Democrat Immigration Hypocrisy

[Antiboyscout]

What benefit do they provide that offsets the wage suppression and cultural conflict?

(Mexicans are the worst for this. Because Mexico is right next to the US, mexicans don't sacrifice much coming over and are not isolated from their old home. Both inhibit assimilation.)

Before I answer, may I ask what you consider to be the cultural conflict?

Loyalty to another country and political culture in mexico is filled with strongman machismo politics with an unhealthy dose of socialism. This is actively detrimental to US politics.

[BridgeConsoleMasher]

Political culture of Mexico, I'm not the most familiar with.

[Fuzzy Necromancer]

Ah, tuburculosis. So you're falling back on the "dirty immigrants with their filthy foreign diseases" argument?

G-Man, I posit a counter-point. You, yourself, don't really give two squirrel farts whether it's a crime or not. This isn't about "breaking the law", this isn't about judicial rulings or legal precident. You want to keep immigrants out or lock them up, period. You'd want the same thing even if the immigration was 100% approved and the US had an open border policy. Legality, in and of itself, is not morality, so stop hiding behind it.

[G-Man]

There's a reason why typhus and tuberculosis are making a comeback.

Beyond draconian health care costs and increasing polarization of income with reduced mobility between the poor middle class and wealthy of those already here that is. Don't blame the illegals for this, they are no more responsible than those already here in the USA in this regard.

I agree we should detain those overstaying their visa, and asylum seekers crossing through whole other countries to enter the US should be applying from one of those countries they passed through (and perhaps applying with those countries).

You do not think that us letting in so many poverty-stricken people from south of the border is part of the reason why we have such increasing inequality? When factoring in cost-of-living, California has the highest poverty rate of any state.

https://www.politifact.com/california/s ... ty-rate-w/

[Fuzzy Necromancer]

Kinda think the massive inequality might be related to the uber-rich writing the laws and anything of public benefit that threatens private interests being shut down to line the pockets of shareholders.

[G-Man]

Ah, tuburculosis. So you're falling back on the "dirty immigrants with their filthy foreign diseases" argument?

G-Man, I posit a counter-point. You, yourself, don't really give two squirrel farts whether it's a crime or not. This isn't about "breaking the law", this isn't about judicial rulings or legal precedent. You want to keep immigrants out or lock them up, period. You'd want the same thing even if the immigration was 100% approved and the US had an open border policy. Legality, in and of itself, is not morality, so stop hiding behind it.

I believe that we ought to have an immigration policy that is focused on the needs of American citizens, and on whether or not the people we are letting immigrate are going to have a desired or undesired effect on our economy, culture, politics, etc. As long as we have birthright citizenship, this also means we need to consider temporary visas in terms of their possible use as a way to obtain citizenship for one's children.

Given that, we do need to have strict penalties for illegal entry, overstaying visas, and for employers etc. who aid and abet illegal immigration. That is because illegal immigrants essentially undermine the goals of the legal system, by getting people in here that we have determined are not in the countries' best interest to have in here.

I brought up the issue of breaking the law because Draco Dracul said:

hard working people who have broken no law and committed no crime should be given a path to permanent residency or even citizenship are not incompatible ideas.

Illegal aliens have by definition broken the law, whether they have committed a crime or not, so that is sort of a misleading statement. And a large number of them have committed identity-related crimes.

But no, I have never claimed that I am only interested in stopping illegal immigration. I want our legal immigration system to serve the needs of the United States citizenry.

[G-Man]

Kinda think the massive inequality might be related to the uber-rich writing the laws and anything of public benefit that threatens private interests being shut down to line the pockets of shareholders.

If that is the major reason, why is the highest level of inequality in one of the most heavily Democratic controlled states with the highest top marginal tax rate?

Do you honestly think that importing millions upon millions of poor people from Central America is not a factor?

And why, or why, do so many of the uber-rich, including those hated Koch brothers (in fact, almost all of the major Republican donors), constantly agitate for more immigration if mass immigration does not help line their pockets?

[BridgeConsoleMasher]

Kinda think the massive inequality might be related to the uber-rich writing the laws and anything of public benefit that threatens private interests being shut down to line the pockets of shareholders.

If that is the major reason, why is the highest level of inequality in one of the most heavily Democratic controlled states with the highest top marginal tax rate?

Do you honestly think that importing millions upon millions of poor people from Central America is not a factor?

And why, or why, do so many of the uber-rich, including those hated Koch brothers (in fact, almost all of the major Republican donors), constantly agitate for more immigration if mass immigration does not help line their pockets?

Democrats in areas with inequality is a huge correlation and causation fallacy. Unless you're specifically in the south, major metropolitan areas and their states tend to have large populations in the first place. That alone accounts for inevitable inequality with a stretched out bell curve at both ends for wealth. Then there's also the fact that these areas tend to be more diverse given that they often had influxes of migration even if from within the country. There's plenty of room for conservative outlooks within minority groups, but when you're talking about social issues that directly apply to one group opposite another you're going to gravitate towards Democratic voter blocks.

I've heard arguments both ways about immigration and economic welfare. It's hardly a one way street for consideration.

[Fuzzy Necromancer]

But no, I have never claimed that I am only interested in stopping illegal immigration. I want our legal immigration system to serve the needs of the United States citizenry.

Then stop hiding behind the pretense of legality. Own your arguments.