Problem with Kids Media

[McAvoy]

What your doing wrong is your still talking. Your never ever going to fine a satisfactory answer, and at this point your going to annoy people.

*eye twitch*

*You,re, you're, you're and you're

[hammerofglass]

What your doing wrong is your still talking. Your never ever going to fine a satisfactory answer, and at this point your going to annoy people.

*eye twitch*

*You,re, you're, you're and you're

That misplaced comma is just exquisite.

[McAvoy]

What your doing wrong is your still talking. Your never ever going to fine a satisfactory answer, and at this point your going to annoy people.

*eye twitch*

*You,re, you're, you're and you're

That misplaced comma is just exquisite.

It was autocorrect on my phone. I caught it but left it to see if anyone got it.

[Dragon Ball Fan]

Back on topic. I wish one of these kids shows, MLP especially, would have a villain seemingly be reformed but later on, turn bad again and reveal he was pretending the whole time. "That's what you get for forgiving everyone, all the time."

And for non-villains who screw up big time, like Discord, I still cannot believe literally everyone in the entire universe, forgives them. There has to be SOME people in-universe who don't forgive them.

[Dragon Ball Fan]

The way I see it this is a toy commercial first, second and third. It's a well written toy commercial that has pretty enough graphics and a complex enough plot to be able to stand on it's own - and as such be exempt from the typical scrutiny of government regulatory bodies. BUT, it's still a toy commercial. To analyze this as if it were any other show is disingenuous. This isn't any other show, it was never intended as a stand alone show, it was always intended as a toy commercial and as such should be analysed at least partially from that perspective.

Think about it like this, the only reason this show is so much better then all the previous iterations of MLP cartoons is because Lauren Faust was three things, an accomplished writer, a good cartoonist and a fan of the original toys. But she never got the money she did to make the first season of this because any of that. She got that sweet, sweet Hasbro toy money because a Hasbro exec thought a new cartoon would help popularize their MLP toy line and new character designs were something they were already looking for. That's not to say the show doesn't at the very least have it's good parts, or it's strong episodes but at the end of the day, this show lives and dies not on how popular it is with girls 3 and up but on how well the toys it's based on are selling.

Since I doubt most people here, me included would describe themselves as bronies let me use a Transformers analogy. Beast Wars is wildly touted as one of the best if not the best Transformers animated series. The sole reason it exists is because Hasbro saw it could get away with a half an hour toy commercial in the 80's and since regular Transformers toy sales were in a slum sought to reenvision the toy line, the highly successful Beast wars cartoon series was just a marketing ploy for this new reenvisioned Transformers toy line. To ignore the merits of the show because it was a half hour toy commercial would be wrong. To ignore the fact that every episode is nothing more then 22 minutes of advertising you, me and and a lot of people would happily pay to watch is worse. In select cases like that of The Transformers: The movie we are fortunate enough to know exactly how much executive meddling there was with the plot. For most other series we have no idea. Under such conditions we need to be careful when interpreting a work of art and even more so when giving praise to the men and women responsible for it's existance.

Some story elements in some productions are like this, a total non sequitur that has no other meaning or function than marketing.

When we are talking about works such as MLP:FIM I think it's important we always remember that at the end of the day we are talking about a 22 minute toy commercial and that we can't take anything at face value when it comes to it's plot, characters or development. It may seam easy to point to the new forms the main six take at the end of the episode or to Twilight's new castle as corporate mandates but the show as a hole is a toy commercial. Everything, EVERYTHING in the show is designed to make little girls want to buy the MLP toys. There is no magical line in the sand where the commercial ends and the show begins. This isn't a legal drama where one of the lawyers just "happens" to order a Jack Daniels at the bar. Each individual episode of MLP: FIM is a toy commercial.

I know this is old but I have to respond to this.

You brought up Transformers, well, I also grew up with the Unicorn Trilogy and it shaped who I am, this and two other shows from my childhood, is what I based my entire moral character on. Can a mere commercial do that?

[Thebestoftherest]

The way I see it this is a toy commercial first, second and third. It's a well written toy commercial that has pretty enough graphics and a complex enough plot to be able to stand on it's own - and as such be exempt from the typical scrutiny of government regulatory bodies. BUT, it's still a toy commercial. To analyze this as if it were any other show is disingenuous. This isn't any other show, it was never intended as a stand alone show, it was always intended as a toy commercial and as such should be analysed at least partially from that perspective.

Think about it like this, the only reason this show is so much better then all the previous iterations of MLP cartoons is because Lauren Faust was three things, an accomplished writer, a good cartoonist and a fan of the original toys. But she never got the money she did to make the first season of this because any of that. She got that sweet, sweet Hasbro toy money because a Hasbro exec thought a new cartoon would help popularize their MLP toy line and new character designs were something they were already looking for. That's not to say the show doesn't at the very least have it's good parts, or it's strong episodes but at the end of the day, this show lives and dies not on how popular it is with girls 3 and up but on how well the toys it's based on are selling.

Since I doubt most people here, me included would describe themselves as bronies let me use a Transformers analogy. Beast Wars is wildly touted as one of the best if not the best Transformers animated series. The sole reason it exists is because Hasbro saw it could get away with a half an hour toy commercial in the 80's and since regular Transformers toy sales were in a slum sought to reenvision the toy line, the highly successful Beast wars cartoon series was just a marketing ploy for this new reenvisioned Transformers toy line. To ignore the merits of the show because it was a half hour toy commercial would be wrong. To ignore the fact that every episode is nothing more then 22 minutes of advertising you, me and and a lot of people would happily pay to watch is worse. In select cases like that of The Transformers: The movie we are fortunate enough to know exactly how much executive meddling there was with the plot. For most other series we have no idea. Under such conditions we need to be careful when interpreting a work of art and even more so when giving praise to the men and women responsible for it's existance.

Some story elements in some productions are like this, a total non sequitur that has no other meaning or function than marketing.

When we are talking about works such as MLP:FIM I think it's important we always remember that at the end of the day we are talking about a 22 minute toy commercial and that we can't take anything at face value when it comes to it's plot, characters or development. It may seam easy to point to the new forms the main six take at the end of the episode or to Twilight's new castle as corporate mandates but the show as a hole is a toy commercial. Everything, EVERYTHING in the show is designed to make little girls want to buy the MLP toys. There is no magical line in the sand where the commercial ends and the show begins. This isn't a legal drama where one of the lawyers just "happens" to order a Jack Daniels at the bar. Each individual episode of MLP: FIM is a toy commercial.

I know this is old but I have to respond to this.

You brought up Transformers, well, I also grew up with the Unicorn Trilogy and it shaped who I am, this and two other shows from my childhood, is what I based my entire moral character on. Can a mere commercial do that?

Yes, because A art can do what we allow it to do, and B you had parents who let television raise you instead of doing it themselves.

[Dragon Ball Fan]

The way I see it this is a toy commercial first, second and third. It's a well written toy commercial that has pretty enough graphics and a complex enough plot to be able to stand on it's own - and as such be exempt from the typical scrutiny of government regulatory bodies. BUT, it's still a toy commercial. To analyze this as if it were any other show is disingenuous. This isn't any other show, it was never intended as a stand alone show, it was always intended as a toy commercial and as such should be analysed at least partially from that perspective.

Think about it like this, the only reason this show is so much better then all the previous iterations of MLP cartoons is because Lauren Faust was three things, an accomplished writer, a good cartoonist and a fan of the original toys. But she never got the money she did to make the first season of this because any of that. She got that sweet, sweet Hasbro toy money because a Hasbro exec thought a new cartoon would help popularize their MLP toy line and new character designs were something they were already looking for. That's not to say the show doesn't at the very least have it's good parts, or it's strong episodes but at the end of the day, this show lives and dies not on how popular it is with girls 3 and up but on how well the toys it's based on are selling.

Since I doubt most people here, me included would describe themselves as bronies let me use a Transformers analogy. Beast Wars is wildly touted as one of the best if not the best Transformers animated series. The sole reason it exists is because Hasbro saw it could get away with a half an hour toy commercial in the 80's and since regular Transformers toy sales were in a slum sought to reenvision the toy line, the highly successful Beast wars cartoon series was just a marketing ploy for this new reenvisioned Transformers toy line. To ignore the merits of the show because it was a half hour toy commercial would be wrong. To ignore the fact that every episode is nothing more then 22 minutes of advertising you, me and and a lot of people would happily pay to watch is worse. In select cases like that of The Transformers: The movie we are fortunate enough to know exactly how much executive meddling there was with the plot. For most other series we have no idea. Under such conditions we need to be careful when interpreting a work of art and even more so when giving praise to the men and women responsible for it's existance.

Some story elements in some productions are like this, a total non sequitur that has no other meaning or function than marketing.

When we are talking about works such as MLP:FIM I think it's important we always remember that at the end of the day we are talking about a 22 minute toy commercial and that we can't take anything at face value when it comes to it's plot, characters or development. It may seam easy to point to the new forms the main six take at the end of the episode or to Twilight's new castle as corporate mandates but the show as a hole is a toy commercial. Everything, EVERYTHING in the show is designed to make little girls want to buy the MLP toys. There is no magical line in the sand where the commercial ends and the show begins. This isn't a legal drama where one of the lawyers just "happens" to order a Jack Daniels at the bar. Each individual episode of MLP: FIM is a toy commercial.

I know this is old but I have to respond to this.

You brought up Transformers, well, I also grew up with the Unicorn Trilogy and it shaped who I am, this and two other shows from my childhood, is what I based my entire moral character on. Can a mere commercial do that?

Yes, because A art can do what we allow it to do, and B you had parents who let television raise you instead of doing it themselves.

That was more out of circumstance then neglect, they taught me values when they had time.

[Dragon Ball Fan]

I mean, The Bad Guys is made for teenagers and adults who already understand moral complexity and the storytelling tropes it's playing with. MLP is presenting Entry Level Conflict Resolution to actual kindergartners. Walk before you run and all that.

It's weird how more and more people insist adults should give in to their most violent, spiteful impulses to stop fascism but we teach kids that violence and revenge is never the answer.

[hammerofglass]

I mean, The Bad Guys is made for teenagers and adults who already understand moral complexity and the storytelling tropes it's playing with. MLP is presenting Entry Level Conflict Resolution to actual kindergartners. Walk before you run and all that.

It's weird how more and more people insist adults should give in to their most violent, spiteful impulses to stop fascism but we teach kids that violence and revenge is never the answer.

Violence often is the answer in those stories. To use your above example, they didn't just stand by and let the Decepticons murder them out of politeness.

[Thebestoftherest]

I mean, The Bad Guys is made for teenagers and adults who already understand moral complexity and the storytelling tropes it's playing with. MLP is presenting Entry Level Conflict Resolution to actual kindergartners. Walk before you run and all that.

It's weird how more and more people insist adults should give in to their most violent, spiteful impulses to stop fascism but we teach kids that violence and revenge is never the answer.

Violence often is the answer in those stories. To use your above example, they didn't just stand by and let the Decepticons murder them out of politeness.

Heck the morale paragon he goes on and on about Goku, solves almost every single problem in his life with fighting. Heck the Frieza vs Goku fight boil down to immigrate fight space Hitler.