Trek versus Evolution

[CharlesPhipps]

Star Trek Species should be able to hybridize, though. Because they're metaphors for interracial relationships and acceptance. NOT actually about aliens.

Also, Spock as a half-Vulcan is kind of a central premise.

[TrueMetis]

Sure, and up until they tried to explain it I really didn't give a shit. Once you try to give something an explanation though, you'd better be damn sure it checks out.

[CharlesPhipps]

You have me there.

[Artabax]

Evolution and Star Trek have a lot of if's and's and but's.

The whole "Klingons, Cardassians, Humans, and so on are all related" was blasted by some people for supporting intelligent design but it was the usual case of idiot-savants on the internet trying to read the forest for the trees. It wasn't making a political statement, it was to try to satisfy fans who wondered why the hell everyone was a humanoid that looked basically human. The DEEP THOUGHTS OF THE SHOW that people read into it being contrasted with its effect as a television series' internal logic.

A explanation that is completely unneeded by anyone who really understands evolution, because while the aliens in trek may have a superficially similar outside their insides are so drastically differnt on the inside from us and each other (IE Vulcans with copper based blood and Klingons with many redundant completely different organs [8 chambered hearts!]) that anyone who has a good grasp of evolutionary theory would be able to quickly tell you that we clearly aren't related.

Of course they also make it so that, despite vastly different internal chemistry and structure, these species are perfectly capable of hybridizing. Something that makes no goddamn sense and isn't helped by the ancient aliens thing because again these guys are so incredibly different internally there's no fucking way they can be related, let alone closely related enough to mate. By Star Trek logic you should be able to fuck a horseshoe crab and have kids.

I also point out the whole "Sky People" thing wasn't really on Star Trek except for the fact they got taken in by a con man. Jamake Highwater is one of the worst people in the world as he was a "professional fake Native." He sold himself as an expert on Native American culture when he was a white guy pretending to be various tribes. He served constant streams of warmed over stereotypes and racism to whatever white people would believe it despite actual Native Americans repeatedly pointing out he was a huckster.

Guess who Voyager hired as an expert?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jamake_Highwater

So we can blame the Sky People on him.

No, I'll still blame trek for not properly vetting their expert.

This statement has a lot of problems even if it's arguing from a reasonable position since a lot of what we know about the universe beyond Earth is because, "math says they should."

Pretty much all of theoretical physics.

Right, but just because the maths backs up say string theory for example doesn't mean you can just insert string theory as the explanation for why oranges are orange.

The Maths say aliens probably exist, that doesn't make aliens a useful or reasonable explanation for anything.

I'd argue gods are the functional god of modern day but that's because the science of the universe is as weird as the faith. Mind you, the thing about Occam's Razor is it only works with matters you already understand. Occam's Razor indicates, for example, the sun rotates around the Earth and there's not billions of galaxies.

You need to know the facts in order to make a broad statement of simplicity.

That's not really how Occam's Razor works, because simple when using Occam's Razor isn't the easiest explanation but the one with the fewest assumptions. And Geocentrism had and has some really big assumptions about what force would cause everything to orbit the earth, why planets go retrograde, and how big the universe is.

So no, Occam's Razor 100% is on the earth orbits the sun side of thing, because it doesn't require nearly as many assumptions like those of perfectly circular orbits, epicycles, the equant, or whatever the fuck causes the sun to orbit the earth in the first place.

Occam's Razor: entities should not be needlessly multiplied.

If all we knew was Earth, Sun and Moon, then Geocentricism with perfectly spherical orbits would be the simplest explanation.
If all we knew was Earth, Sun and Moon, and their accurate positions in the Sky over time, then Geocentricism with elliptical orbits would be a simpler solution than perfectly spherical orbits with many epicycles tacked on.

But Humans have been measuring the positions of the Planets since 4k BC, so Heliocentrism is WAY simpler than infinite epicycles.

[CharlesPhipps]

I guess my point is Occam's Razor is not meant to encapsulate the scientific process but is folk wisdom that has gotten expanded to a much larger position than it should be.

The simplest explanation is, if you're tired, you're probably overworked.

But, sometimes, it is cancer.

[Robovski]

Yeah, in a world with intelligences with their own motivations the simplest answer is not always the right answer.

[Riedquat]

I guess my point is Occam's Razor is not meant to encapsulate the scientific process but is folk wisdom that has gotten expanded to a much larger position than it should be.

The simplest explanation is, if you're tired, you're probably overworked.

But, sometimes, it is cancer.

That's not inconsistent with Occam's Razor; it doesn't claim to provide proof, and it doesn't say "stop gathering facts."

[CharlesPhipps]

I guess my point is Occam's Razor is not meant to encapsulate the scientific process but is folk wisdom that has gotten expanded to a much larger position than it should be.

The simplest explanation is, if you're tired, you're probably overworked.

But, sometimes, it is cancer.

That's not inconsistent with Occam's Razor; it doesn't claim to provide proof, and it doesn't say "stop gathering facts."

That seems to add a lot to Occam's Razor which is about NOT thinking it critically.

It means a problem is probably not complex.

Occam's Razor: You find a dog dead in the road.

Answer: It was hit by a car.

[Mindworm]

and again, some scientists are seriously considering aliens meddled with our DNA in the past. basically, we don't know for sure but based on some weird stuff found in our DNA, "aliens did it" is currently the best explanation.

I'm guessing that your "scientific source" was a fella who took one look at Viiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiir Cotto's hairdo and said, "I like the look of that".

[Dragon Ball Fan]

no, it was a video unrelated to that guy.

and I've seen other videos on other topics that suggest aliens may have been involved with early life developing on Earth. like the Cambrian Life Explosion that, by geological standards, happened over night.