You completely ignored what I said about reasonable self defence. No you WON'T get in trouble if the situation warrants you using something to hand. And running away is in fact the safest way to defend yourself. What are you not getting, pilgrim?Admiral X wrote: ↑Sat Jun 15, 2019 3:42 pmHell, not even just a gun - any kind of a weapon outside of your fists. If pepper spray counts as a firearm over there, that's ridiculous. Or if you'd get in trouble for using anything that happened to be handy as a weapon to defend yourself? Or the fact you're required to try running away?BridgeConsoleMasher wrote: ↑Sat Jun 15, 2019 10:11 am Admiral X didn't say anything about total security for public spaces. Just that it's better to have a gun when someone threatens physical harm against you.
British government now issuing blunt knives...
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@Admiral X I never claimed that. Don't put words in my mouth. But we do tend to idolize and romanticize vigilante justice here, perhaps to an insane degree. It's in our roots. Hell, this is the country that not only created a vigilante superhero, but then made that superhero a strong rival to Superman! Yeah. Should tell you all you need to know about us. Vigilante justice, imo, should only be necessary when all avenues of justice have failed. As simple as that.
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@BridgeConsoleMasher That problem here is that you literally cannot account for every possible scenario that could crop up. And you gotta balance people's "right" to a firearm (privilege, more like) to their right not to be terrorized just by the sight of those mass-murder weapons. Give him credit, he wants concealed carry, probably everywhere, but I'm not certain. But some extreme hard-liners want open-carry everywhere. Even into hospitals and schools. I know, I've met them. How does that make us a more free society? We just get more scared, expected more violence, and embrace hate and murder more.
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Nobody really can account for every possible scenario that could crop up. That's not a serviceable argument most of the time though. Again, what he said pertained to personal defense, and collective policy addressing public security applies tangentially to the construct of 2nd Amendment Gun rights for the individual.Yukaphile wrote: ↑Sat Jun 15, 2019 8:22 pm @BridgeConsoleMasher That problem here is that you literally cannot account for every possible scenario that could crop up. And you gotta balance people's "right" to a firearm (privilege, more like) to their right not to be terrorized just by the sight of those mass-murder weapons. Give him credit, he wants concealed carry, probably everywhere, but I'm not certain. But some extreme hard-liners want open-carry everywhere. Even into hospitals and schools. I know, I've met them. How does that make us a more free society? We just get more scared, expected more violence, and embrace hate and murder more.
I don't think even the Democrats are trying to pry guns from each and every "person's" hands when they talk about public safety. Speculation of their ulterior motives aside, they talk about limiting distribution, and their rhetoric doesn't involve stopping people from defending themselves.
As far as what we're talking about here, clearspira is talking on a broad basis of 2nd Amendment rights in comparison to his homeland of Great Britain where everything's a bit more monolithic. When you're talking about policy you have to account for both impact on collective as well as individuals.
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I do think we've reached a point where mass shootings are so inevitable, I want an assault weapons ban. Barring Columbine, it worked well from the mid 1990s to the mid 2000s. And then that idiot Bush let it expire.
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Right. These are noble concerns imo that seem to be a one-sided discussion unless you count "blaming the parents and video games" as an appropriate centerpiece for addressing the problem.
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I don't blame video games. Parents maybe. Also our gun culture and gun mindset and our gun laws.
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Re: British government now issuing blunt knives...
I find idea that regular people need assault rifles to be stupid. While there are lot of problems (including mental health related) that are root of problems in USA having free access to assault rifles has only made things worse. All because of NRA propaganda and lobbyists want to make sure that gun manufacturers can keep making profit in expense of human lives. It's so bad that there might not be anyway to fix this anymore.
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Well the topic mind you is what formal measures to take in addressing the issue of gun violence as it's manifested through public shootings.
And it's worth noting that not only angsty teens have been part of this phenomenon.
edit: or off-topic I should clarify
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I don't think there is any way to fix America now because there are too many guns. In Britain we managed it because all we were doing is taking away a few shotguns and pistols. Your country is too saturated with guns now.Mecha82 wrote: ↑Sat Jun 15, 2019 9:56 pm I find idea that regular people need assault rifles to be stupid. While there are lot of problems (including mental health related) that are root of problems in USA having free access to assault rifles has only made things worse. All because of NRA propaganda and lobbyists want to make sure that gun manufacturers can keep making profit in expense of human lives. It's so bad that there might not be anyway to fix this anymore.
And you're right, this has nothing to do with ''the right to own a gun'' and everything to do with money. If only a handful of Americans owned guns does anyone honestly think the NRA would have anywhere near as much power?