Doctor Who: Utopia, Sound of Drums and Last of the Timelords

[Sir Will]

Well, I'll be checking out the 13th Doctor for completion's sake. It can't be any worse than the First Doctor watching Roman Emperor Nero chasing Barbara down about to rape her and commenting happily on what a healthy libido said emperor has. YES THAT HAPPENED.

O_O

[FaxModem1]

Well, I'll be checking out the 13th Doctor for completion's sake. It can't be any worse than the First Doctor watching Roman Emperor Nero chasing Barbara down about to rape her and commenting happily on what a healthy libido said emperor has. YES THAT HAPPENED.

Well, there's a slight difference in that the First Doctor was more of a anti-villain, as Barbara and Ian were the real heroes at the start, who slowly morphed over time into the hero, and that it was the 1960s, and their racism(remember the comments he used to make on the show?) and sexism was on open display. They were progressive in some respects(Barbara was a bit of a badass), but the show was definitely a show of its time.

[FlynnTaggart]

I'll have to be honest, it's stuff like this that didn't make me want to pick up Doctor Who again. Is Jodie Whitaker's Doctor a really good Doctor, and brings the character back to sanity? I don't know, but I'm not sure I want to go through it to find out.

Why?

Because of Capaldi. The reason I gave up on Doctor Who? Capaldi's doctor being so sociopathic and apathetic about people dying. It took me out of giving a crap about him, as he didn't seem to care about who died. What with Killing the Moon advocating millions if not billions dying so a space chicken can live, Last Christmas having him abandon people once he gets bored of the dream lobsters, and only saving their lives because his life was on the line as well. His line about saying a few words about the top layer if they want to mourn their dead friend in "Into the Dalek". It seemed as if the Doctor just became this asshole who was bored, and would only do things if they interested him, not if it would save lives. Etc...

Then came his utter disregard for anyone serving to protect their country....

So I have no idea if the 13th Doctor is good or not, but in order to experience her, I'd have to experience the sociopath who doesn't give a shit about humans, and I'm not sure I want to subject myself to that again.

More or less why I stopped watching too. Sometimes it seemed like the Doctor was ineffectual like with the space chicken while other times he was just totally callous. Also didn't help he sometimes felt like the co-star to Clara who I came to find insufferable. Plus his run felt very boring alot, with interesting stuff like Missy or his dynamic with Danny getting tossed out or not having a good payoff. I did like Missy but I think that was more because the actress absolutely killed it.

I think Capaldi did a good job too but he just didn't have much to work with, when he had some good scenes he did great but most of the time he didn't have anything to sink his teeth into.

[FaxModem1]

More or less why I stopped watching too. Sometimes it seemed like the Doctor was ineffectual like with the space chicken while other times he was just totally callous. Also didn't help he sometimes felt like the co-star to Clara who I came to find insufferable. Plus his run felt very boring alot, with interesting stuff like Missy or his dynamic with Danny getting tossed out or not having a good payoff. I did like Missy but I think that was more because the actress absolutely killed it.

I think Capaldi did a good job too but he just didn't have much to work with, when he had some good scenes he did great but most of the time he didn't have anything to sink his teeth into.

Yeah, Capaldi is a capable actor. I just found the 13th actor such a monster that I couldn't stomach watching him. That's more on Moffat than on Capaldi.

[ninjadeadbeard]

Never thought I'd say this.

Shut up Chuck. You ACTUALLY don't know what you're talking about on this one.

[Robovski]

Never thought I'd say this.

Shut up Chuck. You ACTUALLY don't know what you're talking about on this one.

Please elaborate! I'm not saying I will agree with you but I am curious as to why you feel this way.

[Sir Will]

I thought Capaldi's run got better over time. There were gems throughout but I didn't care for jerk Doctor either and a couple episodes of season 8 are just horrible (the moon, the forest). Season 9 was better but still some issues. And it ended in just the worst way, ruining several plot lines. Season 10 was pretty good. I liked Bill. The end of the finale was a tad weak imo, but overall it was an enjoyable 2 parter.

Never thought I'd say this.

Shut up Chuck. You ACTUALLY don't know what you're talking about on this one.

Huh?

[BlackoutCreature2]

It's been awhile since I watched these episodes, but I completely forgot that the American President, who I remember being written as a pretty blatant George W. Bush expy, sounded like some weird mixture of Wallace Shawn and Robert Stack. Is that what British people think Americans sound like? The same way Americans think all British people sound like Alfred from Batman?

[FlynnTaggart]

On the "Doctor is a chick" thing personally I never really had a problem with it intellectually but I could understand why some did. Doctor Who was always a dude, changing it might feel wrong just as changing any long standing character might get some pushback especially such a massive change as gender. Of course with the Doctor being an alien who regularly changes faces its slightly different then if they suddenly made Clark Kent a woman (Clair Kent maybe?).

Could also help explain away a minor concern I had with Doc changing gender, transgenderism. From my understanding being transgender can be hellish, being trapped in a body that completely feels wrong, the plumbing incorrect. And those people are born that way, have time to adjust. The Doctor has been a guy for 10bajillion years or whatever, I'm not sure what his age is anymore, living as a guy romantically and having a family and all that. Then suddenly he's a woman. Thinking of all his regular post regeneration shenanigans while he grapples with wearing some new face and body I would think would be highly amplified by changing gender.

It however seems like each incarnation of the Doctor is in some ways a different person. Same memories but different personality and all, while 1 through 12 were guys 13 can be a lady without some mental breakdown, well beyond the usual post regeneration stuff (did any of that even happen with the most recent regeneration?).

Personally I was always more worried about the caliber of the writing rather then the angel of the Doc's dangle or lack of. Capaldi just didn't get a fair shot writing wise. It felt tired, it felt boring, and yes sometimes too political. I don't care which side of the aisle they were going for, I just really didn't want to have modern day politics that there is WAYYYYYYY too much of in the real world in a show about rhyming space rhinos, evil tea serving robot dudes armed with whisks and plungers (the most dastardly of instruments), and multiple instances of planetary annihilation (its a kids show!) Escapism is not a bad thing. And from what I heard its not gotten any better in that regard.

Heard Jodie Whittaker is great as the Doctor but like Capaldi before her just hasn't had the best writing to work with. What really sucks because if she fails dumbass tv execs might wind up blaming her gender and bar any one who doesn't fit the Tennant/Smith mold in the future, sucking both because its not the actress's fault for terrible writing and might lock out other fantastic actors and actresses from the part because they don't appeal to the "Doctor as a boyfriend" demographic.

[jadenova]

I agree, 13's series has the ultimate crime of being boring.

Nail on the head. I could just barely make it through that first episode.