clearspira wrote: ↑Sun Feb 10, 2019 12:25 amThis is a sixteen year old German boy named Hans-Georg Hanke upon his capture by the Americans during the fall of Berlin; collapsing against a wall whilst crying in fear. This lad was given a gun, a uniform, and told to go off and die whilst murdering as many people as he could. Can you imagine that? Being sixteen and being faced with that? At a time when the rest of us were playing football and thinking about the school prom he was contemplating getting gunned down in a pool of his own blood.
This is the photo I always point people to who have problems believing that Germans were people too.
Tell me what we should make of the boy when he guns down a pregnant Russian woman, Romani children, and Jewish old men.
20 million Slavs.
How much older do you think the soldiers doing that were?
He's not a monster.
He's a man.
But do you believe he wouldn't have? I do....because he's a man and the regime that he fought for sent millions of children like him to kill and rape and torture.
Which they did.
It can never be allowed to happen again. Which means we can never let the Nazis be anything other than evil to the core. There was nothing heroic, justified, or good in them.
Saying the Soviets did the same just means they were bad too. It doesn't justify any of the crimes done as that's just an infinite loop.
Why do we go so hard-line against Nazi Germany? Because it's what our cultural perceptions have taught us, our elders, and what we see in our current world, but I think a lot of it is overblown or exaggerated. Even if you added all these cases together, I don't think they can equal tens of millions of people. They are being misrepresented.
Last edited by Yukaphile on Sun Feb 10, 2019 12:32 am, edited 1 time in total.
"A culture's teachings - and more importantly, the nature of its people - achieve definition in conflict. They find themselves, or find themselves lacking."
— Kreia, Knights of the Old Republic 2: The Sith Lords
Yukaphile wrote: ↑Sun Feb 10, 2019 12:31 am
Why do we go so hard-line against Nazi Germany? Because it's what our cultural perceptions have taught us, our elders, and what we see in our current world, but I think a lot of it is overblown or exaggerated. Even if you added all these cases together, I don't think they can equal tens of millions of people.
No, because they were that bad.
You are now engaging in Nazi apologia and I am going to stop talking as it is terrible and bad history.
If you can cast judgment on 40,000,000 and 80,000,000 people, then that just makes you the very evil you claim to hate. Willing to judge other groups so incomprehensibly large you can't even fathom them over things YOU are not qualified to judge.
"A culture's teachings - and more importantly, the nature of its people - achieve definition in conflict. They find themselves, or find themselves lacking."
— Kreia, Knights of the Old Republic 2: The Sith Lords
Yukaphile wrote: ↑Sun Feb 10, 2019 12:31 am
Why do we go so hard-line against Nazi Germany? Because it's what our cultural perceptions have taught us, our elders, and what we see in our current world, but I think a lot of it is overblown or exaggerated.
How am I making excuses for the mass murder, in often obscene ways? I'm not. That was state abuse, though. To demonize innocent civilians is just WRONG, however. Always is, always will be.
"A culture's teachings - and more importantly, the nature of its people - achieve definition in conflict. They find themselves, or find themselves lacking."
— Kreia, Knights of the Old Republic 2: The Sith Lords
I mean, it's not just that. There's so much propaganda from that time period, from both the Nazis and the Soviets and even us, I'm amazed anyone can pierce out the truth among the mass of mud that's the blatant falsehoods and web of lies.
"A culture's teachings - and more importantly, the nature of its people - achieve definition in conflict. They find themselves, or find themselves lacking."
— Kreia, Knights of the Old Republic 2: The Sith Lords
Yukaphile wrote: ↑Sun Feb 10, 2019 12:35 am
How am I making excuses for the mass murder, in often obscene ways? I'm not. That was state abuse, though. To demonize innocent civilians is just WRONG, however. Always is, always will be.
You're saying it wasn't as bad as it was. When it was that bad.
All of this has been verified and is true.
Every time you say its Soviet or American propaganda, you're engaging in Nazi propaganda because there's no need to make up stories. We have the evidence.
Edit:
I recommend you watch this movie which talks about the attempt to cover up the actual extent of atrocities by historians.
You're claiming literally 80,000,000 people were bad. And I'm the bad guy here?
Yes. Stories from maybe hundreds or thousands of people. But does that equal up to tens of millions of people? And no, I'm also not a Nazi apologist because A) I don't deny the Holocaust and B) I don't think the Nazis were right and C) I don't believe in a huge Jewish conspiracy.
"A culture's teachings - and more importantly, the nature of its people - achieve definition in conflict. They find themselves, or find themselves lacking."
— Kreia, Knights of the Old Republic 2: The Sith Lords
clearspira wrote: ↑Sun Feb 10, 2019 12:25 amThis is a sixteen year old German boy named Hans-Georg Hanke upon his capture by the Americans during the fall of Berlin; collapsing against a wall whilst crying in fear. This lad was given a gun, a uniform, and told to go off and die whilst murdering as many people as he could. Can you imagine that? Being sixteen and being faced with that? At a time when the rest of us were playing football and thinking about the school prom he was contemplating getting gunned down in a pool of his own blood.
This is the photo I always point people to who have problems believing that Germans were people too.
Tell me what we should make of the boy when he guns down a pregnant Russian woman, Romani children, and Jewish old men.
20 million Slavs.
How much older do you think the soldiers doing that were?
He's not a monster.
He's a man.
But do you believe he wouldn't have? I do....because he's a man and the regime that he fought for sent millions of children like him to kill and rape and torture.
Which they did.
It can never be allowed to happen again. Which means we can never let the Nazis be anything other than evil to the core. There was nothing heroic, justified, or good in them.
That's just it though, HE IS NOT A MAN. He is a boy. A boy forced into service. You've got some balls to look at a crying boy and start insinuating that he murdered pregnant women. Real asshole actually.
