Chuck's thoughts on KOTOR 2, review, & Kreia?

[CharlesPhipps]

I love the people who sincerely believe the Sith are about freedom despite the fact it supports slavery and fascism.

Also, the Sith are "more relatable" because they have "emotion."

[Beastro]

Those Sith guys got the right idea about Freedom!

I mean that Bane is the best example, Murdered EVERYBODY else so he'd be right by default then immediately went back on his own philosophy... Its very human and relatable.

That isn't human, that is Satanic in it's obsession for restraintless freedom and to destroy anything that gets in ones way of attaining it.

Do you not realize the essence behind "It is better to rule in Hell than serve in Heaven?"

[Wargriffin]

Those Sith guys got the right idea about Freedom!

I mean that Bane is the best example, Murdered EVERYBODY else so he'd be right by default then immediately went back on his own philosophy... Its very human and relatable.

That isn't human, that is Satanic in it's obsession for restraintless freedom and to destroy anything that gets in ones way of attaining it.

Do you not realize the essence behind "It is better to rule in Hell than serve in Heaven?"

The Sith only have one real rule... "In the End... There can be only one"

[Beastro]

Those Sith guys got the right idea about Freedom!

I mean that Bane is the best example, Murdered EVERYBODY else so he'd be right by default then immediately went back on his own philosophy... Its very human and relatable.

That isn't human, that is Satanic in it's obsession for restraintless freedom and to destroy anything that gets in ones way of attaining it.

Do you not realize the essence behind "It is better to rule in Hell than serve in Heaven?"

The Sith only have one real rule... "In the End... There can be only one"

Like I said, Satanic.

[Wargriffin]

Those Sith guys got the right idea about Freedom!

I mean that Bane is the best example, Murdered EVERYBODY else so he'd be right by default then immediately went back on his own philosophy... Its very human and relatable.

That isn't human, that is Satanic in it's obsession for restraintless freedom and to destroy anything that gets in ones way of attaining it.

Do you not realize the essence behind "It is better to rule in Hell than serve in Heaven?"

The Sith only have one real rule... "In the End... There can be only one"

Like I said, Satanic.

Well Palpy is pretty much the Devil

[Madner Kami]

Just stumbled upon this video and it feels relevant: Kreia's Conundrums - Charity. It definitly needs more views.

[Ikiry0]

I really wish the game gave you more chances to actually argue with Kreia, rather than her preaching at you and not being able to philosophy back. Which is really what, personally, got me bitter with KOTOR 2 and makes me generally not rank it very highly. If you're going to have a character trying to test your philosophy, they really needed more room to make informed arguments back instead of some very basic stuff on your end while get gets entire diatribes.

[Yukaphile]

Well, the Jedi sure don't care about freedom, do they? They have no business regulating what goes on in a Jedi's bedroom. But oh, they don't think, they know what is best for everyone. Despite admitting they have very little idea as to the true nature of the Force and the universe than we do. So they strike me as very holier-than-thou and uptight. That's really what gets to me. Recruiting infants straight from the womb into a lifetime of painful public service they have no say in, no decision on whether or not that's what they wanna do. Hey, aren't the Jedi super hard-line on how our choices determine what we are? Yoda is all, "Make someone fall to the dark side, one cannot! Chose this, Skywalker did!" Then they don't give potential Jedi a choice at all. Bwahahahahaha. Their reason is they think the dark side will have a stronger hold on them at a later age, but really, this is just because younger children are easier to socially condition to think like you do. Children are too inexperienced and innocent to muster up a sophisticated argument to challenge what you say. And the Sith may preach freedom, but they are chained to the dark side just as much as the Jedi are to the light. But in a universe of constant conflict, are they not the more logical choice? Conflict can be inherently revealing and bring out people's true natures, and not all Sith we've seen were mindless sadists. They can be just as varied as everyone else. Look at Darth Bane, who had a kind of twisted code of honor. Very unusual for a Sith Lord.

Look, let me get down to brass tacks. The very concept of... taking a baby to raise in the Jedi Order, and then have rules set in place, and then preach freedom of choice... it strikes me as kidnapping babies so they can tell them not to have sex, to the point you can be expelled from the order for it, in other words, being a massive hypocrite. Well, what if the Jedi wants both? They don't want to be forced to choose between leaving the order and giving up a loving attachment. The Jedi are just so obsessed with what happens in the next world, they don't care about this one. They really don't care about the wants and needs of their members. It really is the Council and their teachers telling them what they want, just like Palpatine said. I know, this is just my emotional side speaking, but that's very disturbing. The Jedi, on the whole, strike me as very anti-sex in the way a lot of religious conservatives are, and that's not a good way to represent the heroes of the story.

Also, from earlier in the thread, comparing a Jedi falling in love to a professor taking advantage of a student is just wrong. Animala said it best, they train Jedi from infancy because it's the easy path, which Yoda says is wrong, that's what the dark side is... so again it just paints them as enormous hypocrites. They are not professors, they are mortal beings who have needs like everyone else. And to ignore that is to ignore what it means to be human or whatever else. Also, we see how newborn Jedi are drafted in Jedi Apprentice. The parents often make the call. Not even orphans or refugees or unwanted children. Literally the parents can decide something so huge for a kid. I know there's the whole angle of how Jedi should be raised among Jedi so the dark side doesn't influence them, something supported by the Jedi Academy trilogy, but... no, I don't buy it. Luke and Leia were raised without a Jedi influence and they turned out fine. All Luke did was separate Leia, a new mother, from her children for two years. TWO YEARS. Out of paranoid fear of the dark side. This is something he got straight from the teachings of the old Jedi Order with a preserved holocron. Can you imagine how painful that was for Leia? All because Luke was impressionable enough to believe the Jedi of old had ways that were the best for newly born Force-sensitive children. I think it's important for Jedi to focus on being human before being Jedi. That's important. My feeling is they need to work on developing strong character, which you can do outside the oh so hallowed halls of the Jedi Temple, and if that includes a romantic attachment, that is nobody's business!

[CharlesPhipps]

The Jedi have every right to regulate what goes on in their organization. If you don't like it, you don't have to be a Jedi.

But no, apparently, Anakin wants to have his cake and eat it to.

Except his cake is a Senator.

[TrueMetis]

There is the argument that they've been indoctrinated and therefore that they can leave is something of a false choice. Though that's not a opinion I hold since we see several who did or contemplated leaving the order, and I find it highly likely that a lot of those who didn't get chosen to become a Padawan left rather than join the argicorps. And, and this is the most important, we see little of how young Jedi are taught and what little we see is entirely benign.