Another School Shooting, this time in Florida

[SuccubusYuri]

I would argue after 20 years of putting up with this, any legislation targeted towards curbing it isn't done in a frantic panic like so many clucking hens as the Patriot Act or the Muslim bans could be categorized.

[Admiral X]

It's not that the legislation itself would be frantic. That Patriot Act wasn't either. The passing of the legislation would be, though, as would be any popular support for it, as seen by all the frantic attempts to get popular support following a mass shooting.

[excalibur]

I have no problems with effective legislation that are meaningful. Not band-aid reactionary stuff that does not work and are fueled by misguided emotions. People protesting in streets without even knowing what they are protesting and picking fights not for a cause but because they want to lash out at something.

[TGLS]

So what would counts as "effective legislation"?

The Cornyn-Murphy Bill (Summary)? What the Florida Senate is proposing (Summary)? Something else?

[Fuzzy Necromancer]

Alright, so giving myself enough time to read, it's my turn.

Where I stand, the only really special thing is the presence of these mass shootings.

That mindset is a bit of a problem because, forgive me for saying this, but that's a very narrow minded world view. Because to me, all acts of violence that can be called senseless like mass shootings are the same regardless of what was used. You just want to focus on guns because they apparently scare you more than other tools used as weapons. If guns didn't exist and we're back in the age of sword, I believe that fear would translate to swords or sticks and stones.

Let me ask a follow-up question, because you've been mostly clear on your position but this is something I need further and better particulars on.

What do you think is so different about the USA? What quality does it have that other nations don't that is relevant to this discussion? Why do think the measures that worked so well in other countries would be ineffective here?

[excalibur]

To be perfectly honest, it's not the one thing. It's many things about the USA that stands out from the rest. It's still a relatively new country with no actual ancient roots, founded through conflict and persistence. It's become very diverse. English, German, french, Irish, and Italian Chinese, Japanese, Hispanic, and of course, the first people who settled in this part of the world and all their various tribes. I'm part Irish and Asian actually, I was born here with family stretching back 150 years. I was raised in Chicago. America is not a homogeneous country so much that it's a toss salad and that's because of the uniqueness of how this country was founded more than any others like Canada, Mexico or the entirety of South America.

America's government is not quite like others, it's people diverse with different ideas and struggles and it all started with how America was founded and what it grew into.

Also, measures that you claimed worked so well in other countries are not what they seem. I've already told you how the UK's crime is still running rampant and Australia's gun ban didn't actually stop violence but as long as it isn't death by gun, no one cares. England is the acid attack capital of the world and the rest of Europe is engulfed in a crisis caused by the migrants they've been letting in.

[Fuzzy Necromancer]

Alright, so giving myself enough time to read, it's my turn.

I live in a state where no gun signs in private businesses are not the law and I conceal carry my gun where ever I go. If I live in a state where private business's signs are the law, then I don't do business there because I may obey the law but criminals don't and I will not disarm myself so that you "feel" safe in a store. A friend of mine just stopped a robbery at a gas station where the guy was threatening people with a large needle. I saw the camera footage. Everyone was frozen with feel and my friend with a gun, came in to put a stop it. Thankfully he didn't have to use it but it put him in a better position. He would have went in regardless if he was armed, but that's him.

The laws do not work. Making new more restrictive laws as a knee jerk reaction to a tragic incident that happens less than petty crime and gang related crime won't fix anything and will make it worse.

Of all the things you said, this had the most impact on me.

The other argument, though, is the calls from students who have survived the mass shooting. They say that more restrictive gun laws would help. I'm inclined to believe them, because of their direct experience with one angsty little white teen who was able to kill so many people in such a short time.

[Fuzzy Necromancer]

To be perfectly honest, it's not the one thing. It's many things about the USA that stands out from the rest. It's still a relatively new country with no actual ancient roots, founded through conflict and persistence. It's become very diverse. English, German, french, Irish, and Italian Chinese, Japanese, Hispanic, and of course, the first people who settled in this part of the world and all their various tribes. I'm part Irish and Asian actually, I was born here with family stretching back 150 years. I was raised in Chicago. America is not a homogeneous country so much that it's a toss salad and that's because of the uniqueness of how this country was founded more than any others like Canada, Mexico or the entirety of South America.

America's government is not quite like others, it's people diverse with different ideas and struggles and it all started with how America was founded and what it grew into.

Okay, that's an answer, but I still don't see how any of this leads you to the conclusion "Guns in a America are different from guns anywhere else." What does all of this have to do with gun violence and attempts to limit preventable deaths?

[Fuzzy Necromancer]

I have no problems with effective legislation that are meaningful. Not band-aid reactionary stuff that does not work and are fueled by misguided emotions. People protesting in streets without even knowing what they are protesting and picking fights not for a cause but because they want to lash out at something.

Please do not take such a dismissive attitude towards street protestors. "Picking fights and lashing out" is what angsty white boys with ammunition do, or what rioting football fans do. People march in the streets with signs to confront an issue, often with the knowledge that they may be arrested for exercising their right to free speech.

[SuccubusYuri]

Yeah put me in the camp that says children begging lawmakers "Please let us research the problem as a society" isn't "lashing out". If the anti-action side isn't afraid of the truth, just lift the restrictions on studying guns. The data will show everyone how more guns will solve the problem.