Fun fact about prisons and voting

[AlucardNoir]

This is one argument I never understood, especially not in the case of the US where you don't just vote on your legislative representatives and the head of the executive but also on judges, prosecutors and even law enforcement.

These people are behind bars because they arguably broke the law. Now, you are going to allow them, before they served their time as it were, to vote on the next generation of law makers? on the next head of the executive that is supposed to put the law into effect? on the next generation of judges, prosecutors and in some cases even law enforcement officers?

[Madner Kami]

Have you ever gotten a parking fine? A ticket for speeding? When did you jaywalk the last time? You still get to vote on your judges, police and politicians, don't you?

[AlucardNoir]

Well, no, no I don't. I don't live in the US, here we only vote on a select few lawmakers, the head of state and a few local politicians. But there is a problem with your argument nonetheless. Namely, the fact that the men and women we are talking about are in prison. I don't know about you but where I'm from there is a "slight" difference between an administrative fine and a criminal/penal act that has jail time associated with it. Usually a murderer doesn't get the same treatment as someone that jaywalks, but they, that might just be a European thing.

Also, again, here in Europe, people that go to jail for white collar crimes have interdiction on practising whatever job they were doing before that got put away. And politician that go to jail for acts done as a result of their political position have interdiction on ever occupations such a position again — basically they can't stand for election for any elected position ever again.

We aren't talking about people that jaywalk and get a fine, we are talking about people that the people you voted for think should be in prison. I get it if you think they should have their voting rights restored once they serve their time (but even here there more then a little gray as far as I'm concerned). What I don't get is why you think they should have any say on the laws of the country and the people running said country while they are still serving time for breaking said laws.

This isn't some fascist argument of gaining the right to vote. They presumably got that right when they turned 18. This is all about them having violated the social contract in such a manner as to have society deem them so dangerous that they need to be removed temporarily from it. Frankly, in some cases I don't think the right to vote should ever be restored. Someone that stole a loaf a bred ala Valjean and someone who robbed half a dozen gas stations at gun point aren't really in the same league. The same way someone who embezzled millions and ruined the lives of hundreds or thousands isn't in the same league as an accountant that misplaced a comma.

The way I see it, if someone is deprived of their liberty because of their own action as a result of violating the law, they shouldn't have the right to vote on having that law changed, at least no while they are still paying for violating it in the first place. If you think the law that put them there is too broad or to strict or outright immoral, well, you live in a democracy, see if you can actually find enough people that care and think the same way you do to actually change it.

[BridgeConsoleMasher]

I don't think they should be barred from voting, but that's a lousy argument right there .

Felons voting increases the number of voters who think PC culture is bs.

Come on, all my gangstas...

But that's an even worse argument.

[Karha of Honor]

I don't think they should be barred from voting, but that's a lousy argument right there .

Felons voting increases the number of voters who think PC culture is bs.

Come on, all my gangstas...

But that's an even worse argument.

Was i arguing for it in this thread?

[BridgeConsoleMasher]

yeah

[Karha of Honor]

yeah

It was a simple warning...

[Darth Wedgius]

Control over who is imprisoned does help people concentrate representation. I suspect (on the basis of no facts at all) that the run of the mill gerrymandering does the same thing a lot easier, but still it is a loophole. We could close that loophole by not counting felons as represented at all.

I'm fine with felons being disenfranchised because it's a way to hinder the influence of some of the worst people we unfortunately have as fellow citizens.

[Fuzzy Necromancer]

The saying goes "The best possible district is a county with nothing in it but a huge prison and your house."