slochmoeller wrote: ↑Sat Jul 14, 2018 10:37 pm
I am sorry if this is the wrong place to ask, but anyone know what happened to return of the jedi? I was looking forward to it, and hope it goes back on the schedule...
Ranchoth wrote: ↑Sun Jul 15, 2018 3:41 am
The one thing I've always wondered about this episode...they were playing up the whole "One as Seven's sort-of child" aspect, right? Okay, fine and good, sure.
But, ah...what about Ensign Mulchaey? The guy who's actual genetic code got snagged to make the drone? He wasn't killed by it—he's at least mentioned in later episodes. But he's, IIRC, never even mentioned in this episode after they drag him unconscious out of the lab.
So does...he have no interest in his surrogate "son" (or "twin brother")? Or any say in it's fate—I mean, in Up the Long Ladder, we've seen Starfleet officers perfectly willing to phaser (possibly) pre-viable clones made by genetic theft. Or does he just get declared an involuntary DNA donor, and told to return to duty and mind his own business?
(Man...what is it with cyborgs from the future opening up ethico-scientific cans of worms?)
He's a goldshirt, who survived the plot device of the week. He's probably just in his quarters thinking about where his life has taken him, as being in that uniform means you have a target on your back.
This is when he had, what alcoholics like to call, a moment of clarity. If he died, he would have only been the DNA harvest of a Borg freak accident. After such a near death experience, he went on to find the air fresher, Neelix's cooking wasn't as bad, and a swing in his step. He now works on his artwork when he's no longer on duty, as that was his dream before joining Starfleet
BlackoutCreature2 wrote: ↑Sun Jul 15, 2018 12:05 amYou'd think they'd have safeguards in place to prevent their video phones from just starting up while one side is in the bathroom. Heck, you actually have to accept the call from the comm badge to get a two way conversation going on it and that's for official business. Why wouldn't the video phones, which mostly seem to be used for personal matters, have a button or voice command on them or something?
I've always assumed they do, and that the Doctor was using his medical access to bypass such restrictions.
The EMH program ignoring such restrictions in pursuit of its own petty agenda is rather disquieting in itself. What other basic ethics is the EMH putting aside?
On the ther hand, why is she that bothered? He is the Doctor, he has probably seen her unclothed many times, and he is an AI program and should not have any lecherous interests in her body.
A managed democracy is a wonderful thing... for the managers... and its greatest strength is a 'free press' when 'free' is defined as 'responsible' and the managers define what is 'irresponsible'.”
― Robert A. Heinlein, The Moon Is a Harsh Mistress
Well I mean the Doctor is not operating in a medical function here, so yes, seeing her naked can be a violation of personal space if that bothers Torres. (I suppose, REALLY tangentially, you can say the mobile emitter is more useful if a medical crisis strikes the ship, but that's why we have Tom, but that's also clearly not his concern)
But really is there a LOT of point to treating the scene as anything more than what it is; a giggling 12 year old's beta test of the decon chamber in Enterprise?
Although it is slightly amusing to imagine Zimmerman basing the EMH's medical ethics on a memoir by this crazy lauded doctor Phlox fellow.
SuccubusYuri wrote: ↑Sun Jul 15, 2018 8:04 pmAlthough it is slightly amusing to imagine Zimmerman basing the EMH's medical ethics on a memoir by this crazy lauded doctor Phlox fellow.
NOTE TO SELF:
"Hmm, I need a good reason to have people on this ship take off their clothes and rub oil on each other's bodies at regular intervals. What bullshit pretense can I come up with for that...ooh, I'll tell them it's a 'decontamination procedure,' that's good. In a little private room with a hidden camera. Good idea."
I've always loved this episode. Seven is good for observations on humanity and deflating others' excess egos at times, and the often rigid persona works well for her too. Her typical reactions are also great for her interactions with the doctor. Still, the fact that's the norm makes it all the more of a treat when Jeri Ryan gets to give a performance where she cares about someone (other than Chakotay, an idea that was ham-fisted and awful) and shows vulnerability.
It is a shame some people can't get past the catsuit. Regardless of what she's wearing, she is a talented actor. As a gay guy, the catsuit does nothing for me, other than show her body was bangin, and as long as she didn't mind wearing it, then I'm not going to dwell on it even if it was another in a long line of absurd wardrobe choices for Trek for all genders and species. At least, unlike Troi, the character was allowed to have brains regardless of the outfit. T'Pol's catsuit bothered me more. A logical Vulcan wear that, without any apparent reason to? Uh huh.
Also, was Janeway actually pretty reasonable and compassionate throughout this episode? If so, how the heck did the writers' manage that? Ah, a story not conceived of by the more usual writers; that explains it.
"The power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism by those who have not got it." George Bernard Shaw
SuccubusYuri wrote: ↑Sun Jul 15, 2018 8:04 pm
Although it is slightly amusing to imagine Zimmerman basing the EMH's medical ethics on a memoir by this crazy lauded doctor Phlox fellow.
The Doctor also publicly announced to a reception that Reg Barclay had in the past suffered from Holo-addiction and Transporter Phobia. In another thread I speculated that by the 24th century they had done away with our primitive 21st century notions of medical confidentiality. The turning on Torres camera without warning could be another example of this. So it seems like it is specifically privacy he might be the most divergent views from most current views...
Yours Truly,
Allan Olley
"It is with philosophy as with religion : men marvel at the absurdity of other people's tenets, while exactly parallel absurdities remain in their own." John Stuart Mill
It's easy to turn an overpowered character into a Mary Sue, but they struck the right balance in this case. One makes mistakes and is not universally celebrated.
Sure, you can see all the blocks the episode is built out of - Chekov's Nebula, Deus Ex Machina, a bit of 'The life lived half as long burns twice as bright' - but ultimately it's a character piece for Seven that *works*, and, so rarely for Voyager, manages to surprise and leave the viewer with open questions. It even manages to get The Borg more or less right, maybe the only episode made after First Contact that even comes close to their original portrayal.
Is "Drone" worth a 9? Well, at the time this aired the "reset button" nature of the episode was more apparent in comparison to what DS9 was doing, and as such Voyager could do no right. But taking a fresh view of how this story fits with the characters and the meaning each take away from this episode - it's harder to disagree.
PerrySimm wrote: ↑Mon Jul 16, 2018 4:11 am
Is "Drone" worth a 9? Well, at the time this aired the "reset button" nature of the episode was more apparent in comparison to what DS9 was doing, and as such Voyager could do no right. But taking a fresh view of how this story fits with the characters and the meaning each take away from this episode - it's harder to disagree.
I honestly think this is a good reset button, as rare as those are. Because we start the episode with Seven trying to break out of her comfort zone, but it is honest to the character that the experience stifles her exploration of those socialization aspects. There isn't exactly character growth, and not exactly regression. It's just sad, but in a very pretty way.
