Star Trek (Dis): Context Is for Kings

[King of the owls]

While this topic truly has nothing to Discovery since Tilly is not canonically autistic(Hey if you headcanon her as autistic then be my guest.)
Regarding "the Federation would cure autism." thing. Recall that while Geordi was born blind he was not "Cured"(At least in the sense that he was forced to undergo a surgery to fix his eyes or get new ones.) At five he was given the VISOR as a birthday gift to aid him but it did not cure him. Then years and years later he got implants to replace the visor because he choose to but again it's not really a 'cure'. There is no evidence that the Federation forces any blind person to get the VISOR or implants. So I'm very iffy on the idea the federation would force autistic people to get cured or that when any autistic child is born they would automatically be given a cure. They would give aids and services when needed. If an autistic person wishes to get cured then well I'm sure they would allow it but if not they well like Geodri they can get aids or services that will help live their lives. In short it's a bit mind boggling to think the federation would be "morally obligated" to cure autism any time it occurs when they do not seem morally obligated to cure blindness any time it occurs.


But yeah this getting a bit heated. So ah....
Saru is of bovine origin.

[J!!]

One thing to keep in mind with Tilly is that they dial it way the fuck back with her character pretty quick. In-universe, this suggests to me that she's a bit awkward & high-strung, but probably not autistic.

Out-of-universe, it's probably not a storytelling decision, so much as the writers & actress finding their footing.

[Winter]

I gotta say I'm really looking forward to The Quickening review, mainly because I feel its a really underrated episode, partly because it's what Dear Doctor SHOULD have been but mainly when it comes to a episode that features hundreds of innocent people dying just because some jerks want to prove that they're the biggest tools in the galaxy all anyone cares about is a good person trying to help people because he feels its the most he can do.

The bit where Bashir sees the woman he tried to save die after saving her child and the look on his face when he sees that she's dead is one of the most heart wrenching moments in all of Trek and it results in you just wanting to punch the founders more because all of this was to prove how evil they are. And the final scene of Bashir still trying to find a cure to help everyone was, for me, the moment that Bashir really grew as a character and is, at the time of this writing, the second best Doctor in Trek, (the first being a tie between both McCoy's of TOS and the Kelvin Universe).

[unknownsample]

Can we dial back the emotions please? This is starting to get a bit hyperbolic and strawmanny.

Maybe go back and re-read what Chuck just said?

He is proposing that people like me who are on the spectrum should be cured, replace the word autistic with the word gay to see how staggeringly offensive that attitude is, so forgive me if I'm being a little emotional about this. Not to mention he bases this desire for a cure on fictional characters from the 1980s.

[TrueMetis]

While this topic truly has nothing to Discovery since Tilly is not canonically autistic(Hey if you headcanon her as autistic then be my guest.)
Regarding "the Federation would cure autism." thing. Recall that while Geordi was born blind he was not "Cured"(At least in the sense that he was forced to undergo a surgery to fix his eyes or get new ones.) At five he was given the VISOR as a birthday gift to aid him but it did not cure him. Then years and years later he got implants to replace the visor because he choose to but again it's not really a 'cure'. There is no evidence that the Federation forces any blind person to get the VISOR or implants. So I'm very iffy on the idea the federation would force autistic people to get cured or that when any autistic child is born they would automatically be given a cure. They would give aids and services when needed. If an autistic person wishes to get cured then well I'm sure they would allow it but if not they well like Geodri they can get aids or services that will help live their lives. In short it's a bit mind boggling to think the federation would be "morally obligated" to cure autism any time it occurs when they do not seem morally obligated to cure blindness any time it occurs.


But yeah this getting a bit heated. So ah....
Saru is of bovine origin.

Now correct me if I'm wrong, but I was under the impression that the reason that they didn't cure Geordi was because they couldn't. So since something like the VISOR was the only option they would have to wait until he was a little older. There's a reason him getting his full eyesight back during insurrection was a big deal. As was his decision to stop the federation from harvesting the rings and therefore lose his eyesight. If they could give him normal eyesight this wouldn't be a big deal, and if they can't do it to an adult I doubt they could do it to a baby.

So we have no idea what the Federation's policy on blindness is, we do know they can and will correct genetic defects pre-natally. Which might mean they don't sometimes, or it could mean they didn't catch the defect early enough in Geordi's case. And now that they have ocular implants that can match the human eye in both how well it see's and how well it matches a normal eye they very well could mandate that blind children be given them. And tbh honest I'm not sure where I fail on whether that would be a good thing or not.

[King of the owls]

Now correct me if I'm wrong, but I was under the impression that the reason that they didn't cure Geordi was because they couldn't. So since something like the VISOR was the only option they would have to wait until he was a little older. There's a reason him getting his full eyesight back during insurrection was a big deal. As was his decision to stop the federation from harvesting the rings and therefore lose his eyesight. If they could give him normal eyesight this wouldn't be a big deal, and if they can't do it to an adult I doubt they could do it to a baby.

So we have no idea what the Federation's policy on blindness is, we do know they can and will correct genetic defects pre-natally. Which might mean they don't sometimes, or it could mean they didn't catch the defect early enough in Geordi's case. And now that they have ocular implants that can match the human eye in both how well it see's and how well it matches a normal eye they very well could mandate that blind children be given them. And tbh honest I'm not sure where I fail on whether that would be a good thing or not.

I admit it's been a while since I've seen any TNG episode where Geordi mentions any backstory so I could be talking out of my ass.

On the topic of the insurrection planet however if I recall it only took a short amount of time on the planet for his eyes to heal. It's reasonable to assume that Federation can grow eyes in labs and give them to a blind person but the process probably is difficult and lengthy so perhaps that's why he was in awe? What would been years of painful surgeries is now maybe day at most spent on a beautiful planet. Or maybe I'm still talking out of my ass again.

Maybe there's a mandate.(At least in the sense if you wish to work in Starfleet you'll need implants or a VISOR. ) maybe there's isn't. But considering the eugenics war. I just feel there would a sense of concern with automatically curing any disabled or neuroatypical person you come upon in the Federation. But that's just how I see it. Feel free to disagree.

[TGLS]

He is proposing that people like me who are on the spectrum should be cured, replace the word autistic with the word gay to see how staggeringly offensive that attitude is, so forgive me if I'm being a little emotional about this. Not to mention he bases this desire for a cure on fictional characters from the 1980s.

I apologize if I offended. I tend to run my mouth when posting on the internet.

[Darth Wedgius]

Being autistic to some extent -- missing social cues, not emotionally interacting with others smoothly -- might cause similar problems to humans interacting with Vulcans. Obviously, sitting on the floor all day and never looking at people would not make for a functional Starfleet officer, except maybe an Admiral.

Now I know the question everybody else is too sensitive to bring up, but some subjects really need to be broached, and I think it's the job of science fiction to do it. Given what we've seen, I don't think STD's level of technology is up to curing bovininity.

[Asvarduil]

Being autistic to some extent -- missing social cues, not emotionally interacting with others smoothly -- might cause similar problems to humans interacting with Vulcans. Obviously, sitting on the floor all day and never looking at people would not make for a functional Starfleet officer, except maybe an Admiral.

Now I know the question everybody else is too sensitive to bring up, but some subjects really need to be broached, and I think it's the job of science fiction to do it. Given what we've seen, I don't think STD's level of technology is up to curing bovininity.

#SaruIsACow2018

[J!!]

I think we need to moooove on from this cheesey joke.