The Russian Invasion of Ukraine

[Draco Dracul]

It's weird seeing European far-right groups being pro-Ukraine when so many American ones are enthusiastic Putin supporters. That clip of AFPAC cheering the invasion when Feuntes managed to stop giggling about how much he loves Hitler for a moment comes to mind.

I mean I think there is a practical reason for that, the European far right, especially those in Former USSR and Warsaw Pact countries are at real risk of being next. The practical reality is that while they want thier own Putin to make thier own countries "strong" they know that Putin himself is Russian ethno nationalist and at best they'll be considered confused Russians and have thier culture destroyed and at worst they will be killed.

By contrast to the American far right Putin is purely an aspirational figure because they do not have to fear the direct consequences of his imperialism.

Which is full 180 from what Republicans used to be like. Russians bad mindset. Nowadays it's now China bad.

I mean a big part of that is that Russian has been an authoritarian right wing nation for 30 years where as China is essentially a social democracy where the democracy is limited to only about 10% of the population.

[BridgeConsoleMasher]

It's weird seeing European far-right groups being pro-Ukraine when so many American ones are enthusiastic Putin supporters. That clip of AFPAC cheering the invasion when Feuntes managed to stop giggling about how much he loves Hitler for a moment comes to mind.

I mean I think there is a practical reason for that, the European far right, especially those in Former USSR and Warsaw Pact countries are at real risk of being next. The practical reality is that while they want thier own Putin to make thier own countries "strong" they know that Putin himself is Russian ethno nationalist and at best they'll be considered confused Russians and have thier culture destroyed and at worst they will be killed.

By contrast to the American far right Putin is purely an aspirational figure because they do not have to fear the direct consequences of his imperialism.

Which is full 180 from what Republicans used to be like. Russians bad mindset. Nowadays it's now China bad.

I mean a big part of that is that Russian has been an authoritarian right wing nation for 30 years where as China is essentially a social democracy where the democracy is limited to only about 10% of the population.

Social Republic lol. Democracy would mean that it's not consorted to the 10%

[CharlesPhipps]

I think a one party state precludes even that use of the term democracy.

[BridgeConsoleMasher]

Yeah I'm not sure if you can call it a republic for that matter.

[Deledrius]

I think a one party state precludes even that use of the term democracy.

Agreed. It definitely functionally precludes it if nothing else.

[TGLS]

Yeah I'm not sure if you can call it a republic for that matter.

Well Xi Mingze isn't even in the public eye, much less in any position of power, so you can't really call it a monarchy.

[CharlesPhipps]

https://twitter.com/christogrozev/statu ... 7009267712

Putin is starting to list the Ukrainian's terms of surrender, which at least gives us a sense of what they want and the desire to leave the battle.

(1) Zelensky remains pro forma president but Russia appoints Boiko as PM,

(2) Ukraine recognizes L/DNR and Crimea,

(3) No NATO.

Ze told them emphatically no.

[Madner Kami]

Those are the same terms as before, except keeping Zelensky in a powerless figurehead-position. I see what they are trying to do there. Placating the Ukrainians. They're afraid of having to slog through this quagmire.

[Draco Dracul]

I think a one party state precludes even that use of the term democracy.

Yeah I'm not sure if you can call it a republic for that matter.

I mean that would disqualify the US from being a democracy or a republic because we have a single party, the neoliberal big business party. That it arranges it's into wings with distinct names does not changes that they have explicitly had the same goals for the last 30 years.

[CharlesPhipps]

I mean that would disqualify the US from being a democracy or a republic because we have a single party, the neoliberal big business party. That it arranges it's into wings with distinct names does not changes that they have explicitly had the same goals for the last 30 years.

I think comparisons like this are the reason why people don't ever have decent discussions of politics. Comparing the shared platforms of a democracy with, "It is actually a single oligarchy of an authoritarian government" just makes the entire discussion worthless.