DIS - Brother

[Beastro]

Really feels like the writers are too busy trying to push their own insights and morals at the expense of the show. If you wanna do that then write your own damn IP I say. Stop stuffing square pegs into round holes all the damn time.

This is the increasing trouble with a lot of movies and shows this decade, though I admit I can't speak about STD as I've never watched it and have be reluctant to even peek at Chuck's videos of it beyond the first few he made and watching most of the first episode myself.

It remind me of the quote "War's much too important a matter to be left in the hands of generals". With a work of fiction, that then becomes that the story, the themes, everything cannot cannot be allowed to speak on its own, the points must be made clear for all to see.

While there are political leanings to read into it, I think the main driver for it is a decline in the quality of writers and producers that aren't competent or experienced to be subtle. The political angle might not help however much it effects the show in the same way "Very Special Episodes" were infamous, lecturing shit.

Regardless of whether there's something to what I'm thinking, one thing I'm certain of is subtly is practically dead in tv and movies now and much of what stands out these days are those works that capture it even semi-competently.

A good example given it's length and impact on the decade is Game of Thrones and how it declined the further it got away from the source material (itself revealing how much Martin's work and influence impacted the show and covered the producers incompetence).

Regarding the sneeze, the Saurian crew member is meant to be a slight gag on the openness of the Federation and Starfleet. The Saurian is meant to pretty much be a reptile monster looking guy, and everyone just says excuse me politely as they shuffle by him into the turbolift. Michael asks how he is doing, and he makes a rasping sound similar to Bossk in Empire Strikes Back. Michael then nods in concern, saying that whatever the guy is sick with had been going around. He then turns and sneezes so as to not sneeze on Michael, hitting not-Spock on accident. Not-Spock even says bless you right after.

It's showing the IDIC of the Federation, where they just treat him like another guy in the elevator, as opposed to the fear and apprehension most would have for sharing a small room with a giant reptile in another work. More of a return to form of how they don't blink at what we'd consider strange today.

Sounds to me like they are saying: ''if you point out that he sneezed on you, you're a racist.''

Actually, y'know what, that would stick well with modern liberalism. Carry on.

You are clearly reading too much into that.

That too would be keep with modern times~

[TGLS]

Fair reminder that Harry Mudd, even when we first met him, for all his quirks, was still a human trafficker. We have to admit he's a bit more than 'harmless scoundrel' when we honestly look at the character. Though, homicidal maniac is not what I wanted to see in the character.

Well, to be fair, he received psychiatric treatment between Discovery and TOS, and the stress of repeating the same events for several times may have gotten to him

[Salamon2]

Let me preface my comment by saying I grew up watching TOS, TNG, DS9 and the first part of VOY before losing interest part-way. My Dad was a Trekkie of the TOS era who kept coming back. He didn't mind Discovery when I showed it to him, and he agreed he liked Season 2 more than Season 1, but he had two series of them all that he loved most of all: TOS and DS9. One of the issues I recall he had with Season 1 of Discovery for instance is that they made Harry Mudd too mean-spirited for his tastes--though he did agree that the Short Trek featuring him was a nice addition to the character finally being done correctly.

I enjoyed Season 2 for the large part and think it an improvement on Season 1. Season 1 was something I watched because I wanted to watch a Star Trek show once again, but I had issues with how the show got to its ending and how it started its story. I agree with Chuck that we should have started not with The Vulcan Hello, but with the third episode, and had the first 2 be a 2 part flashback episode told later in the season. And lastly, Season 1 needed more time to wrap everything up once they were done with the Mirror Universe subplot. And then there were just tonal misfires. Like Michael saying she looks around her on Q'onos and sees people living their lives, but she says this in the middle of the Klingon version of Las Vegas, when tonally it needed to be said more in the setting of a Junior Batlef tournament or something along those lines. Season 1 tried to do a lot of new things, that I'll give it, but at the same time, it didn't know where to put the heart of the show, or even how to get it to pump blood. There was a lot of potential but the limited number of episodes constrained it, and making it all about Michael made the show have issues.

Season 2 tries to course correct as much as possible while still carrying the baggage from the previous season. Honestly what made me like Season 2 more than Season 1 was little things sprinkled here and there. Arguably the second episode, New Eden, is the most Star Trek-ie episode of all the episodes in Discovery, and I saw that as a good sign for what was to come in the rest of the season at the time of airing. Some of the remainder of the season lived up to some excitement I got, others didn't. So overall I'd say that Season 2 was a mixed bag, overall better than bad, but not yet living up to its potential. Some of the little things that I loved was Linus (minus his sneezing scene, he was a nice alien species to add to the show), I loved Pike from the get-go and I liked how the show contrasted Lorca's leadership style with Pike's leadership style with the furniture they fill their briefing room up with (or don't). Pike's story in this season was arguably the best and it adds to what we saw in TOS in a nice complementary fashion. Georgiou and Ash work well together, specifically when they get over themselves and banter as they try to get something accomplished. And you can tell the actors were having fun with that small interplay between them. It's a pity we only get to see a tiny bit of their snarky co-working relationship go into action once, as that actually made me go: if this is the basis for the Section 31 show (Georgiou and Ash being snarky as they do secret missions), I'd watch it. Alas that was but a brief shining moment in the season, and Ash went back to being emo and Georgiou being the Good Nazi Mama Bear. Pity. Tilly was fine, not great, not bad, just fine. Though I do like her roommate relationship with Michael that they've developed. Spock and Michael worked out better the further along it went, though admittedly it was rough going early on. I liked seeing Saru's home world both in the short trek and the regular season. I liked the Discovery interpretation of the original TOS bridge, it felt like a nice update on the TOS style. I liked that we got to see more of the bridge crew and their lives. Tig Notaro was a ball, and I really wish we'd gotten to see more of her this season--especially the relationship she and Rapp had. It was great to get a stronger idea of Number One's capabilities. I would've loved to have gotten Majel's reaction to the character's development.

Season 2 tried to have fun, and that's something that's always been a part of Star Trek, and what I really missed from Season 1 of Discovery, no one was really having fun. Season 2 I felt that there was more fun to be had. Yes Star Trek makes serious points, it has great morality tales and explorations of topics, but it also knows how to have fun while doing so. And that's what really attracts me to the franchise overall. The Orville is an example when too much fun is to be had that nothing serious ever seems to get done. I've stopped and started that show several times and can't get into it.

What I didn't like: Discovery in the Spore Universe... I felt you could cut those episodes out and lose almost nothing. Georgiou being the obvious punchline for bad jokes and her tendency to chew on the scenery like it was the witch's cottage from Hansel and Gretel. Leland--the character had potential, until he got fridged. Discovery is Top Secret AF so no one ever talk about it being an obvious hand wave answer. Ash being emo.

Side note: Honestly I like Ash Tyler as one of my favorite characters from Season 1. And I grew to really like Voq because of it, as the undercurrent to their shared character is that they're a young idealist, trying to make the "world" better as they each see it. And that's something that really drew me to the character in Season 1 and seeing him become the victim of his own idealism really was a strong story for the character. Unfortunately they don't really do much with him in this season, largely I think because they don't have anywhere for the character to grow and develop. More's the pity for my favorite character from Season 1.

I didn't mind the overall villain of the series, it's a combination of Nomad, M-5, and V-ger.

[Deledrius]

I do got to asked, is having star trek only on a streaming service wise?

Plenty of popular shows are only on streaming services these days, and Trek has become a part of that.

A troubling and unfortunate trend, and precisely what is expected to happen.

What I didn't like: Discovery in the Spore Universe... I felt you could cut those episodes out and lose almost nothing. Georgiou being the obvious punchline for bad jokes and her tendency to chew on the scenery like it was the witch's cottage from Hansel and Gretel. Leland--the character had potential, until he got fridged. Discovery is Top Secret AF so no one ever talk about it being an obvious hand wave answer. Ash being emo.

I agree with those except the spore arc, but even then only partially on that one. I get the distinct impression that storyline was going somewhere, until the massive gear shift that happened immediately after when all the plots changed. In the show we got, it was pointless (so I agree there), but I don't think it was intended to be at the time it was written (and possibly aired). There was dialog exploring the notion that the spore drive had drawbacks, and all of that was forgotten for the rest of the season and it just became a Better-Than-Warp drive with no consequences or cost. The fact that Po's world had a solution for Dilithium shortages which makes the pros of the Spore drive less important, and seeing the universe-environmental impact of the spore drive first-hand increasing the cons, both contributed to a conclusion that the spore drive would be both unsustainable and too costly with only the distance benefit remaining.

Instead, we got "let's not speak of this", which is the writer equivalent of turning in a blank homework assignment. It's disappointing when the previous team, despite other issues, were clearly trying to fix that mistake in the show's premise by doing the actual work to get there.

[Worffan101]

As someone who vitriolically hates this regressive, fake-liberal piece of trash neocon wank fantasy show, and its even more dumbed-down brainless mess of a second season, I like how Chuck is having trouble hiding his dislike.

[clearspira]

As someone who vitriolically hates this regressive, fake-liberal piece of trash neocon wank fantasy show, and its even more dumbed-down brainless mess of a second season, I like how Chuck is having trouble hiding his dislike.

Is he hiding it though? No one can accuse Chuck of not being candid. If he hates something he will tell you, often with great venom. I think he believes the show to be a mixed bag with Michael being the biggest mistake. He certainly does not care about canon changes and he has made that clear several times before - he only cares when it makes another story bullshit by association, for example beaming through shields.

[Worffan101]

As someone who vitriolically hates this regressive, fake-liberal piece of trash neocon wank fantasy show, and its even more dumbed-down brainless mess of a second season, I like how Chuck is having trouble hiding his dislike.

Is he hiding it though? No one can accuse Chuck of not being candid. If he hates something he will tell you, often with great venom. I think he believes the show to be a mixed bag with Michael being the biggest mistake. He certainly does not care about canon changes and he has made that clear several times before - he only cares when it makes another story bullshit by association, for example beaming through shields.

He's clearly been trying to avoid his usual harsh judgement until he's seen the whole show, up to and including not giving the episodes number ratings. Which is good IMO, but it's also satisfying to see some of the frustration at the idiocy of Michael being Spock's sister come through.

[RobbyB1982]

Well he CAN'T give the show ratings in this case, since its still ongoing and scores are relative to their own series. When he started doing DS9 reviews most of those episodes scored 7's and 8's, and then he realized he was grading it on the Voyager scale and had to pull them back down.

He doesn't have the context of all of Discovery yet. He doesn't know what the best or the worst episodes or how they all compare, so how could he possibly score them fairly against each other?

[CharlesPhipps]

I think Season 2 was a big improvement over Season 1.

[Admiral X]

It's one of the dumbest shows of 2019. Trek has fallen to a new low.