Should Kathleen Kennedy be let go from the Star Wars megaproject?

For all topics regarding speculative fiction of every stripe. Otherwise known as the Geek Cave.
unknownsample
Officer
Posts: 328
Joined: Sun Jan 14, 2018 1:36 am

Re: Should Kathleen Kennedy be let go from the Star Wars megaproject?

Post by unknownsample »

Slash Gallagher wrote: Fri Jun 15, 2018 7:34 pm
unknownsample wrote: Fri Jun 15, 2018 6:21 pm
Yukaphile wrote: Fri Jun 15, 2018 5:28 pm What's so awful about Lando being bi or something? We need more bi and gay characters!
Well it's implied that he's pansexual, this has caused fans to lose their shit, although since causing Star Wars fans lose their shit all the time this isn't exactly a surprise. When compared with Captain Jack Lando's positively restrained.
Jack who?
I don't think SW fans lose their shit that easily. I just think they had bad franchise ownership since 1977.
Captain Jack Harkness.

As for having bad franchise ownership since 77, that would mean that fans were up in arms about TESB and ROTJ.
User avatar
MithrandirOlorin
Captain
Posts: 753
Joined: Thu Feb 16, 2017 12:06 am
Contact:

Re: Should Kathleen Kennedy be let go from the Star Wars megaproject?

Post by MithrandirOlorin »

unknownsample wrote: Fri Jun 15, 2018 8:12 pm
Slash Gallagher wrote: Fri Jun 15, 2018 7:34 pm
unknownsample wrote: Fri Jun 15, 2018 6:21 pm
Yukaphile wrote: Fri Jun 15, 2018 5:28 pm What's so awful about Lando being bi or something? We need more bi and gay characters!
Well it's implied that he's pansexual, this has caused fans to lose their shit, although since causing Star Wars fans lose their shit all the time this isn't exactly a surprise. When compared with Captain Jack Lando's positively restrained.
Jack who?
I don't think SW fans lose their shit that easily. I just think they had bad franchise ownership since 1977.
Captain Jack Harkness.

As for having bad franchise ownership since 77, that would mean that fans were up in arms about TESB and ROTJ.
Originally they were.
Call me KuudereKun
User avatar
Karha of Honor
Captain
Posts: 3168
Joined: Sat Feb 11, 2017 8:46 pm

Re: Should Kathleen Kennedy be let go from the Star Wars megaproject?

Post by Karha of Honor »

unknownsample wrote: Fri Jun 15, 2018 8:12 pm
Slash Gallagher wrote: Fri Jun 15, 2018 7:34 pm
unknownsample wrote: Fri Jun 15, 2018 6:21 pm
Yukaphile wrote: Fri Jun 15, 2018 5:28 pm What's so awful about Lando being bi or something? We need more bi and gay characters!
Well it's implied that he's pansexual, this has caused fans to lose their shit, although since causing Star Wars fans lose their shit all the time this isn't exactly a surprise. When compared with Captain Jack Lando's positively restrained.
Jack who?
I don't think SW fans lose their shit that easily. I just think they had bad franchise ownership since 1977.
Captain Jack Harkness.

As for having bad franchise ownership since 77, that would mean that fans were up in arms about TESB and ROTJ.
You can have a sports franchise in which the talent covers for the front office for a while.
Image
User avatar
MithrandirOlorin
Captain
Posts: 753
Joined: Thu Feb 16, 2017 12:06 am
Contact:

Re: Should Kathleen Kennedy be let go from the Star Wars megaproject?

Post by MithrandirOlorin »

Slash Gallagher wrote: Sat Jun 16, 2018 3:50 am
unknownsample wrote: Fri Jun 15, 2018 8:12 pm
Slash Gallagher wrote: Fri Jun 15, 2018 7:34 pm
unknownsample wrote: Fri Jun 15, 2018 6:21 pm
Yukaphile wrote: Fri Jun 15, 2018 5:28 pm What's so awful about Lando being bi or something? We need more bi and gay characters!
Well it's implied that he's pansexual, this has caused fans to lose their shit, although since causing Star Wars fans lose their shit all the time this isn't exactly a surprise. When compared with Captain Jack Lando's positively restrained.
Jack who?
I don't think SW fans lose their shit that easily. I just think they had bad franchise ownership since 1977.
Captain Jack Harkness.

As for having bad franchise ownership since 77, that would mean that fans were up in arms about TESB and ROTJ.
You can have a sports franchise in which the talent covers for the front office for a while.
The only real Talent in the OT was Lucas, the acting was crap, and whoever directed Empire had a boring style.
Call me KuudereKun
User avatar
PerrySimm
Captain
Posts: 689
Joined: Mon Feb 20, 2017 2:37 am

Re: Should Irvin Kershner be let go from the Star Wars megasequel?

Post by PerrySimm »

...

...

...

Even if you don't like the result personally, Irvin Kershner's achievements with Empire should at least be respected.

The SFDebris specials were really informative -
The Shadow's Journey
The Empire Strikes Back

Lucas' antics during Empire meant Steven Spielberg wouldn't and couldn't direct Return of the Jedi. Odd that so many years later, Spielberg's business partner was put at the helm of the whole franchise.
UGxlYXNlIHByb3ZpZGUgeW91ciBjaGFsbGVuZ2UgcmVzcG9uc2UgZm9yIFJFRCA5NC4K
MixedDrops
Officer
Posts: 233
Joined: Sat Apr 15, 2017 6:39 am

Re: Should Kathleen Kennedy be let go from the Star Wars megaproject?

Post by MixedDrops »

Madner Kami wrote: Fri Jun 15, 2018 6:11 pm
Yukaphile wrote: Fri Jun 15, 2018 5:28 pm What's so awful about Lando being bi or something? We need more bi and gay characters!
Do you even realize how utterly meaningless this and patronizing this statement is? Why do we need more bi and gay characters? Why does Lando need to have any sexuality at all?
One of the first things Lando does when he shows up in Episode V is make a pass at Leia.

This is a really good example of how being straight is so expected that it's basically invisible, yet you have one or two characters with some other sexuality and all of a sudden the "why do we need x" questions are everywhere. That's without mentioning how it was basically nonexistent in the movie itself anyway.
MyUserName
Officer
Posts: 134
Joined: Wed Mar 28, 2018 6:57 am

Re: Should Kathleen Kennedy be let go from the Star Wars megaproject?

Post by MyUserName »

MixedDrops wrote: Sat Jun 16, 2018 10:52 am
Madner Kami wrote: Fri Jun 15, 2018 6:11 pm
Yukaphile wrote: Fri Jun 15, 2018 5:28 pm What's so awful about Lando being bi or something? We need more bi and gay characters!
Do you even realize how utterly meaningless this and patronizing this statement is? Why do we need more bi and gay characters? Why does Lando need to have any sexuality at all?
One of the first things Lando does when he shows up in Episode V is make a pass at Leia.

This is a really good example of how being straight is so expected that it's basically invisible, yet you have one or two characters with some other sexuality and all of a sudden the "why do we need x" questions are everywhere. That's without mentioning how it was basically nonexistent in the movie itself anyway.
Okay, first of all, we do not need more gay or bi characters. What we need are well written characters with agency in their own arcs, relevance to the overall plot, and a good purpose to the story. We can focus on who is wanting to get jiggy with who or what AFTER the writing team gets it together.

Second, if you cannot see the character contrast between lando and han, his advances fostering hitherto unseen jealousy in the later, and also further defining Leia's definite interest in Han by rebuffing his advances, then... well I honestly don't know what that says.

Third, I've always found that kind of aggressive forcing of diversity to be misguided at best, and at worst... I don't want to be inflammatory so I'll hold off commenting worse case scenarios as to what could be behind that kind attitude. Characters do not need to be les, gay, bi, pan, or straight to be appealing, just well written. Some of my favorite movies and TV shows didn't need a romance to be entertaining.

As for films or tv shows with homosexual themes and characters? Sure. I have the same requirement I have of heterosexual characters. Make the romantic and/or sexual aspects of the story relevant and well written please and thank you.
User avatar
Karha of Honor
Captain
Posts: 3168
Joined: Sat Feb 11, 2017 8:46 pm

Re: Should Kathleen Kennedy be let go from the Star Wars megaproject?

Post by Karha of Honor »

MithrandirOlorin wrote: Sat Jun 16, 2018 4:16 am
Slash Gallagher wrote: Sat Jun 16, 2018 3:50 am
unknownsample wrote: Fri Jun 15, 2018 8:12 pm
Slash Gallagher wrote: Fri Jun 15, 2018 7:34 pm
unknownsample wrote: Fri Jun 15, 2018 6:21 pm
Yukaphile wrote: Fri Jun 15, 2018 5:28 pm What's so awful about Lando being bi or something? We need more bi and gay characters!
Well it's implied that he's pansexual, this has caused fans to lose their shit, although since causing Star Wars fans lose their shit all the time this isn't exactly a surprise. When compared with Captain Jack Lando's positively restrained.
Jack who?
I don't think SW fans lose their shit that easily. I just think they had bad franchise ownership since 1977.
Captain Jack Harkness.

As for having bad franchise ownership since 77, that would mean that fans were up in arms about TESB and ROTJ.
You can have a sports franchise in which the talent covers for the front office for a while.
The only real Talent in the OT was Lucas, the acting was crap, and whoever directed Empire had a boring style.
If the acting was crap why are the characters remebered fondly?

Look at who made SW again. Are you sure Lucas was the only Talent?

It's not like this movie is The Raid.

I like a boring style for Star Wars, i never wanted the best filmamkers to do SW instead of other projects.
Image
unknownsample
Officer
Posts: 328
Joined: Sun Jan 14, 2018 1:36 am

Re: Should Kathleen Kennedy be let go from the Star Wars megaproject?

Post by unknownsample »

MyUserName wrote: Sat Jun 16, 2018 12:46 pm
MixedDrops wrote: Sat Jun 16, 2018 10:52 am
Madner Kami wrote: Fri Jun 15, 2018 6:11 pm
Yukaphile wrote: Fri Jun 15, 2018 5:28 pm What's so awful about Lando being bi or something? We need more bi and gay characters!
Do you even realize how utterly meaningless this and patronizing this statement is? Why do we need more bi and gay characters? Why does Lando need to have any sexuality at all?
One of the first things Lando does when he shows up in Episode V is make a pass at Leia.

This is a really good example of how being straight is so expected that it's basically invisible, yet you have one or two characters with some other sexuality and all of a sudden the "why do we need x" questions are everywhere. That's without mentioning how it was basically nonexistent in the movie itself anyway.
Okay, first of all, we do not need more gay or bi characters. What we need are well written characters with agency in their own arcs, relevance to the overall plot, and a good purpose to the story. We can focus on who is wanting to get jiggy with who or what AFTER the writing team gets it together.

Second, if you cannot see the character contrast between lando and han, his advances fostering hitherto unseen jealousy in the later, and also further defining Leia's definite interest in Han by rebuffing his advances, then... well I honestly don't know what that says.

Third, I've always found that kind of aggressive forcing of diversity to be misguided at best, and at worst... I don't want to be inflammatory so I'll hold off commenting worse case scenarios as to what could be behind that kind attitude. Characters do not need to be les, gay, bi, pan, or straight to be appealing, just well written. Some of my favorite movies and TV shows didn't need a romance to be entertaining.

As for films or tv shows with homosexual themes and characters? Sure. I have the same requirement I have of heterosexual characters. Make the romantic and/or sexual aspects of the story relevant and well written please and thank you.
Yeah except people objected to gay characters full stop in Aftermath.
MixedDrops
Officer
Posts: 233
Joined: Sat Apr 15, 2017 6:39 am

Re: Should Kathleen Kennedy be let go from the Star Wars megaproject?

Post by MixedDrops »

MyUserName wrote: Sat Jun 16, 2018 12:46 pm Okay, first of all, we do not need more gay or bi characters. What we need are well written characters with agency in their own arcs, relevance to the overall plot, and a good purpose to the story. We can focus on who is wanting to get jiggy with who or what AFTER the writing team gets it together.

Second, if you cannot see the character contrast between lando and han, his advances fostering hitherto unseen jealousy in the later, and also further defining Leia's definite interest in Han by rebuffing his advances, then... well I honestly don't know what that says.

Third, I've always found that kind of aggressive forcing of diversity to be misguided at best, and at worst... I don't want to be inflammatory so I'll hold off commenting worse case scenarios as to what could be behind that kind attitude. Characters do not need to be les, gay, bi, pan, or straight to be appealing, just well written. Some of my favorite movies and TV shows didn't need a romance to be entertaining.

As for films or tv shows with homosexual themes and characters? Sure. I have the same requirement I have of heterosexual characters. Make the romantic and/or sexual aspects of the story relevant and well written please and thank you.
1. A character's sexuality has no bearing on any of that. Please explain how Lando being pansexual or whatever sexuality they wanted affected the writing in Solo (it was a mediocre movie yes, but its interesting how people zero in on the sexuality aspect as if that has anything to do with it).

2. And? I was responding to the notion that Lando had no sexuality when literally one of the first acts he does is making advances at a lady. You can say its folded into the story better but that has nothing to do with my point.

3. What is "forcing diversity"? People saying "let's have some gay characters"? If you get your knickers in a twist when people say things like that what does it say about you? "Forced diversity" is basically the media-criticism equivalent of "I'm not a racist but" or NIMBY at this point.

And you're right that not every story needs a romance (and I agree that it's a huge problem in Hollywood movies, straight or otherwise) but it's interesting how so many more people only start making that argument when non-straight romances are involved. Hmm. And again, Lando sexuality affected the Solo film in fuckall capacity, if there's any criticism to be had it's that they wanted to have their cake and eat it too by saying Lando is pansexual when basically nothing in the movie supports or disproves it.
Post Reply