Nealithi wrote: ↑Thu Sep 30, 2021 3:28 pm
Sort of? Into Darkness they tried to do Wrath of Khan but had not met Khan before. But one thing that came up was Scotty pointing out a few times that Starfleet is. not. military. It was a bit heavy handed on that.
in ST Beyond you had a soldier, a man who learned to fight and bleed and if needed die for his cause. Soldiers have a very tight camaraderie with their fellows. Doing anything for one another and leave no one behind. So the Federation is founded, his entire corps is disbanded. Then he goes on a mission and his ship crashes. As far as he can see, he was abandoned. The weak civilians in his mind didn't even try. So every man and woman he was responsible for that died. Died because the Federation forgot that bond forged in combat. And all of them were left behind. He did terrible things so he and his two remaining officers survived, and had to justify it in his own way. I think he was wrong and his view twisted. But as Spock once said. "I did not say I agree. Merely that I understand." (God there was some good advice buried in TOS)
The main point of the matter in my mind is that this movie just explains all that in a passing exposition of the villain's backstory. Does it have anything to do with what's talked about in Beyond?
Good point with Scotty in Into Darkness though, really, I hadn't thought about that. Though, I'm not sure it really makes the villain's point in Beyond much more salient as far as a narrative element for the whole movie though.
Nealithi wrote: ↑Thu Sep 30, 2021 3:28 pm
Sort of? Into Darkness they tried to do Wrath of Khan but had not met Khan before. But one thing that came up was Scotty pointing out a few times that Starfleet is. not. military. It was a bit heavy handed on that.
in ST Beyond you had a soldier, a man who learned to fight and bleed and if needed die for his cause. Soldiers have a very tight camaraderie with their fellows. Doing anything for one another and leave no one behind. So the Federation is founded, his entire corps is disbanded. Then he goes on a mission and his ship crashes. As far as he can see, he was abandoned. The weak civilians in his mind didn't even try. So every man and woman he was responsible for that died. Died because the Federation forgot that bond forged in combat. And all of them were left behind. He did terrible things so he and his two remaining officers survived, and had to justify it in his own way. I think he was wrong and his view twisted. But as Spock once said. "I did not say I agree. Merely that I understand." (God there was some good advice buried in TOS)
The main point of the matter in my mind is that this movie just explains all that in a passing exposition of the villain's backstory. Does it have anything to do with what's talked about in Beyond?
Good point with Scotty in Into Darkness though, really, I hadn't thought about that. Though, I'm not sure it really makes the villain's point in Beyond much more salient as far as a narrative element for the whole movie though.
The Into Darkness connection was weak other than how it was pointed out. The disbanding of Macos was again referenced as Starfleet is not military. The antagonist's full reasoning they did spend less time on it than they did not Kirk looking at his closet I will fully agree. But it was there.
Edit: Nevermind, it seems you're watching things in a very unusual order, skipping around to post-everything and then back. Interesting strategy! I'm curious how it will work out.
Deledrius wrote: ↑Sun Oct 10, 2021 11:23 pm
You've gone backwards to TNG now? I'm confused.
Edit: Nevermind, it seems you're watching things in a very unusual order, skipping around to post-everything and then back. Interesting strategy! I'm curious how it will work out.
BridgeConsoleMasher wrote: ↑Thu Sep 30, 2021 2:48 am
So I rowed to 88 minutes of Beyond before finishing the movie while I rested.
Nice to have noticed them talking about Commodore Paris and the fact that the villain fought in the Xindi wars.
However, if I had to remark about something, I'd say that they didn't really build up any theme of militarization gray areas, and it just happened to be a backdrop of the guy. Does this follow through from Into Darkness or something? It seems very random.
Sort of? Into Darkness they tried to do Wrath of Khan but had not met Khan before. But one thing that came up was Scotty pointing out a few times that Starfleet is. not. military. It was a bit heavy handed on that.
Pegg had watched the Plinkett of the 1st movie, where he said the Sf was portrayed too much like a military aside from Pike calling it a "peace keeping armada" in one line - so maybe that was a reaction to the criticism lol
