it comes to the Prequel Trilogy vs. the Disney Sequel Trilogy is that one had good concepts but executed very poorly while the other had weak concepts but executed very competently, is that accurate? If you had asked me that back in 2017 I very likely would have said yes but between The Last Jedi and Rise of Skywalker I started to watch a show that, with it's 4th and 5th seasons had basically the same plot, character arcs and overall concepts and that show was She-Ra and the Princesses of Power.

To sum up with SRS4 and The Last Jedi both have someone taking over a rebellion after the previous leader is taken out of commission, both leaders handling of said job is questioned by a high-ranking and respected solider of said rebellion who is seen as a hero to many but who's last notable mission led to a major loss for the rebels. Both the rebel leader and the hero but heads over how to handle the war and eventually the leader orders the hero to do as they are told and the hero goes F that and goes on a mission to get someone's help but said mission is ultimately a failure.

There's also a story where the hero is having issues with their mentor who is keeping secrets from them and someone they thought was an enemy/crazy person might not be as bad as they thought. In the end the hero takes the side of the one they were told to distrust and turns against their mentor and this ultimately ends in a betrayal where the hero must fight someone who has betrayed them and said fight ends in the destruction of a sword that was important to everyone involved in this affair.

There's also a conflict brewing within the villain faction as the Dragon basically takes over the evil empire after turning on their master. As things go on the villains seem to be winning but in the end both sides are brought to the brink of destruction which is more of a result of infighting on both sides rather then the conflict between Empire and Rebellion.

There's also a number of little things like how a thug for hire works for one side but turns on their employer after being captured and hired by the opposing side. The fact that we focus more on the infighting rather then the over arching war, how the dragon of the villains is the one responsible for a major lose of a parent figure, the hero's mysterious past not being what she thought it was and how a hero dies not in a blaze of glory taking down a thousand enemies but quietly, in the dark, where no one would see (and communicating with another major character via illusion).

To save myself time here's CBR's take on why SRS5 is ROS but better.

https://www.cbr.com/she-ras-finale-is-t ... ne-better/

And yet, despite both sharing the same overall story, She-Ra is LOVED by critics and casual viewers alike while TDST is mixed with some loving it while others... aren't as nice.

She-Ra is why I argue that TDST does NOT have well executed concepts. In fact I'd argue that the concepts of TPT were better executed then the concepts of TDST because She-Ra had similar concepts and executed BEAUTIFULLY with characters that are as engaging and as memorable as in the Original Trilogy of Star Wars.

I think that TDST was just better directed then TPT with solid camera work, the actors were clearly all given solid direction and the action scenes were all well done. As much as I enjoy TPT and like Lucas himself I do think the films would have been better received if had someone else direct and clean up the script. But in terms of which was better executed, as weak as the directing was I think TPT did it better as most seem to agree that the concepts where good while the argument for this whole thing is that the concepts in TDST weren't as good even though, again, I think they are just as engaging as TPT.

But TDST was more interested in a Nostalgia trip that just copy and pasted the plot and character arcs of TOT rather then building on their own ideas that, again, were good in their own right. Adora and Finn are both former minion of evil turned Rebel Hero who have a connection to a great power source but Adora is regarded as a great character in her own right while Finn is remembered for his wasted potential and yelling "REEEEEYYYYY!!!" a lot. Adora and Rey have a mysterious past and are both revealed to be someone of no importance AND have a connection to a former evil Empire but, again, Adora is noted for her wonderful character that is driven by her trying to overcome her personal demons while Rey is regarded by many as a boring Mary Sue who never fails at anything and has no real depth or development to speak of.

Recently I posted 2 questions on this site asking if Cloud Strife was Transgender and if Yennefer's character arc in Netflix's Witcher series was an allegory for people who are trans. The fact that these two characters who, as far as the creators themselves have said, aren't trans or intended to be seen as trans are seen by people who are trans as characters they can relate to speaks volumes as to how well written and developed they are.

Finale Fantasy 7, Witcher and She-Ra are all series that had characters, plot and concepts that were well executed and have all stood the test of time and are STILL having their stories told, retold or have people begging for more. TDST has largely been ignored by many as an okay series noted more for it's wasted potential then anything else.

[McAvoy]

The sequel trilogy was not well executed. It's whatever the opposite of that is.

At its base, the three movies are not connected at all, it's all over the place. Rian Johnson made sure of that when he was handed a blank check to do a Star Wars movie the how he wanted it, script and all. Abrams then was sent in to make a movie that follows it but fixes the issues the vocal fans hated.

[TGLS]

I think if Johnson made the first or last movie the trilogy would have worked excellently. If there actually was a plan for all three movies and not a mystery box it could have worked too.

[McAvoy]

I think if Johnson made the first or last movie the trilogy would have worked excellently. If there actually was a plan for all three movies and not a mystery box it could have worked too.

Probably. I do think he is a good enough director to do a good job in making Star Wars movies as long as he has some sort of oversight to stick to the overall plan. Or he can create a whole new story arc with new characters of his own creation.

The latter would work the best since it woukd be his own characters. He did butcher Luke for the sake of subverting expectations. The whole Holdo thing though on the other hand wasn't done well at all. I know what he was trying to convey but the execution was just bad.

[Winter]

I think if Johnson made the first or last movie the trilogy would have worked excellently. If there actually was a plan for all three movies and not a mystery box it could have worked too.

Hm, maybe I've made it no secret that I'm not overly found of TLJ and the only other films I've seen from Johnson is Looper and Knives Out, the former I found to be just okay and the latter was really good though not my cup of tea. One thing I've noticed in Johnson's films is that he tends to make the cast full of unlikable idiots.

To go back to She-Ra's forth season everyone there makes mistakes and most of the problems on both sides are the result of infighting and watching Adora and Glimmer's friendship fall apart feels real and IMMENSELY uncomfortable. And yet, no one is incompetent, hardly anyone does something seriously stupid and the few that do it makes sense given the context of the situation with both the war and the conflicts within both groups.

With TLJ everyone does something stupid that seems to be designed to make them as stupid as possible. Parking out in the open where anyone could spot their ship, trusting a known mass murderer (who admits to killing for petty reasons) solely on his word, keeping loyal soldiers in the dark for no apparent reason other then to be a jerk, going behind said superior officers back and go forward with a dumb plan that nearly gets everyone killed.

Catra's insecurities resulted in her pushing everyone away even if they were completely loyal to the Horde and her which ultimately cost her the war and her will to live. That works because we know just how F#cked up Catra is thanks to how awful her childhood was, Kylo is just an idiot who screams and throws tantrums whenever things don't go his way which is what happens at the end of TLJ.

[TGLS]

I dunno. The main problem I see with the sequel trilogy is that it's three movies that don't connect. If there was the same amount of blowback to a hypothetical Rian Wars VII, then whoever took over for VIII and IX would at least be able to slowly move back to where fans wanted, instead of "Quick! Clear the table to make the fans happy then end it!". Rian Wars IX would have the advantage of at least being conclusive.

[Captain Crimson]

I mean, given what they did, they should have made reading of LOTJ, DE, and JP mandatory on set.

That alone could have given them the direction they needed with how the story ultimately came out.

[McAvoy]

I dunno. The main problem I see with the sequel trilogy is that it's three movies that don't connect. If there was the same amount of blowback to a hypothetical Rian Wars VII, then whoever took over for VIII and IX would at least be able to slowly move back to where fans wanted, instead of "Quick! Clear the table to make the fans happy then end it!". Rian Wars IX would have the advantage of at least being conclusive.

The sequel trilogy really comes down to allowing Rian free reign to create anything he wanted for Episode 8. If someone at Lucasfilm or Disney just oversaw the sequel trilogy according to some pre approved plan, or at least oversaw Rian's movie to make sure it is connected to Episode 7 and allows for a clear flow into 9, it would have fixed the main problems.

But no, Rian basically did what he wanted.

[phantom000]

Given what I saw in TFA i'm not sure the sequel trilogy had any concepts....

[Draco Dracul]

The primary weakness of the Sequel Trilogy is the lack of a strong concept. The best entry in the trilogy, The Last Jedi, at least tries to create a thesis statement for the trilogy (the relationship between past and future) by trying to give meaning to decisions made in TFA that were mostly done because they looked cool in the moment.