The Orville

[MixedDrops]

I think the fact that this latest episode was written by Joe Menosky (and directed by Frakes) is probably a contributing factor to its quality. I think MacFarlane himself has written more than half of the episodes of the show at this point, and honestly he misses way more than hits for me- I'll give him A for effort, he's clearly enthusiastic about the project, but I think his inexperience with more dramatic writing is really showing. I think he should try co-writing a bit.

Also while the future of the series is a bit unclear at this point, they did already get tax credits from the CFC for a potential third season, so I wouldn't get too down just yet.

[BunBun299]

Taking into account this latest episode I have to say that the Orville will most likely be canceled. The first season was shown out of order and has some massive plot holes and logical inconsistencies. This second season has seen incredible qualitative improvements, mostly in the writing department. If the episode that started this whole Moklan ark was so-so, with the idiotic idea of presenting females from other species as example for why not to have the sex change, this episode upped the anti and was incredibly well written by comparisons. Unfortunately this is not a Star Trek TNG episode. It's incredibly well written for this show, but it's problematic - and I don't mean in a SJW way. Take for example the ending discussion at the Council - that was bad, while they succeed in making a Dolly Parton lyric work, and work incredibly well earlier in the show, the fact that Mercer would be allowed to say what he did in such a public place, the fact that the proposed solution would just be utter in a public siting or the council and not during a private meeting.That's not how democracy works. And it's sad because this latest episode was probably the strongest episode the show has had thus far.

Now, as to way I think this will be canceled... well, it's good, and it's only gotten better, but it's still not Star Trek The Next Generation. As much maligned as Early TNG might be, by this time in TNG we had already seen Elementary dear Data and Measure of a Man. This is the closest the Orville has gotten to that TNG goodness thus far, a "politically correct" episode that will be more or less universally loved, but one that is deeply flawed. Letting us with many unanswered questions that are right on the verse of becoming plot holes. The rating have been going down, the quality still hasn't hit that peek TNG highly intellectual progressives and positivism that it's going for, and FOX airing it in a manner that clearly indicates they have to faith in this. Unless McFarlane has something that is at the same level as Measure of a Man, Inner Light, Darmok, Yestarday's Enterpise or the like, something to really get the TNG fans fired up, something to make even the jaded, STD loving journalists sing praises to this show, it's going to get caned, probably at the end of this season.

Uh, did you just miss the 2 parter Identity? The two parter nearly everyone who saw it compared it to The Best of Both Worlds. Those episodes are right up there with the best of TNG & DS9. And many, people I saw had online had the same comment I did, that it had the best space battle since Sacrifice of Angels. Identity was way better than anything in the first 2 seasons of TNG.

It is very unlikely this show will be canceled. They've got toys and comic books for it on the way. They are not going to make such things for a show they plan to cancel. And MacFarlane has a long history with Fox. Unless the numbers on this show were absolutely abysmal, they would not cancel his passion project on him.

[AlucardNoir]

Taking into account this latest episode I have to say that the Orville will most likely be canceled. The first season was shown out of order and has some massive plot holes and logical inconsistencies. This second season has seen incredible qualitative improvements, mostly in the writing department. If the episode that started this whole Moklan ark was so-so, with the idiotic idea of presenting females from other species as example for why not to have the sex change, this episode upped the anti and was incredibly well written by comparisons. Unfortunately this is not a Star Trek TNG episode. It's incredibly well written for this show, but it's problematic - and I don't mean in a SJW way. Take for example the ending discussion at the Council - that was bad, while they succeed in making a Dolly Parton lyric work, and work incredibly well earlier in the show, the fact that Mercer would be allowed to say what he did in such a public place, the fact that the proposed solution would just be utter in a public siting or the council and not during a private meeting.That's not how democracy works. And it's sad because this latest episode was probably the strongest episode the show has had thus far.

Now, as to way I think this will be canceled... well, it's good, and it's only gotten better, but it's still not Star Trek The Next Generation. As much maligned as Early TNG might be, by this time in TNG we had already seen Elementary dear Data and Measure of a Man. This is the closest the Orville has gotten to that TNG goodness thus far, a "politically correct" episode that will be more or less universally loved, but one that is deeply flawed. Letting us with many unanswered questions that are right on the verse of becoming plot holes. The rating have been going down, the quality still hasn't hit that peek TNG highly intellectual progressives and positivism that it's going for, and FOX airing it in a manner that clearly indicates they have to faith in this. Unless McFarlane has something that is at the same level as Measure of a Man, Inner Light, Darmok, Yestarday's Enterpise or the like, something to really get the TNG fans fired up, something to make even the jaded, STD loving journalists sing praises to this show, it's going to get caned, probably at the end of this season.

Uh, did you just miss the 2 parter Identity? The two parter nearly everyone who saw it compared it to The Best of Both Worlds. Those episodes are right up there with the best of TNG & DS9. And many, people I saw had online had the same comment I did, that it had the best space battle since Sacrifice of Angels. Identity was way better than anything in the first 2 seasons of TNG.

It is very unlikely this show will be canceled. They've got toys and comic books for it on the way. They are not going to make such things for a show they plan to cancel. And MacFarlane has a long history with Fox. Unless the numbers on this show were absolutely abysmal, they would not cancel his passion project on him.

I saw it, but I didn't like it and I'm not a big fan of Best of Both Worlds. They were good episodes, but to me at least, no were near the likes of Measure of a Man or Darmok.

[Sir Will]

Taking into account this latest episode I have to say that the Orville will most likely be canceled. The first season was shown out of order and has some massive plot holes and logical inconsistencies. This second season has seen incredible qualitative improvements, mostly in the writing department. If the episode that started this whole Moklan ark was so-so, with the idiotic idea of presenting females from other species as example for why not to have the sex change, this episode upped the anti and was incredibly well written by comparisons. Unfortunately this is not a Star Trek TNG episode. It's incredibly well written for this show, but it's problematic - and I don't mean in a SJW way. Take for example the ending discussion at the Council - that was bad, while they succeed in making a Dolly Parton lyric work, and work incredibly well earlier in the show, the fact that Mercer would be allowed to say what he did in such a public place, the fact that the proposed solution would just be utter in a public siting or the council and not during a private meeting.That's not how democracy works. And it's sad because this latest episode was probably the strongest episode the show has had thus far.

Now, as to way I think this will be canceled... well, it's good, and it's only gotten better, but it's still not Star Trek The Next Generation. As much maligned as Early TNG might be, by this time in TNG we had already seen Elementary dear Data and Measure of a Man. This is the closest the Orville has gotten to that TNG goodness thus far, a "politically correct" episode that will be more or less universally loved, but one that is deeply flawed. Letting us with many unanswered questions that are right on the verse of becoming plot holes. The rating have been going down, the quality still hasn't hit that peek TNG highly intellectual progressives and positivism that it's going for, and FOX airing it in a manner that clearly indicates they have to faith in this. Unless McFarlane has something that is at the same level as Measure of a Man, Inner Light, Darmok, Yestarday's Enterpise or the like, something to really get the TNG fans fired up, something to make even the jaded, STD loving journalists sing praises to this show, it's going to get caned, probably at the end of this season.

1) Looking at production codes, episode 2 was moved to be episode 4. Episode 12 was moved to season 2 but added to to make it work in its new spot. And I don't know if the order was Fox's doing or theirs. That's not that bad. And what huge plot holes and inconsistencies?

2) what did Mercer say that you have a problem with?

3) plot hole again. What are you talking about? The verge of being a plot hole?

4) yes the ratings are an issue. We can agree on that at least.

5) the airing... one of the weekly breaks was claimed to be to touch up the episode. One was for a special. And this 2 week hiatus was for March Madness and a ton of shows went on hiatus. Fox is not out to get the show.

6) I think Darmok is overrated myself.

7) many critics already turned around on the show and liked season 2

[LavarosVA]

I think it's likely to get a third season in the very least, and if it's ratings don't improve by then, it'll probably get canned.

[AlucardNoir]

1) Looking at production codes, episode 2 was moved to be episode 4. Episode 12 was moved to season 2 but added to to make it work in its new spot. And I don't know if the order was Fox's doing or theirs. That's not that bad. And what huge plot holes and inconsistencies?

2) what did Mercer say that you have a problem with?

3) plot hole again. What are you talking about? The verge of being a plot hole?

4) yes the ratings are an issue. We can agree on that at least.

5) the airing... one of the weekly breaks was claimed to be to touch up the episode. One was for a special. And this 2 week hiatus was for March Madness and a ton of shows went on hiatus. Fox is not out to get the show.

6) I think Darmok is overrated myself.

7) many critics already turned around on the show and liked season 2

1- In the original episode we discover this strange Moclan woman relatively easy and she never, not once offers to help remove the girl or say anything about this "resistance"? In the latest episode she has suddenly made the journey off Planet several times? Wait, wasn't she a hermit that lived in the wilderness, in isolation, at the edge of society? And now this group has been in existence for how long again? Also, the change of the episodes order during seasons one resulted in several story inconsistencies during the first few episodes.

2 - What did Mercer say that I have a problem with? nothing, my problem is with when he said it and how. Towards the end he throws a passive aggressive jab at the Moclan delegation, the one about them remaining a single sex species if the female colony stays undiscovered - that's all nice and all but that was neither the place, nor the way that line should have been delivered. The way MacFarlane delivers it, it just makes it looks stilted and bad. That entire line should have either been delivered in private - earlier - putting the idea in the minds of the Moclans and making them amenable to the Admirals proposal, or in rage in public. The way it was delivered it just looked like Mercer was badly acting. Mercer, not MacFarlane and there's nothing in the episode to suggest that.

3- Again, the episode has many unanswered questions that as they are, stand at the verge or being plot holes - depending on how the show will answer them. Less then 10000 female moclans mean very little if the total population is in the billions or larger. If there are just 1 billion moclan, then for 10 000 female moclan that's a 1 in 100 000 moclan that are born female. It might not be as "bad" as one in a few generation but that's still a statistically insignificant blip. If the number of moclan is above one billion and the number of female moclan isn't all that larger the odds only get worse. Such a low number unfortunately doesn't make the "women are born once every few generations" thing that big of a lie, merely an exaggeration of how rare they truly are. The problem will be exacerbated if it is revealed female moclans aren't all that rare... Overall, it's almost like the Moclan were thought of as a joke and now that they're being fleshed out the stupidity of the situation is starting to show it's ugly head.

4/5 - If you think the show going on hiatus three times during a 14 episode season won't effect it's rating negatively I don't know what to tell you. There's one thing to have a mid season break, but the show going on hiatus this often isn't good for it's ratings.

6 - Darmok was partially written by Joe Menosky, a producer for The Orville and writer of the episode we are discussing.

7 - The same critics that couldn't understand the first seasons and who were praising STD? I'll wait and let history and their own actions be the judge of that. AT the moment it just seems like a desperate course correction on their part since their readers didn't agree with them.

[Sir Will]

1) did it say how long it was in existence? And while she may be a leader now she didn't necessarily start it. She could have been recruited after she was made public.

2) I don't think Mercer raging would have improved the scene. I thought his contempt was clear enough myself. It wasn't the most diplomatic thing to do but it fit the character to me.

3) what is the 10000 figure from? The colony doesn't represent all the females of the species.

"Such a low number unfortunately doesn't make the "women are born once every few generations" thing that big of a lie"

BS it doesn't. It's an extreme exaggeration that's as good as a lie.

6) ok? Power to you for liking it. I just don't care for it much personally.

7) yes, in many ways it does, which is why I don't care what they think. But some might and the turnaround is still welcome. You brought them up and I'm saying they're already singing praises for some episodes, especially the 2 parter.

[TGLS]

Am I the only one who thought it was a little weird that the entire decision making process for the Humans was in the hands of the Admiralty? Not even lip service to the idea that there was a civilian government on Earth?

[Yukaphile]

That's how it seems to go on Trek, so not surprised.

[Deledrius]

I know why. In UK museums important stuff is in glass cases and you are only allowed to touch copies and fakes. USA paradigm of Museum is Noah's Ark, you are allowed to touch ALL the artefacts because ALL the artefacts are fake.

What? That's not how (real) museums are here in the USA at all...