Lower Decks: Crisis Point

[McAvoy]

Ehh I pegged her being a Starfleet brat who had authoritive parents that she rebelled against even when she joined Starfleet. Which she obviously graduated from. She was probably a normal kid that as she got older saw normal parents and then saw her own and it grated on her.

Also most likely her parents practically forced her into Starfleet.

It's almost a trope.

[griffeytrek]

I still kind of like the idea that mariner is one of the kids raised on the Enterprise-D. She is the result of "Starfleets Great Experiment". The lab rats were the kids. And what trauma's they would be layered with from trying to grow up in that insane environment.

That is just because you can't get your head around the idea of families in space, and differing cultural levels of risk tolerance. Trust me on this, the Enterprise D wouldn't even raise an eyebrow in historical levels of risk averseness. It is super safe, safer than planets in Star Trek, with only minimal risk levels. If anything, the kids on it are more likely to be affluenza victims due to the level of privilege it gives them than it is to actually traumatise them. You want trauma? Look at all the kids living on Earth and seeing V'ger bearing down on them in the sky, or the whale probe, or the stupid DS9 Coup, or, the Borg, twice, and a couple of others I'm probably forgetting. Nah, the whole families in space are so unsafe thing doesn't hold water.

Nope what you say doesn't golf water at all.

Enterprise-D faced more danger than Earth did. All of your examples with Earth have years placed between them and in some cases decades. Like V'Ger and the whale probe.

Whereas Enterprise-D faced some deadly threats that could destroy the ship far far far more often then that.

So if the theory is just Enterprise-D is correct then it's sound enough. We do not have any information on any other ship not named Enterprise until Defiant or Voyager.

For all we know the USS Galaxy had a equally adventurous time too with families on board. Or it could be any other ship that allowed families on board

But considering she knows quite a bit of famous people it is in the realm of possibility that she was around them probably with her parents.

Or she could be a cartoon character playing on fan service and not to be taken so literally.

it's not even the dangers to the ship. It's some of the things that happened to the kids on that ship. How many times were they kidnapped by Alien's seeking to repopulate and preserve their culture? Or seen family members turned into things? Subjected to Alien Death Penalties for stepping on the grass? Simply encountering Picard in a Hallway? These are all traumatic events.

I also think the Enterprise-D theory holds up because we see Captain Freeman clearly has some close ties to Enterprise-D Veterans. From Riker as her 'Chadiche" (sp?) to her close friendship with Sonya Gomez. She was probably an Ensign or Lieutenant on the D. Probably one of the various Gold Shirt officers we saw.

[McAvoy]

I still kind of like the idea that mariner is one of the kids raised on the Enterprise-D. She is the result of "Starfleets Great Experiment". The lab rats were the kids. And what trauma's they would be layered with from trying to grow up in that insane environment.

That is just because you can't get your head around the idea of families in space, and differing cultural levels of risk tolerance. Trust me on this, the Enterprise D wouldn't even raise an eyebrow in historical levels of risk averseness. It is super safe, safer than planets in Star Trek, with only minimal risk levels. If anything, the kids on it are more likely to be affluenza victims due to the level of privilege it gives them than it is to actually traumatise them. You want trauma? Look at all the kids living on Earth and seeing V'ger bearing down on them in the sky, or the whale probe, or the stupid DS9 Coup, or, the Borg, twice, and a couple of others I'm probably forgetting. Nah, the whole families in space are so unsafe thing doesn't hold water.

Nope what you say doesn't golf water at all.

Enterprise-D faced more danger than Earth did. All of your examples with Earth have years placed between them and in some cases decades. Like V'Ger and the whale probe.

Whereas Enterprise-D faced some deadly threats that could destroy the ship far far far more often then that.

So if the theory is just Enterprise-D is correct then it's sound enough. We do not have any information on any other ship not named Enterprise until Defiant or Voyager.

For all we know the USS Galaxy had a equally adventurous time too with families on board. Or it could be any other ship that allowed families on board

But considering she knows quite a bit of famous people it is in the realm of possibility that she was around them probably with her parents.

Or she could be a cartoon character playing on fan service and not to be taken so literally.

it's not even the dangers to the ship. It's some of the things that happened to the kids on that ship. How many times were they kidnapped by Alien's seeking to repopulate and preserve their culture? Or seen family members turned into things? Subjected to Alien Death Penalties for stepping on the grass? Simply encountering Picard in a Hallway? These are all traumatic events.

I also think the Enterprise-D theory holds up because we see Captain Freeman clearly has some close ties to Enterprise-D Veterans. From Riker as her 'Chadiche" (sp?) to her close friendship with Sonya Gomez. She was probably an Ensign or Lieutenant on the D. Probably one of the various Gold Shirt officers we saw.

Well. We can assume Carol Freeman would be around the first to third season of TNG. Probably could do an interesting poll on that random background black woman gold shirt in engineering is Ensign or Lieutenant Freeman.

[CharlesPhipps]

Ehh I pegged her being a Starfleet brat who had authoritive parents that she rebelled against even when she joined Starfleet. Which she obviously graduated from. She was probably a normal kid that as she got older saw normal parents and then saw her own and it grated on her.

Also most likely her parents practically forced her into Starfleet.

It's almost a trope.

That is kind of the issue with Mariner that she has a 15 year old's emotional maturity when she's almost certainly in her mid twenties.

[McAvoy]

Ehh I pegged her being a Starfleet brat who had authoritive parents that she rebelled against even when she joined Starfleet. Which she obviously graduated from. She was probably a normal kid that as she got older saw normal parents and then saw her own and it grated on her.

Also most likely her parents practically forced her into Starfleet.

It's almost a trope.

That is kind of the issue with Mariner that she has a 15 year old's emotional maturity when she's almost certainly in her mid twenties.

Yeah 2385 right? So ten years since the Dominion War. We can could assume she is 25 for example.

Born in 2360. So if she was on board the entire TNG run plus Generations she would have been 11. Assuming she was on board the entire time.

And she woukd have been a young teenager during the Dominion War.

You know who she reminds me of? Watch Down Periscope with Kelsey Grammer. There is a certain character that resembles Mariner.

[hammerofglass]

Ehh I pegged her being a Starfleet brat who had authoritive parents that she rebelled against even when she joined Starfleet. Which she obviously graduated from. She was probably a normal kid that as she got older saw normal parents and then saw her own and it grated on her.

Also most likely her parents practically forced her into Starfleet.

It's almost a trope.

That is kind of the issue with Mariner that she has a 15 year old's emotional maturity when she's almost certainly in her mid twenties.

Yeah 2385 right? So ten years since the Dominion War. We can could assume she is 25 for example.

Born in 2360. So if she was on board the entire TNG run plus Generations she would have been 11. Assuming she was on board the entire time.

And she woukd have been a young teenager during the Dominion War.

You know who she reminds me of? Watch Down Periscope with Kelsey Grammer. There is a certain character that resembles Mariner.

I thought she was supposed to be older than that, like a decade older than her friends who are recent academy graduates. So more like early thirties. Which would fit with the implications in the DS9 crossover that she served in the war.

I know who you mean and now I can't unsee it.

[Archanubis]

Which is what Wesley was MEANT to do but failed miserably at.

Wesley was Roddenberry's self-insert character. It's only when Berman and Pillar took over writing the show that they started writing the character as more flawed.

[CharlesPhipps]

Which is what Wesley was MEANT to do but failed miserably at.

Wesley was Roddenberry's self-insert character. It's only when Berman and Pillar took over writing the show that they started writing the character as more flawed.

Will Wheaton's biography said the writers hated the Wesley character and it was annoying as hell because he stated, "even at fourteen, I was like, instead of putting me in fucking awful sweaters and writing me as an obnoxious know it all nerd -- why not write me BETTER?"

[McAvoy]

Which is what Wesley was MEANT to do but failed miserably at.

Wesley was Roddenberry's self-insert character. It's only when Berman and Pillar took over writing the show that they started writing the character as more flawed.

Will Wheaton's biography said the writers hated the Wesley character and it was annoying as hell because he stated, "even at fourteen, I was like, instead of putting me in fucking awful sweaters and writing me as an obnoxious know it all nerd -- why not write me BETTER?"

He was written better after Season 2. Anything written in the first two seasons were not exactly that good with a few exceptions.

He ended up in alot of episodes to be a glorified extra once he had the uniform.

I honestly have no idea how he could be written better. But at least toning down his 'genius' would have been a start. Maybe having the Traveler in one or two more episodes could have been better. Or not.

[CharlesPhipps]

He was written better after Season 2. Anything written in the first two seasons were not exactly that good with a few exceptions.

He ended up in alot of episodes to be a glorified extra once he had the uniform.

I honestly have no idea how he could be written better. But at least toning down his 'genius' would have been a start. Maybe having the Traveler in one or two more episodes could have been better. Or not.

I said this like 10 years ago to a friend of mine but I think it still holds true and that's Wesley doesn't actually NEED to be a genius if he's a cadet or Starfleet Ensign. He's cool enough as a person on a starship as is. There's lots of stories you can do with someone trying to impress the bosses around you and wondering what's going on.

Nog and Jake Sisko had more meat to contend with but as we saw with "The First Duty" there's nothing wrong with Will's acting.

I can already imagine a "Siege" story like the one they did with Jake where Wes realizes, "OMG, STARFLEET IS DANGEROUS!"