Celebrating Pride Month: Dreadnought vs. Homelander

[ProfessorDetective]

Does noone get tired of people being LGBTQwhatever and having only experience with abuse? It kinda solidifies the theme of them just being troubled people and thus being dragged into a "wierd lifestyle", as it's doubtful that the people who hurt them would act any better, if they weren't LBTQwhatever. You're not the best parent in the world and suddenly start abusing your child for being a little bit different. Parents like that were abusive long before the child displayed any notions of that particular kind...

That's why I love the kind of rep in She-Ra and Owl House. Queer folks of all stripes just casually existing in society and nobody cares. New Trek has been making an attempt at something similar even if it is pretty clunky at it so far, and I think we'll be seeing a lot more of it in the mainstream in the near future.

Admittedly She-Ra did have a big "parental abuse trauma" theme going, but it was unrelated.

With the main couple also being... rather abusive, up until the VERY end. After all of the Hell Catra put her through, Adora had every right to reject her Anguished Declaration of Love, pummel her, and then book it in the other direction. Then getting together is what REALLY soured me on that show.

[Winter]

With the main couple also being... rather abusive, up until the VERY end. After all of the Hell Catra put her through, Adora had every right to reject her Anguished Declaration of Love, pummel her, and then book it in the other direction. Then getting together is what REALLY soured me on that show.

But Catra changed before that. She sacrificed her life to save Glimmer with no thought of surviving, was tortured, died and worked to improve herself. It's not like with Kylo Ren who was horrible to Rey only for her to, for no explained reason, want to redeem him based solely on his word that he was the victim in all this after killing several people who didn't actually do anything. Catra really did change and improved.

Adora excepted Catra's love because she never stopped loving her and knew there was good still in her. Rey gave Kylo a chance seemingly just because of the cliched "They're trying to kill each other so they must love each other."

I've said this before and I'll say it again, we see the good in Catra throughout the series and know she can be better. Kylo is a jerk who does what he does because he's an idiot who's a Space Nazi fanboy.

[hammerofglass]

If nothing else it's a realistic portrayal of interacting with a cat.

[CharlesPhipps]

The best ending would have been She-Ra and her friends happy and content and free.

But Catra ruling the Horde, having sacrificed everything to be the Dark Lord. Alone and all powerful.

[Winter]

The best ending would have been She-Ra and her friends happy and content and free.

But Catra ruling the Horde, having sacrificed everything to be the Dark Lord. Alone and all powerful.

Honestly I couldn't see that, even for early season Catra. She never really wanted power but rather love which was twisted by her warped view of the world thanks to Shadow Weaver's awful parenting which made her think that what she really wanted was respect.

That's why I think that Catra turning over a new leaf is the better direction for her character because that's where she was always headed.

[CharlesPhipps]

The best ending would have been She-Ra and her friends happy and content and free.

But Catra ruling the Horde, having sacrificed everything to be the Dark Lord. Alone and all powerful.

Honestly I couldn't see that, even for early season Catra. She never really wanted power but rather love which was twisted by her warped view of the world thanks to Shadow Weaver's awful parenting which made her think that what she really wanted was respect.

That's why I think that Catra turning over a new leaf is the better direction for her character because that's where she was always headed.

I know I'm alone but I felt Catra after trying to kill everyone should have become fully irredeemable.

I felt the same about Shadow Weaver. Her redemption left a bad taste in my mouth.

[Winter]

I know I'm alone but I felt Catra after trying to kill everyone should have become fully irredeemable.

I felt the same about Shadow Weaver. Her redemption left a bad taste in my mouth.

On the first point, as I've said many times Catra was never beyond redemption. She showed that she regretted her actions and was never trying to kill everyone. Conquer yes, kill no. The ending of Season 4 made it clear that Catra was going to be redeemed (though I'll admit that I was uncertain it would happen at the time). But what made me love Catra's redemption was one simple scene between her and Adora in Season 5.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eVuq41Mi74Y

That moment is where Catra's redemption truly begins. Her saving Glimmer was not an attempt to trick Adora into saving her as she didn't think anyone cared enough about her to do so. But that act showed Adora that the was still good in the girl she loved and so she went to save her. Catra didn't understand until this moment as Catra comes to face something she never considered, "Adora doesn't hate me, and never has."

Making her a villain after that point would be like Spock turning on Kirk after Kirk brought him back from the dead. There are just somethings that make being a villain impossible.

As for Shadow Weaver's Redemption, she wasn't.

Stevenson himself stated that SW's actions in the finale wasn't her trying to redeem herself but to try and manipulate her "Daughters" one final time so they would HAVE to forgive her for her horrible parenting. I've no doubt that she did care for both Catra and Adora but in the end she never loved them, she only ever cared for herself and what Adora could give her.

SW's arc is a selfish person who alienates everyone around her until she has nothing left and the only way to gain any level of respect is to die to try and force people to see her as the great person she thinks she is. This isn't my interpretation of the character it's stated by the creator of the series himself. SW is not a tale of redemption, and it never was.

[hammerofglass]

Shadow Weaver died as she lived: traumatizing the only two people in the world who cared about her.

[ProfessorDetective]

The best ending would have been She-Ra and her friends happy and content and free.

But Catra ruling the Horde, having sacrificed everything to be the Dark Lord. Alone and all powerful.

Honestly I couldn't see that, even for early season Catra. She never really wanted power but rather love which was twisted by her warped view of the world thanks to Shadow Weaver's awful parenting which made her think that what she really wanted was respect.

That's why I think that Catra turning over a new leaf is the better direction for her character because that's where she was always headed.

I know I'm alone but I felt Catra after trying to kill everyone should have become fully irredeemable.

I felt the same about Shadow Weaver. Her redemption left a bad taste in my mouth.

Seconded.

[clearspira]

Does noone get tired of people being LGBTQwhatever and having only experience with abuse? It kinda solidifies the theme of them just being troubled people and thus being dragged into a "wierd lifestyle", as it's doubtful that the people who hurt them would act any better, if they weren't LBTQwhatever. You're not the best parent in the world and suddenly start abusing your child for being a little bit different. Parents like that were abusive long before the child displayed any notions of that particular kind...

I don't know if there is a trope for this yet but there bloody should be.

You know what this reminds me of? How often women get threatened with rape by male criminals in fiction. Its the default. A good beating isn't enough, they have to get rapey on top of it. To paraphrase Linkara regarding Dr Light, ''its not for any story reason, its because its something that happens to women.''

Its easy and lazy drama. And making every other LGBT person in fiction the victim of homophobia is easy and lazy drama. And if you look at the ''gay'' films that actually make it big in Hollywood such as ''Call Me By Your Name'' its just a summer romance with none of that in there at all. Good film BTW. I don't remember any boycotts or anything like that over it either.