I hear a Babylon 5 reboot is in the works

[Frustration]

The problem I have with this is that a lot of the appeal of the series is that this little gaggle of nobodies on a mostly diplomatic station turn out to be the Most Important People in the Most Important Time in history.

I don't agree. The interesting characters were what drew people in and kept them watching. The awesome epic storyline was just a bonus.

I mean, the introduction of Londo Mollari is a perfect example of a basic principle: make people laugh with a personable character, and that character will draw them into the world you're building. Wash playing with his dinosaurs in Firefly is an application of that lesson, combined with a promise about the quality of the stories that will be told.

One of the points of B5 was that it wasn't the individuals who were important. If they were killed, someone else would take over. It was the historical forces at work that created the 'destiny nexus', the individuals and their choices would determine how that cusp resolved. As awesome as the individual people were, they were *important* because the spotlight fell upon them; in other circumstances they would have lived out their lives, being awesome, but not redirecting the course of history.

[hammerofglass]

One of the points of B5 was that it wasn't the individuals who were important. If they were killed, someone else would take over. It was the historical forces at work that created the 'destiny nexus', the individuals and their choices would determine how that cusp resolved. As awesome as the individual people were, they were *important* because the spotlight fell upon them; in other circumstances they would have lived out their lives, being awesome, but not redirecting the course of history.

There's a whole segment in Deconstruction of Fallen Stars openly mocking the "historical forces" interpretation.

[clearspira]

One of the points of B5 was that it wasn't the individuals who were important. If they were killed, someone else would take over. It was the historical forces at work that created the 'destiny nexus', the individuals and their choices would determine how that cusp resolved. As awesome as the individual people were, they were *important* because the spotlight fell upon them; in other circumstances they would have lived out their lives, being awesome, but not redirecting the course of history.

There's a whole segment in Deconstruction of Fallen Stars openly mocking the "historical forces" interpretation.

Without Sheridan, the rebellion against President Clarke would have had no teeth and would have failed. Without Sinclair then there would be no Valen AKA one of the most important men in the history of the entire galaxy.

The idea that individuals are not important or that these are people that can be easily replaced is ridiculous. I guarantee you that 99% of men or women sent back in time in Sinclair's place would have died horribly.

[Frustration]

There's a whole segment in Deconstruction of Fallen Stars openly mocking the "historical forces" interpretation.

Yes, but those academics were arguing that the individual people didn't matter. They DID matter, because they decided how the cusp turned out, but the cusp itself was more than anyone could create or control. But the decisions were critical - those fools insisted that anything good that resulted was due to history, and anything bad was Sheridan's personal fault.

If John Sheridan had decided to take up the Shadows' offer, the entire history of the galaxy might have been different. But he wasn't born some kind of superman. His history shows that he had good judgment and wisdom beyond some of the people running Earthforce, but sadly there's nothing shocking about that. If he had died, someone else would have made decisions and become the "person of destiny" in his place.

[CharlesPhipps]

I mean, BABYLON FIVE is the Lord of the Rings + Star Trek.

Sheridan is Aragorn.

They may start as a backwater station but it becomes the most important thing ever. Even then, Sheridan is also the most famous war hero of Earth by the time he starts as commander there.

[Frustration]

Nope, Sheridan had nothing special about his early life. Aragorn's early life was nothing but prophesy and weirdness - he was literally born to fill his role.

He's more like Bilbo... except if you read all of Tolkien's writings, it becomes obvious that both Bilbo and Frodo were end products of a massive plan to create someone capable of carrying the Ring without betraying it to Sauron. Their entire society existed, ultimately, to produce them. Sheridan's just a smart guy.

[CharlesPhipps]

Nope, Sheridan had nothing special about his early life. Aragorn's early life was nothing but prophesy and weirdness - he was literally born to fill his role.

He's more like Bilbo... except if you read all of Tolkien's writings, it becomes obvious that both Bilbo and Frodo were end products of a massive plan to create someone capable of carrying the Ring without betraying it to Sauron. Their entire society existed, ultimately, to produce them. Sheridan's just a smart guy.

I mean Sheridan, before the events of the show, is still Starkiller the only human who ever achieved a victory against the Mimbari.

That's pretty fricking far from Bilbo.

[Nealithi]

Without Sheridan, the rebellion against President Clarke would have had no teeth and would have failed. Without Sinclair then there would be no Valen AKA one of the most important men in the history of the entire galaxy.

The idea that individuals are not important or that these are people that can be easily replaced is ridiculous. I guarantee you that 99% of men or women sent back in time in Sinclair's place would have died horribly.

Need some two cents here. First I think in show the Vorlons wanted to hammer home the 'you are replaceable'. Because to them this was just a cycle that kept continuing. There would always be some guiding figure for the stalemate.

Let me do a weight of history example. WW1 may or may not have needed to happen. From what I have heard. If Austria was either quicker to mobilize or backed down when their demands were 90% met. Then the wider war would not have happened. And history would be quite different.

WW2 was going to happen however. The events and treaties after WW1 left glass in wounds to fester and it was going to blow up eventually. So in a sense anyone could have replaced FDR, Stalin, and Hitler in the roles they had. But the war itself was going to happen.

So the last Shadow War in the B5 universe setup the pieces for the right man in the right place to do something that had not been done before. Break the cycle. I do not believe Ivanova in Sheridan's place would have done that. She would have had the cycle that the Vorlons and Shadows were used to. So a bit of column A and a bit of column B in the message.

[hammerofglass]

Even if you accept that who is in the role is interchangeable, they still have to be the right kind of person. Ivanova was not enough of a diplomat to build the coalition, just as Delenn was not enough of a soldier to lead them successfully. We saw things falling apart when they tried to fill in for Sheridan while he was dead; the alliance was already contemplating a suicidal attack on Za'ha'dum by the time he got back.

[Frustration]

I mean Sheridan, before the events of the show, is still Starkiller the only human who ever achieved a victory against the Mimbari.

That's pretty fricking far from Bilbo.

I'd consider the "Starkiller" incident to be the beginning of the difference, sort of like when Bilbo goes off with the dwarves. But you're not wrong.

I'm particularly thinking of the retrospective on Sheridan's life that points out his perfectly normal childhood, adolescence, and early adulthood. Nothing about him screamed "this is a man of destiny", as opposed to the stories about Julius Caesar, for example.