Dragon Age II: EA boogaloo

[CharlesPhipps]

You have a very good number of points but I think it ignores one small thing.

I'll use an analogy to explain.

Merill is a Sith Lord.

This is roughly the best equivalent you can find in Thedas. She's a person who doesn't look like it but has openly admitted to being part of the Jedi killing, galaxy-conquering, Dark Side using faction that everyone knows is the boogeyman in the galaxy. People who worked the magic that wrecked the universe, brought the Blight, Enslave minds, commit mass human sacrifices and are with maybe 2 or 3 exceptions--the worst people ever.

It's one of the things which Merill is an interesting critique of because it doesn't matter if she's a fundamentally good person and the sweetest person ever, she's already admitted to an unforgivable crime. The equivalent of saying, "You know, let's take National Socialism back from the racists and warmongerers." The conversation has already stopped by the time she's begun it.

Merill's biggest problem isn't the fact she's a Blood Mage, which may or may not have gotten her possessed if she had gone through with it, it's the fact she blissfully ignores this is forbidden and has destroyed all of her relationships. We can blame the Keeper for talking shit behind her back but she doesn't have to because the statement, "Merill is a blood mage" is, by itself, enough to condemn her. Its a crime punishable by death everywhere in Thedas and for good reason.

And Merill...just ignores that because Blood Magic is so...USEFUL.

It's the dark part of Merill's quest that she doesn't realize that the Daelish will never trust her again for what she's done. She stubbornly refuses to admit in the pursuit of her goals, she's burned all bridges because she doesn't think what she's doing is wrong....and maybe she's right but the Daelish are not people who forgive or forget.

Honestly, they'll let her go with you because you ARE a legend and can be trusted to "deal with it."

[AlucardNoir]

Ah, and there we have our misunderstanding. You see her as a sith lord I see her as dabbling in the dark side.

I think the best analogy for Merrill and what she's doing is heroin. In the early 19th centuries there was a new literary trope being codified - that of the morphine addicted ship's doctor, and in some cases just doctor.(and people think opioid addiction is something new) Now, morphine was known to cause addiction and yet it was never made illegal. Why? because it was a useful tool. Heroin is more potent and faster acting than morphine. Now, we all know it was initially advertised as non addictive but people discovered it was habit forming fairly quickly. Why wasn't it immediately banned? because surprisingly enough it was better than morphine.

Why did it end up being banned? because unlike morphine who had already been somewhat regulated when heroine was introduced heroine was made more or less a over the counter medicine. When the addiction became really bad, and when TB and other ills it was used to treat had been somewhat pushed back by other advances in medicine it was banned - completely. Despite the fact morphine wasn't banned, despite the fact other newer synthetic opioids that were even stronger and more dangerous weren't banned, heroin was banned. Why? politics. It was one of the public evils so it was banned. Even today there are places and times when heroin would be preferable to morphine but the substance is illegal in most countries.

Magic in DA is like that. Rough magic is like attempting to consume an opium poppy rough, highly dangerous. The Qunari have limited themselves to only codeine. The circles are OK with everything, including stronger, newer opioids but not with heroin/blood magic. Tavinter? Tavinter has everything legal, to the point where the old stereotype of the morphine addled ships doctor is more or less day to day fact there - as are opium den equivalents. And you get to use blood magic, and you get to use blood magic, and you get to use blood magic, and you? you get to die powering a blood magic ritual.

And Merrill? well, are you familiar with the phrase "physician, heal thyself"? Merrill is like that, except she's OK with prescribing heroin to herself. As for why Blood magic is viewed the way it is, the same way massive heroin, cocaine and amphetamine addictions powered the ban of these drugs and in some cases related weaker chemical precursors with valid medical uses, so to did the blood ritual that tore a whole through the veil to the golden city and brought forth the blight serve as an impetus for the Chantry to ban blood magic. Funny how it was religious groups that were the most vocal advocates of this absolutist type of substance prohibition in the real world and are also the ones that are the most vehemently against magic in DA, don't you think?

Edit, god damn centuries. starting the 19th century in 1801... fucking calendar.

[CharlesPhipps]

My view of magic is that it's dangerous but useful but I have a somewhat more condemnatory view of blood magic because I've read "The Last Flight" and that influenced my interpretation of Blood Magic (as well as its portrayal in Origins). Basically, Blood Magic comes from demons. It's something you make a pact with them to teach you and they download it into your head.

Then you wonder why it requires large amounts of murder, self-sacrifice, and demon pacts to use.

Then you wonder why its use always seems to call demons and end up with possessed abominations running around.

In short, my view of Blood Magic isn't that it's dangerous among most dangerous magic.

My view is it's stupid.

But my view is that such fine distinctions are not the kind of thing which most Thedans make. They don't particularly care that Blood Magic is in the INTENT rather than the usage. They don't care about the fine subtleties or moral ambiguties. It's a deeply superstitious and bigoted lot, your average Thedan peasant---be they Daelish, City Elf, or human.

And their reaction to Meril is "Burn the Witch" not debate the utility.

Just my thoughts.

[AlucardNoir]

But my view is that such fine distinctions are not the kind of thing which most Thedans make. They don't particularly care that Blood Magic is in the INTENT rather than the usage. They don't care about the fine subtleties or moral ambiguties. It's a deeply superstitious and bigoted lot, your average Thedan peasant---be they Daelish, City Elf, or human.

And their reaction to Meril is "Burn the Witch" not debate the utility.

But... but... but if that is what you think why whould not side with Merrill when dealing with the Daelish?

[CharlesPhipps]

But... but... but if that is what you think why whould not side with Merrill when dealing with the Daelish?

That's the thing I was getting at. Dragon Age 2 is very much a detective novel and a large part of the game is depicting Kirkwall, its people, and its government as deeply flawed at best (a better term would be Kirkwall is the most wretched hive of scum and villainy you'll ever find). In the case of the Daelish, they are about to find their beloved leader dead on the ground next to a known Blood Mage as well as exile.

Sometimes the best thing is not to be reasonable but to try to divert the crowd or play to prejudices. I lied to Meredith and other people all the time.

It just doesn't pay to be the Paragon/Diplomat in Dragon Age.

[Steve]

My view of magic is that it's dangerous but useful but I have a somewhat more condemnatory view of blood magic because I've read "The Last Flight" and that influenced my interpretation of Blood Magic (as well as its portrayal in Origins). Basically, Blood Magic comes from demons. It's something you make a pact with them to teach you and they download it into your head.

Then you wonder why it requires large amounts of murder, self-sacrifice, and demon pacts to use.

Then you wonder why its use always seems to call demons and end up with possessed abominations running around.

In short, my view of Blood Magic isn't that it's dangerous among most dangerous magic.

My view is it's stupid.

But my view is that such fine distinctions are not the kind of thing which most Thedans make. They don't particularly care that Blood Magic is in the INTENT rather than the usage. They don't care about the fine subtleties or moral ambiguties. It's a deeply superstitious and bigoted lot, your average Thedan peasant---be they Daelish, City Elf, or human.

And their reaction to Meril is "Burn the Witch" not debate the utility.

Just my thoughts.

Interesting ones. I haven't read "The Last Flight".

OTOH, the Inquisition DLC Descent, when combined with Varric's companion mission alongside the "real" Bianca, have some interesting ramifications on what magic use really is...

(If only we had a spoiler code, bleh.)

[RobbyB1982]

And we are Sera Fucking HAWKE. It doesn't matter if we have a vagina and a nice rack or a cock and a nice pair of balls, we are The Sera Hawke, a literal living legend. There are literal ballads written about our exploits - ok, they are written by Varric for the most part, but they exist. We have survived the blight, we have had dealings with Asha'bllanar. We have slain countless bandits, mages, BLOOD MAGES, Qunari, Tal-Vashoth, giant spiders, dragonlings, ABOMINATIONS. Hell, we probably kill more then a mage circles worth of blood mages in every fucking act. If we have Sebastian, the rightfull hair to Starkhaven with us we probably killed a desire demon that caused the fall of his house, a named desire demon. Depending on our playthrough we could have probably killed at least one of the 4 Forbidden Ones. Hell, by the time of this quest how many pride demons have we killed? and at least one of them, Hybris, was named. And don't even get me started on how we killed the Qunari Arishok after he and his men took control of the entire city. The remnants of one single ship's worth of Qunari, after countless numbers of them had already defected and become Tal-Vashoth were more then enough for Kirkwall's entire guard and army and we took care of them. Hell, by act 3 we are probably the 4th most important person in Kirkwall, after Meridith, Elfina and probably Orsino.

You know, that's why I had to stop playing Skyrim. Like, maybe the game intends for you to do a little bit in all the different major progression quests, a little thief, a little warrior, a little mage, and do them bit by bit in rotating order so you level up in all of them about the same time. But I mostly stuck with the mage quest and became freaking ARCH-MAGE... (and along the way slaughtered countless dragons) but if you go anywhere else, ANYWHERE else, you still get treated like a common peasant. And I'm like... really? Do I *really* have to go through the petty early qualifications when I'm clearly a grandmaster? Why are you people so willing to attack me? I should have SOME recognition and status by now.

[AlucardNoir]

Morrowind was the best in that regard, you couldn't join all factions, you couldn't join some factions if you had joined others or had progressed in others over a certain point. It was great... in that regard. Too bad now we live in a world were "we can't have the player not see every bit of the content we made for them"

Vampire the Masquerade: Bloodlines can be finished in under 24 hours. It's considered one of the best computer games of all times. But take any modern RPG, if it's 40-60 hours it's short, if it's 60-80 like DAII it's still short and if it's 100 to 120 - like DAO and DAI - it's "normal" length. And you as a player have to of course be able to see and experience all 120 hours of it... in your first playthrough. Why yes Bioware/Bethesda/Ubisoft/SquareEnix/EA, I would love to spend 120 hours in your open world sandbox. And what's that Ubisoft? you want me to do it on a yearly basis? why of course, that's never going to get old.

[RobbyB1982]

I'm cool with open world sandboxes as long as they're not full of filler. DAI was loaded with it. Find 15 constalletion making devices. Find 35 skull viewers so you find 180 magic shards. Go find a firepit and establish a camp. Close 200 demon portals. Find an endless and infinite number of plants and rocks.

Just all such huge wastes of time, there purely to fill out the map for what ends up being worthless loot most of the time. And they were on GIANT maps that were giant for no reason except to be giant. They were super pretty and full of variety, but....

I'll accept the closing of demon portals as a needed task, the lead is the only one that has the magic glowing hand, so it actually makes sense for a change that they're out and about in the field, literally ONLY they can do that job. (And it comes up SO often you end up customizing your party around it and EVERY made ends up learning some of the same skills...) But all the other stuff? You command an army. You should really, really be able to just order others to take care of that.

[CharlesPhipps]

Morrowind was the best in that regard, you couldn't join all factions, you couldn't join some factions if you had joined others or had progressed in others over a certain point. It was great... in that regard. Too bad now we live in a world were "we can't have the player not see every bit of the content we made for them"

Honestly, I think that's blaming the developers for the fact you're choosing to roleplay a character who uses their demigod status to do everything. If someone puts a plate of cookies out on the table, it's up to you to decide if you want to eat them all.

Vampire the Masquerade: Bloodlines can be finished in under 24 hours. It's considered one of the best computer games of all times. But take any modern RPG, if it's 40-60 hours it's short, if it's 60-80 like DAII it's still short and if it's 100 to 120 - like DAO and DAI - it's "normal" length.

Sadly, this leads to massive amounts of useless busy work like in Inquisition and Andromeda. I think Witcher 3 is the only one where everything is written well and they pad the length with massive amounts of travel time.

And you as a player have to of course be able to see and experience all 120 hours of it... in your first playthrough. Why yes Bioware/Bethesda/Ubisoft/SquareEnix/EA, I would love to spend 120 hours in your open world sandbox. And what's that Ubisoft? you want me to do it on a yearly basis? why of course, that's never going to get old.

....too much content is not really a criticism, is it?