Enterprise - Stigma

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TGLS
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Re: Enterprise - Stigma

Post by TGLS »

Dragon Ball Fan wrote: Fri Sep 09, 2022 10:08 pm
Frustration wrote: Thu Sep 08, 2022 11:39 pm It's not quite true that it took only one man to turn Germany into a genocidal empire-wannabe. Hitler was the spark that set off a conflagration, but there were other potential sparks - and the fuel had been piling up for a long, long time.

It wasn't just a problem with Germany, too - the Germans were very fond of portrayals of American colonization, and the treatment of the natives made a big impression on them.
But Hitler still is the only reason the Nazi Party itself went from a relatively benign political party to a death cult, so, my point could still stand.
No. It was always like that. Beyond the fact that the NSDAP always had Hitler as a member of the party, even if you count the prior DAP it was still full of raving anti-semites.
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Re: Enterprise - Stigma

Post by Dragon Ball Fan »

TGLS wrote: Fri Sep 09, 2022 10:35 pm
Dragon Ball Fan wrote: Fri Sep 09, 2022 10:08 pm
Frustration wrote: Thu Sep 08, 2022 11:39 pm It's not quite true that it took only one man to turn Germany into a genocidal empire-wannabe. Hitler was the spark that set off a conflagration, but there were other potential sparks - and the fuel had been piling up for a long, long time.

It wasn't just a problem with Germany, too - the Germans were very fond of portrayals of American colonization, and the treatment of the natives made a big impression on them.
But Hitler still is the only reason the Nazi Party itself went from a relatively benign political party to a death cult, so, my point could still stand.
No. It was always like that. Beyond the fact that the NSDAP always had Hitler as a member of the party, even if you count the prior DAP it was still full of raving anti-semites.
I was only using this as a comparison, anyway. why can't we say Administer T'Las being a Roulan infiltrator corrupting Vulcan society, be a justification for the Vulcans' previous behavior in ENT.

And if The Nazi Party was always full of genocidal lunatics, what was the Night of Long Knives? Why would Hitler have to purge the party of people who would have gladly gone along with his pans?
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Re: Enterprise - Stigma

Post by McAvoy »

Dragon Ball Fan wrote: Fri Sep 09, 2022 11:43 pm
TGLS wrote: Fri Sep 09, 2022 10:35 pm
Dragon Ball Fan wrote: Fri Sep 09, 2022 10:08 pm
Frustration wrote: Thu Sep 08, 2022 11:39 pm It's not quite true that it took only one man to turn Germany into a genocidal empire-wannabe. Hitler was the spark that set off a conflagration, but there were other potential sparks - and the fuel had been piling up for a long, long time.

It wasn't just a problem with Germany, too - the Germans were very fond of portrayals of American colonization, and the treatment of the natives made a big impression on them.
But Hitler still is the only reason the Nazi Party itself went from a relatively benign political party to a death cult, so, my point could still stand.
No. It was always like that. Beyond the fact that the NSDAP always had Hitler as a member of the party, even if you count the prior DAP it was still full of raving anti-semites.
I was only using this as a comparison, anyway. why can't we say Administer T'Las being a Roulan infiltrator corrupting Vulcan society, be a justification for the Vulcans' previous behavior in ENT.

And if The Nazi Party was always full of genocidal lunatics, what was the Night of Long Knives? Why would Hitler have to purge the party of people who would have gladly gone along with his pans?
Read into the history of anti semitism. It has a long history in Europe. The Nazis used this, combined with the post war attitudes Germans had, Hitler's energetic chrasmatic speeches, and of course the usual mob rule, you get incidents like the Night of Long Knives.
I got nothing to say here.
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Re: Enterprise - Stigma

Post by clearspira »

McAvoy wrote: Sat Sep 10, 2022 4:08 am
Dragon Ball Fan wrote: Fri Sep 09, 2022 11:43 pm
TGLS wrote: Fri Sep 09, 2022 10:35 pm
Dragon Ball Fan wrote: Fri Sep 09, 2022 10:08 pm
Frustration wrote: Thu Sep 08, 2022 11:39 pm It's not quite true that it took only one man to turn Germany into a genocidal empire-wannabe. Hitler was the spark that set off a conflagration, but there were other potential sparks - and the fuel had been piling up for a long, long time.

It wasn't just a problem with Germany, too - the Germans were very fond of portrayals of American colonization, and the treatment of the natives made a big impression on them.
But Hitler still is the only reason the Nazi Party itself went from a relatively benign political party to a death cult, so, my point could still stand.
No. It was always like that. Beyond the fact that the NSDAP always had Hitler as a member of the party, even if you count the prior DAP it was still full of raving anti-semites.
I was only using this as a comparison, anyway. why can't we say Administer T'Las being a Roulan infiltrator corrupting Vulcan society, be a justification for the Vulcans' previous behavior in ENT.

And if The Nazi Party was always full of genocidal lunatics, what was the Night of Long Knives? Why would Hitler have to purge the party of people who would have gladly gone along with his pans?
Read into the history of anti semitism. It has a long history in Europe. The Nazis used this, combined with the post war attitudes Germans had, Hitler's energetic chrasmatic speeches, and of course the usual mob rule, you get incidents like the Night of Long Knives.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecuti ... lack_Death

One of the first things society did during the Black Death was to blame the Jews for it, leading to whole communities being massacred. And that was eight hundred years ago.
You're absolutely right. Hitler did nothing new.
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Re: Enterprise - Stigma

Post by Dragon Ball Fan »

Again, all this was just a comparison to what T'las did.
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Re: Enterprise - Stigma

Post by Frustration »

The only reason?

It's been many years since I read about the history of the rise of Nazi Germany, but your statement doesn't at all mesh with what I remember. If Adolf Hitler had never existed, it's very likely that some other demagogue with similar positions and issues would have filled the same role. Hitler did have a notable gift for speech-making, but probably there are lots of politically-gifted individuals whom circumstances never permit to make a lasting impression on history. Would Churchill have been recognized by history as a masterful orator if the war had never occurred?
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Re: Enterprise - Stigma

Post by McAvoy »

clearspira wrote: Sat Sep 10, 2022 10:33 am
McAvoy wrote: Sat Sep 10, 2022 4:08 am
Dragon Ball Fan wrote: Fri Sep 09, 2022 11:43 pm
TGLS wrote: Fri Sep 09, 2022 10:35 pm
Dragon Ball Fan wrote: Fri Sep 09, 2022 10:08 pm
Frustration wrote: Thu Sep 08, 2022 11:39 pm It's not quite true that it took only one man to turn Germany into a genocidal empire-wannabe. Hitler was the spark that set off a conflagration, but there were other potential sparks - and the fuel had been piling up for a long, long time.

It wasn't just a problem with Germany, too - the Germans were very fond of portrayals of American colonization, and the treatment of the natives made a big impression on them.
But Hitler still is the only reason the Nazi Party itself went from a relatively benign political party to a death cult, so, my point could still stand.
No. It was always like that. Beyond the fact that the NSDAP always had Hitler as a member of the party, even if you count the prior DAP it was still full of raving anti-semites.
I was only using this as a comparison, anyway. why can't we say Administer T'Las being a Roulan infiltrator corrupting Vulcan society, be a justification for the Vulcans' previous behavior in ENT.

And if The Nazi Party was always full of genocidal lunatics, what was the Night of Long Knives? Why would Hitler have to purge the party of people who would have gladly gone along with his pans?
Read into the history of anti semitism. It has a long history in Europe. The Nazis used this, combined with the post war attitudes Germans had, Hitler's energetic chrasmatic speeches, and of course the usual mob rule, you get incidents like the Night of Long Knives.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecuti ... lack_Death

One of the first things society did during the Black Death was to blame the Jews for it, leading to whole communities being massacred. And that was eight hundred years ago.
You're absolutely right. Hitler did nothing new.
There is a interesting three part documentary I watched recently on thd history of antisemitism. Go on YouTube and look up the channel DW.

DW I think is French. Definitely European. I only became aware of them when they did a two part 45 minute documentary on Notre Dame Cathedral.

Anyway. Of course Nazis went further and used their antisemitism as one of many motivating factors in starting the war.
I got nothing to say here.
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